A Disquiet In The Queen Of All Nations With Abhijit Sengupta

In this episode of The Literary City, we embark on a journey with two distinguished guests—each bringing a unique perspective to our exploration of literature and language.

Abhay K, a poet-diplomat, and the author of "Celestial," a poetic masterpiece comprising 100 couplets that intricately weave the enchanting tales of the 88 constellations in our galaxy. Abhay's journey into the realm of poetry was sparked by a mesmerising night beneath the southern skies during his tenure as the Indian ambassador to Madagascar. His book "Celestial" stands as a testament to the wondrous inspiration found in the cosmos, beautifully complemented by illustrations from the renowned 10th-century Persian astronomer, Abd al-Rahman al-Sufi, known as Azophi in the West. Through his return to our show, we anticipate delving deeper into the celestial wonders that continue to captivate both poet and audience alike.

Later in the popular segment WHAT'S THAT WORD—with co-host Pranati  “P with an A” Madhav—we are joined by Karthik Venkatesh, an Executive Editor at Penguin and the author of the enlightening book "10 Indian Languages And How They Came To Be." Karthik's book is a trove of knowledge, with each page resembling a rich chapter brimming with insights into the origins and evolution of Indian languages. What strikes me the most about Karthik's work is the depth of research—evident from years of accumulated knowledge and experience. As an editor himself, Karthik has skillfully distilled this wealth of information into a concise yet impactful narrative, shedding light on languages both familiar and obscure to India. 

This is an action-packed and intellectually stimulating episode of The Literary City.

ABOUT ABHAY K
Abhay K. is a poet-diplomat, translator, and author of several poetry collections. His poems have appeared in over a hundred literary magazines. His “Earth Anthem” has been translated into over 150 languages. He received the SAARC Literary Award and was invited to record his poems at the Library of Congress, Washington, D.C., in 2018. His translations of Kalidasa’s Meghaduta and Ritusamhara from Sanskrit won him the KLF Poetry Book of the Year Award.

ABOUT KARTHIK VENKATESH
Karthik Venkatesh grew up in Bangalore, speaking Tamil, Malayalam, Kannada, English, Dakhani and Hindi. He tried to learn French but failed. He did learn Punjabi though. Once an MBA, he later studied education and taught English and History in a school. He now edits for a living and writes whenever the fancy strikes him. Karthik lives in Bangalore. On weekday mornings, he often runs. On weekends, he naps.

Buy Celestial: https://amzn.to/49Ba6iu

Buy 10 Indian Languages: https://amzn.to/3Tlg6Gt

The similarities between Brahui in Pakistan and Tamil: https://youtu.be/97pwj5AslIw?si=YO52pQEvuu9f0-9i

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati Madhav "Pea" joins Ramjee Chandran in the fun etymology segment, "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!" where they discuss the word “PATOIS”.

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My guest today is a titan of Indian history, Ramachandra Guha.

He is known for his monumental works on Gandhi and Indian history, but today we're taking a detour into the realm of literature.

We'll be diving into his latest book, "The Cooking Of Books," a slice-of-life memoir that offers a poignant glimpse into his relationship with his first editor, Rukun Advani. It also offers us a look into Ram's literary side and the bonds that have shaped his writing journey.

My first encounter with Ram Guha’s writing—and I have probably read every book he has written, other than his books on cricket—was what could have been the start of his own intellectual odyssey, "Savaging the Civilized". I was carrying a freshly purchased copy of it into our favourite cafe in Bangalore, Koshy’s, and Ram jabbed approvingly at it.

That book captures him, beyond his geographical roots and into a profound intellectual depth—a passion for colonial critiques, insightful biographies, and an unwavering commitment to social justice.

It is refreshing not to have to interview Ram Guha about Gandhi, or any other history, sociology or politics but rather about his prodigious output— in books, columns in newspapers and publications—and what must constitute a lifetime of learning.
And it begs the question: what drives him as a historian? Is it the solitary pursuit of knowledge, the quiet contemplation he once described as "staring out of the window with a blank piece of paper in front of him"?

