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    A theory of change for climate investing [partner content]

    enMarch 08, 2023

    Podcast Summary

    • Oil industry underperforms S&P 500, faces competition from electrificationThe oil industry underperformed the S&P 500 from 2010 to 2020 and faces significant competition from electrification, particularly in the transportation sector. Long-term investors should consider the disruption this trend could bring and carefully evaluate funds' actual holdings and strategies to avoid greenwashing.

      While the oil and gas sector had a surprising comeback in 2020, historically it has underperformed the broader S&P 500 index. Looking forward, the industry faces significant competition from electrification and clean energy, particularly in the transportation sector where electric vehicles are becoming increasingly popular. For long-term investors, it's crucial to consider the disruption this trend could bring and whether holding a long position on oil is a sound investment strategy. The recent surge in oil prices and profits might be tempting, but it's essential to separate the short-term allure from the long-term outlook. As Zach Stine, co-founder and CEO of Carbon Collective, pointed out, the industry underperformed the S&P 500 from 2010 to 2020. With half of oil's customers being cars and trucks, the shift towards electric vehicles poses a significant threat to the industry's market share. Greenwashed funds, which claim to be sustainable investments but are not, can be misleading for investors. An example given in the discussion was a fund that invested heavily in oil and gas companies but marketed itself as sustainable due to its small allocation to renewable energy. It's crucial for investors to understand the nuances of sustainable investing and to carefully evaluate funds based on their actual holdings and strategies.

    • ESG frameworks can be confusing with conflicting priorities within industriesAlign investments with scientific requirement to invest in climate solutions and avoid industries that cannot exist in a post-carbon world

      The use of Environmental, Social, and Governance (ESG) frameworks for investing can be confusing due to their focus on multiple risk areas and the potential for conflicting priorities within a single industry. For instance, a fossil fuel company could have strong social metrics or good governance, which could outweigh its negative environmental impact. However, it's important to note that the continued investment in fossil fuels contradicts the scientific consensus that we need to invest $5-$9 trillion per year into climate solutions and stop expanding fossil fuel industries. To evaluate investment options, consider aligning your investments with this scientific requirement and avoid industries that cannot exist in a post-carbon world, such as oil and petrochemicals. Instead, invest in companies that contribute to climate solutions.

    • Engaging with companies in a post-carbon worldFocus on long-term investments in companies whose core businesses can exist in a carbon-neutral future. Utilities, despite high carbon emissions, are crucial for decarbonization and should be engaged with economically. Question advisors on ESG ratings and funds alignment with long-term goals and sustainable future.

      Engaging with companies whose core businesses can exist in a post-carbon world is crucial for a sustainable investment strategy. These companies, whether they have sustainability goals in place or not, form the Engageable Universe. ESG (Environmental, Social, and Governance) investing often focuses on how a company operates, but our goal is to build portfolios for long-term goals like retirement. Utilities, despite being significant carbon emitters today, are essential for decarbonization and must be engaged with economically. The recent report shows that it is now cheaper to shut down and replace coal plants with renewable energy. Therefore, it's important to question financial advisors about their justification for using specific ESG ratings and funds and how they align with a theory of change or a goal to make more money. This approach ensures that investments make sense for the long term while also contributing to a more sustainable future.

    • Investing in Climate Solutions: Morally Correct and Financially SmartFocus on companies with 50%+ revenue from climate solutions, found in plans like Project Drawdown, IEA, or Rewiring America, for sustainable investing that contributes to climate outcomes and avoids ESG's overly broad term.

      Investing in companies focused on climate solutions is not only morally correct but financially smart. To identify these companies, a minimum of 50% of their revenue must come from climate solutions. These solutions can be found in leading plans like Project Drawdown, the IEA, or Rewiring America. By focusing on this narrow type of investing, we can effectively contribute to climate outcomes while avoiding the potential drawbacks of overly broad terms like ESG. ESG was originally invented for diversifying risks, but its use has expanded beyond its original purpose. Sustainable investing, on the other hand, specifically accounts for the secular trend of climate change and builds portfolios that reflect this focus. By understanding these definitions, we can make informed decisions as shareholders and contribute to a more sustainable future.

    • Sustainable and Impact Investing: Climate Change Benefits and ConsiderationsSustainable and impact investing offer long-term benefits from climate change perspective, but potential risks and performance vary. Understand financial goals and market trends to make informed decisions.

      Sustainable investing and impact investing offer potential rewards from a climate change perspective, with sustainable funds outperforming common indices and fossil fuels over the long term. Impact investing aims to make a tangible difference in the world, while values-aligned investing allows for a customized approach. However, it's important to consider the potential short-term risks and the fact that sustainable investing may underperform or outperform the market depending on the financial goals and belief in broader secular trends. The renewable energy sector, for example, had a strong performance in 2020 but gave back some gains in the following years. Ultimately, the decision to invest sustainably or impactfully should be based on a clear understanding of one's financial goals and beliefs in the long-term trends of the market.