This ethic is wonderfully captured in his latest book, "The Cooking Of Books". The title hints at the profound collaboration in editing a manuscript, a process he celebrates through his long-standing association with Rukun Advani.

And now to the conversation.

ABOUT RAMACHANDRA GUHA
Ramachandra Guha is a distinguished historian and author of several acclaimed books, including "India After Gandhi" and "The Unquiet Woods." He has received numerous awards, including the Leopold-Hidy Prize and the Fukuoka Prize for contributions to Asian culture. Currently a Distinguished University Professor at Krea University, Guha's intellectual breadth spans environmental history, biographies, and socio-political commentary.

Buy The Cooking of Books: A Literary Memoir here: https://amzn.to/42N3afA

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in the fun etymology segment, "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!" where they discuss the word “HISTORY”.

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My guest today, is an author from Turkiye, Firat Sunel. He is a career diplomat. He is currently the Turkish Ambassador to India.

Firat is a demonstrably fascinating novelist. His latest novel, “The Lighthouse Family”, is a wonderful example of storytelling, of craft and of everything literary. I venture to say without qualification that it is one of the best novels I have read in recent years.

Because this novel embraces a universally-resonant human sentiment, it makes it relatable across cultures, to anyone anywhere, even if the story it tells is set deep in rural Turkiye.

We'll delve into the unique blend of ethnic authenticity and international appeal that characterizes contemporary Turkish literature, tracing its evolution from folk tales to modern intellectual prose. From the reforms of Kamal Atatürk to the global recognition spurred by Orhan Pamuk's Nobel Prize, Turkish literature has garnered increasing attention on the world stage.

Firat Sunel is a product of the rich Turkish literary heritage.

I had the opportunity of a conversation with him (together with the Lithuanian Ambassador Diana Mickevičienė) live at the Bangalore Literature Festival; and today I have the privilege of having him as my guest here—another conversation I am eager to have.

To that end, joining me from his home in New Delhi is the Ambassador to India from Turkiye, Firat Sunel.

Buy THE LIGHTHOUSE FAMILY: https://amzn.to/47NB3hh

ABOUT FIRAT SUNEL

Turkish diplomat, lawyer, scriptwriter, and author he studied law at Istanbul University and did his postgraduate at Bochum ruhr university in Germany. As a diplomat, he served in several countries and is now in New Delhi as Turkiye’s ambassador to India

His novels include Salkım Söğütlerin Gölgesinde [In the Shade of the Weeping Willows, 2011] which inspired a tV series called Büyük Sürgün Kafkasya [The Great Exile Caucasia], İzmirli [Izmirli, My Last Love, 2015] and Sarpıncık Feneri [The Lighthouse Family, 2020].

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!

Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in the fun etymology segment, "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!" where they discuss the word “DIPLOMAT”.

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You know how some people just seem to have that star quality? Winston Churchill, he was one of those. No matter how many books, documentaries you may have imbibed—or, speaking of imbibed, tales you may have heard of his brandy-infused mornings, there's always an insatiable appetite for more and more Churchill.

His wit, his wisdom, and yes, even his lack of a filter in his shock-jock pronouncements—all adds up to a mystique, often a respect, that even the former colonies do not deny. Maybe the respect comes from his sense of personal conviction and his uncompromising dedication as a patriot. And not the least because he is credited with defeating Adolf Hitler.

Churchill's desire not to let India go seemingly bordered on obsession. Even when he wasn't steering the ship in India he was always with one eye on the country that made the Empire, well, the empire.

Today, to guide me through understanding Churchill and India, I have the privilege of talking to my guest—renowned historian and author, Walter Reid—whose new book, Fighting Retreat, unravels the layers of Churchill's impact on the Indian subcontinent.

From Churchill’s privileged though unconventional background, through the many accusations against him for being a racist and being cold-hearted, there’s also his apparent compassion for the underdog. As an example, his support for the Dalit cause.

In 1917, The Montagu Declaration marked a turning point in British ownership of India. The Irwin Declaration of 1929 tried to paper over its deficiencies. And then as one thing led to another in the 30 eventful years between 1917-1947, between Montagu-Chelmsford and independence, Churchill stoutly opposed any countenance of an India independent of the Empire.

He once spoke of the three factions—of Hindus, princely states, and Muslims—being the metaphorical "three-legged stool" upon which Britain sat indefinitely.

Was this divide and rule? Or was this good administrative strategy?  How did it all pan out? I cannot wait to ask Walter Reid and to delve into the intricate relationship between the icon Winston Churchill and the complex tapestry of India.

Buy Fighting Retreat: https://amzn.to/3Rb1mHF

ABOUT WALTER REID

Walter Reid is a historian educated at the universities of Oxford and Edinburgh, a fellow of the Royal Historical Society, and the author of a number of acclaimed books on British politics and history, including Keeping the Jewel in the Crown: the British Betrayal of India and most recently Neville Chamberlain: The Passionate Radical. He raises sheep and cattle in Scotland and grows olives in France. He is married to Janet Reid, a journalist, and has two adult daughters.

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!

Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in the fun etymology segment, "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!" where they discuss the word “QUISLING” and Churchill’s wit.

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In what is meant to be his quiet and reflective corridor of retirement, my guest today, Abhijit Sengupta grapples with a disquiet that lingers. A former senior IAS officer and therefore, you might say, a custodian of order and democracy, a lifetime of service to the nation has clearly left him with a profound sense of duty that refuses to retire with him.

Abhijit’s expression of angst—a visceral response to the erosion of the democratic foundations that he cherished—has resulted in his latest book, The Queen of All Nations. A response to what he sees as the foundations of democracy that are being visibly eroded with every headline and each policy shift, serving up yet another dissonant note in a score he thought he knew by heart.

It is understandably difficult for anyone to come to grips with the realisation that the ideals he held dear are slipping through the cracks of a society in a time of ideological polarisation.

So, amidst all this angst, Abhijit Sengupta becomes a reluctant activist in this shifting landscape of incipient fascism and rising fundamentalism. But he channels his efforts not as a lament for a bygone era but as something of a rallying cry for the return of ideals. With the optimism that the spirit of a plural, democratic society can endure if those who believe in it refuse to be silent witnesses to its demise.

The Queen of All Nations is more than a historical narrative. It's a call for greater awareness of history and what got us here. It is a poignant reflection on the anguish of this intellectual in a world grappling with political turmoil.

And, as a comfortable read, the book serves as a lighthouse for readers of the younger generation whom he takes on a sweeping journey through the annals of modern India, delving into the intricate political landscape, social upheavals, and cultural transformations that have shaped the nation's identity.

To discuss his book, his ethic and his state of mind, he joins from his home in Bangalore, a city we share.

Buy The Queen Of All Nations: https://amzn.to/3sDCh09
Buy A to Z: https://amzn.to/49QmM5F
Read Ramjee Chandran’s review of A to Z: https://bit.ly/3T0JWQS

ABOUT ABHIJIT SENGUPTA
Abhijit Sengupta joined the Indian Administrative Service in 1972 and retired in 2008  as Secretary, Ministry of Culture, Government of India. He has Master's degrees in Public Administration from Carleton University, Ottawa, Canada, and in English Literature from Delhi University. He received the prestigious Pearson fellowship of the IDRC, Canada in 1984-85 to study Public Administration.

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in the fun etymology segment, "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!" where they discuss the "FULL STOP."

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Music by Sergii Pavkin from Pixabay

The essence of historical fiction is telling stories set in a particular period of time. They transport us to a different place, offering insights into the past while exploring themes that are relatable across generations.

In the craft of historical fiction, authors take creative liberties with places, events, and characters, using them as foundations for their stories. Here are some noteworthy examples: "Gone with the Wind" by Margaret Mitchell, "War and Peace" by Leo Tolstoy, "The Pillars of the Earth" by Ken Follett, and “The Great Gatsby”... Fitzgerald. Among such works most discussed of course is Gabriel Garcia Marquez’s “One Hundred Years Of Solitude.”

One of the few Indian writers who have attempted a huge span of time in a novel is my guest today, Tejaswini Apte-Rahm. Her debut novel, "The Secret of More," unfolds in colonial Bombay and spans 50 years—1899 to 1952. (Another such notable  work is David Davidar’s “The House Of Blue Mangoes”—featured in my conversation with him in an earlier episode on this podcast: https://litcity.in/e41-sptfy.)

Tejaswini’s story captures the transformation of Bombay, under British rule, from a mercantile centre to a busy metropolis. And the emergence of a vibrant movie industry—starting with silent movies.

And against this intriguing backdrop, she unravels the story of a young man named Tatya, who is driven by a relentless desire for “more” success. Tatya is modelled after Tejaswini’s great-grandfather—and she crafted his character and that of early Bombay through extensive research, including the oral histories of her family.

It's easy to understand why "The Secret Of More" has captured the attention of critics like myself and many others. There's something truly compelling about this novel that draws you in and keeps you there. Managing to maintain a charged narrative across five decades is not easy, but Tejaswini does it well. Deservedly, the book just won the Tata Literature Live First Book Award For Fiction 2023, and at the time of this recording, it's shortlisted for both the JCB and the Atta Galatta awards. The JCB award winner is to be announced around the time this episode goes live.

I invited her on this podcast to get a look at her creative process. So she now joins me here.

ABOUT TEJASWINI APTE-RAHM
Tejaswini Apte-Rahm's short story collection, These Circuses That Sweep Through the Landscape, was shortlisted for two awards in 2017. She co-authored an environmental education book for children, The Poop Book!, nominated for the Jarul Book Award 2021-22 and translated into Tibetan. Her fiction has appeared in various publications. She has worked as a journalist and environmental researcher. She studied in Singapore and the UK, and has lived in Serbia, Israel, Cambodia, Thailand, Myanmar, Bangladesh, Fiji and Azerbaijan. She currently lives in Germany.

BUY THE SECRET OF MORE: https://amzn.to/40LDTBn

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in the fun etymology segment, "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!"

CONTACT US
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Music by Aleksey Chistilin from

My guest today is the remarkable Mani Shankar Aiyar. If you haven’t heard of him, let’s simply admit that you’ve been living under a rock.

If you've been anywhere near the worlds of diplomacy, politics, or literature, you will know of him in detail but let me sum up his remarkable journey as succinctly as I can.
Mani Shankar Aiyar joined the Indian Foreign Service in 1963. He then went on to become the Consul General in Karachi, Pakistan in 1978 through 1982. His path took a significant turn when he entered the Prime Minister's Office in 1985, working closely with the late Prime Minister, Rajiv Gandhi.

However, in 1989, he made a pivotal decision to leave the diplomatic arena and dive headfirst into politics. He served off and on as a Member of Parliament for the Congress Party for 25 years.

Aiyar is a diplomat and politician—a man of words with a deep well of knowledge and a vast literary appetite. His unfiltered and honest expression, which has sometimes landed him in hot water, causing his own party, the Congress Party, to distance themselves from his candid remarks.

His sense of humour is decidedly wicked and Wodehousian and he is nothing if not completely hilarious on demand. In one interview he spoke of his early Marxist leanings and being investigated by Indian intelligence for it. Of this, he said, “I think the Intelligence Bureau ultimately came to the conclusion that I was indeed a Marxist but of the Groucho variety.”

For all his education a career in the best places in administration, Aiyar remains a socialist. He believes that the real and equitable development of India can happen only ground up, from the villages. To this, the country created the Ministry Of Panchayati Raj… for him. He was its first minister.

His book, "Memoirs Of A Maverick," is a delightful read. It’s the sort of book that you can read in one sitting. And today, I am truly honored to host him again, this time on my podcast. He joins me from his home in Delhi, diplomat, politician, columnist, author, Mani Shankar Aiyar.

ABOUT MANI SHANKAR AIYAR
After Doon School and St Stephen’s College, he joined the Indian Foreign Service and served for 26 years. In 1985, Rajiv Gandhi inducted him into the Prime Minister's Office from where he migrated four years later into politics and Parliament.

Buy MEMOIRS OF A MAVERICK: https://amzn.to/3FJfsuy

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!",  where they discuss the phrase  "RAINING CATS AND DOGS*,

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In an essay, published in a 1964 edition of The Times Literary Supplement, V S Naipaul wrote:

"The language was ours, to use as we pleased. The literature that came with it was therefore of peculiar authority, but this literature was like an alien mythology. There was, for instance, Wordsworth’s notorious poem about the daffodil. A pretty little flower, no doubt; but we had never seen it. Could the poem have any meaning for us?"

He was talking about the irrelevance of English language education that was bottled in the UK and served up to the colonies. He was speaking of the sensibilities that post-colonial writers must have felt when confronted with the British literary canon as their window to a worldview.

He eloquently expressed the perplexity felt by post-colonial writers when confronted with the British literary canon, which had been transplanted to their educational systems. Naipaul's words not only encapsulated the sentiment of those writers but also laid the foundation for the genre known as post-colonial literature.

He, along with his contemporaries, emerged as the pioneering voice of post-colonial literature, paving the way for subsequent generations. Yet, even now, the weight of the British canon lingers as a defining aspect of their literary heritage.

Today, we have the privilege of introducing you to Ivy Ngeow, a remarkable Malaysian author. She embodies the spirit of this literary fusion, skillfully weaving mystery narratives with a diverse tapestry of multicultural voices. Her latest work, "The American Boyfriend," stands as a testament to her storytelling prowess. This novel traverses the landscapes of the UK and the vibrant backdrop of Florida, offering an authentic and insightful narrative that mirrors the complexities of contemporary life.

Join us as we explore the enduring influence of the British canon on post-colonial literature and delve into the remarkable literary journey of Ivy Ngeow, our first Malaysian author on The Literary City.

ABOUT IVY NGEOW
Ivy Ngeow was born and raised in Malaysia. She holds an MA in Writing from Middlesex University, where she won the 2005 Middlesex University Literary Press Prize. Her debut, Cry of the Flying Rhino (2017), was awarded the International Proverse Prize in Hong Kong. Her novels include Heart of Glass (2018), Overboard (2020) and White Crane Strikes (2022). She is the commissioning editor of the Asian Anthology New Writing series. The American Boyfriend was longlisted for the Avon x Mushers Entertainment Prize. She lives in London.

Buy THE AMERICAN BOYFRIEND: https://amzn.to/3QBJiaZ

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!",  where they discuss the phrase  "WATCHING THE PAINT DRY*

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Background music by Geoff Harvey, Pixabay and Andy Warner, Tunetank

Most of us do not colour code our threat levels. But nations do.

Following 9/11, the Homeland Security Advisory System in America in 2002 came up with the warning system that we all know and love today in our TV shows—green, blue, yellow, orange and red, depending, obviously, on the severity of the threat.
Government officials plan and practice their responses to each threat level—war games for the bureaucrats.

What if the threat was not a threat in the conventional sense of some action that the nation must defend, but the threat that comes from nothing at all? One example is say, the leader of the nation passes and the administration suddenly loses its alpha and is left rudderless and the panjandrums receive no instructions on what to do next.

Building an entire novel built upon this possibility as a foundational premise, is my guest today, a journalist, author, analyst, and commentator, and now, novelist. Aakar Patel, known for his extensive body of work in politics, culture, and political economics, has ventured into the world of fiction with his debut novel—After Messiah.

A novel is a remarkable canvas for expressing ideas, freeing the author from the constraints of traditional media like newspapers.

Newspapers, for instance, are required to simply and clearly report what happened. But sometimes as a newsperson, you get to know about things that you cannot report by the usual rules of reportage. Such as off-the-record information that might be of great importance. The edit page of the newspaper is for such things— where you might reveal or hint at something, having editorialised it.

Aakar Patel's work raises essential questions about the role of the bureaucracy and the responsibilities it bears. His superior skills in prose ensure that his novel is not just thought-provoking but also an effortless—and very often funny—read. Aakar is not one to stay snugly inside the box; he busts out the whole “eager to learn and illuminate” ethic and thus, escapes the confines of convention.

Today, he unveils this debut novel. While After Messiah might be his debut novel, this is not his debut appearance on The Literary City. He is my first returning guest in almost two years of this show. He joins me from his home in Bangalore, a city we share.

PREVIOUS APPEARANCE: https://litcity.in/e14-sptfy

ABOUT AAKAR PATEL

He is a syndicated columnist who has edited English and Gujarati newspapers. His books include "Why I Write", "Our Hindu Rashtra: What It Is. How We Got Here", "Price of the Modi Years" and "The Anarchist Cookbook". His work reimagining South Asia, "The Case For Akhand Bharat" is out in 2024. He is the Chair of Amnesty International India.

BUY AFTER MESSIAH: https://amzn.to/3Q4Xj0q

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!",  where they discuss the word  "MESSIAH"

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Good literature can help us navigate our own emotions and motivations, and it helps us see the world through the eyes of the writer. The best literature touches our hearts and our minds. It triggers our emotions, and makes us think critically about the world around us, by challenging our assumptions and consequently, expanding our understanding of what it means to be human.

Some writers write from the heart, some from the head. The truly literary among them speak from the junction of emotion and reason—and this is what makes literature powerful. It is what allows us to connect with characters and stories on a deeper level.

My guest today is an example of a writer who can write from the heart and from the head. She is novelist Anjum Hasan.

Anjum grew up in small town India, in Shillong, Meghalaya—as we imagine, an idyllic setting in which her early impressions of life and culture took root, she now lives in the urban sprawl of modern Bangalore.

And—judging from her earlier novels—she is comfortable in both skins. Anjum’s ability to traverse the two landscapes—both of small-town India and the ambition of Bangalore—is seamless. And this could be one reason why her insight is not just quick and keen, but unusual.

And this sense of the insight has led to some pretty evocative, well-crafted prose. A good example of this is her latest novel, History's Angel—a powerful and moving story about lives in a time of rising religious phobia. History’s Angel explores the protagonist Alif's challenges of navigating an increasingly incomprehensible contemporary India, where political unrest is the normal and nostalgia is the refuge. The story offers a perspective on the larger context of asserting humanity in the face of widening social fissures.

Anjum Hasan, apart from her novels, is someone I have always admired in general, for her prose. Her writing is sharp, compassionate, and darkly witty. What gets me most is her ability to craft sentences that are elegant but also accessible. I have always wanted to ask her about her prose.  So she is joining me from her family home in lovely Shillong.

ABOUT ANJUM HASAN

Anjum Hasan’s work has been shortlisted for the Sahitya Akademi Award, the Hindu Literary Prize, and the Crossword Fiction Award. She won the Valley of Words Fiction Award 2019. She has been a Homi Bhabha Fellow, a Charles Wallace Writer-in-Residence, and is currently a New India Foundation Fellow. Her essays, short stories and poems are widely published including in New York Review of Books, Granta, The Paris Review, Baffler, Los Angeles Review of Books, Wasafiri, Asia Literary Review, and Caravan. She is the co-editor of the recent anthology Future Library: Contemporary Indian Writing.

BUY HISTORY’S ANGEL: https://amzn.to/3tcUFwr

WHAT'S THAT WORD?!
Co-host Pranati "Pea" Madhav joins Ramjee Chandran in "WHAT'S THAT WORD?!",  where they discuss the word  "ALEF”

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Cover pic credit: Lekha Naidu.