    • Politics and sustainable investing: A complex and evolving issuePolitical landscape surrounding ESG is uncertain, with potential financial losses for funds due to pushback, but institutional investors argue it's their duty to consider ESG risks, and future depends on how trends and debates unfold

      The intersection of politics and sustainable investing, specifically ESG, is a complex and evolving issue. While trends like the decline of battery prices and the rollout of virtual power plants offer opportunities for future investment, the political landscape surrounding ESG is uncertain. The recent pushback against ESG investing, led by the political right, could result in significant financial losses for funds, as seen in the analysis of the anti-ESG bill in Indiana. The lack of clear definition and representation for ESG has made it an easy target for criticism, with some viewing it as an imposition of values. However, institutional investors argue that it is their fiduciary duty to consider environmental, social, and governance risks. The contradictory trends in the sector, such as the success of the fossil fuel divestment movement and the continued investment in fossil fuels by oil and gas majors, add to the confusion. Ultimately, the future of sustainable investing will depend on how these trends and political debates play out.

    • Targeting businesses with capacity to adopt renewable energyFocus on companies with potential to decarbonize, generate significant environmental impact, and potentially better financial returns.

      Instead of focusing on engaging with companies that are heavily reliant on fossil fuels and asking them to change their business models, it's more effective to target those businesses that have the capacity to adopt renewable energy and electrify their fleets. By pressuring these companies to take clear decarbonization steps, we can make a significant impact on the environment while also potentially generating better financial returns. Carbon Collective plans to launch an engagement strategy this year to put this approach into action. Additionally, it's essential to develop a clear thesis and strategy around the long-term financial benefits of investing in sustainable businesses, rather than viewing it as a niche or charitable pursuit. By making this shift, we can change the narrative around sustainable investing and attract more investors who are motivated by both financial gains and environmental impact.

    • Explore Carbon Collective for sustainable investing insightsLearn about Carbon Collective's investment strategies, engage with their co-founder, and discover their approach to sustainability investing.

      If you're interested in sustainable investing, you can explore Carbon Collective as an option. This organization offers a platform where you can learn about their investment strategies, understand their approach to creating change, and even engage directly with their co-founder, James Regalinski. By visiting carboncollective.co, you'll gain insights into how they build their portfolios with a focus on sustainability. This could be a valuable resource for those looking to make a positive impact with their investments, whether at work or individually.

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    Eric Mandelblatt - Investing in the Industrial Economy - [Invest Like the Best, EP. 266]

    Eric Mandelblatt - Investing in the Industrial Economy - [Invest Like the Best, EP. 266]
    My guest today is Eric Mandelblatt, founder and CIO of Soroban Capital, a $10 billion investment firm. While many of my conversations focus on technology and emerging industries, Eric has deep roots investing in the industrial economy, which made this conversation a fun change of pace. We discuss why energy and materials represent such a small share of the market today, how the global push towards decarbonization could have massive impacts on the industrial economy moving forward, and how Eric evaluates this dynamic opportunity set. Please enjoy this deep-dive discussion with Eric Mandelblatt.   Editor’s note: This conversation was recorded on February 15, before last week's invasion of Ukraine.   For the full show notes, transcript, and links to mentioned content, check out the episode page here.   -----   Invest Like the Best is a property of Colossus, LLC. For more episodes of Invest Like the Best, visit joincolossus.com/episodes.    Past guests include Tobi Lutke, Kevin Systrom, Mike Krieger, John Collison, Kat Cole, Marc Andreessen, Matthew Ball, Bill Gurley, Anu Hariharan, Ben Thompson, and many more.   Stay up to date on all our podcasts by signing up to Colossus Weekly, our quick dive every Sunday highlighting the top business and investing concepts from our podcasts and the best of what we read that week. Sign up here.   Follow us on Twitter: @patrick_oshag | @JoinColossus   Show Notes [00:03:01] - [First question] - Soroban’s history and why Eric is qualified to discuss industrial and commodity sectors [00:04:37] - Overview of what their portfolio looks like today [00:05:49] - How much of the commodity exposed equity sectors are owned by hedge funds [00:08:03] - The key history points that makes industrials more interesting today [00:11:17] - Commodity cycles, what drives them, the role CAPEX plays and how this world works [00:17:38] - Thoughts on natural demand and the societal push towards decarbonization [00:22:32] - How deeply one needs to know commodities in order to hold them [00:23:57] - Big categories to explore as decarbonization becomes more accessible to consumers and the lack of nuclear investing [00:28:50] - The resurgence of industrial production in the US [00:32:21] - Rail networks writ large and if we can expect new ones in the future [00:36:17] - The market gap between rail and technology businesses [00:41:38] - Commodities and the ways they differ from railroads  [00:43:47] - Comparing the differences between businesses within the commodity industry [00:46:52] - Walkthrough of Alcoa’s business and how things like a carbon tax might affect an individual business [00:52:55] - What is the portfolio manifestation of the fact it's impossible to forecast commodities historically [00:56:08] - His view of the world in its current state and big things that matter [01:00:25] - Thoughts on inflation as an investor in the commodity space [01:01:42] - Utopian to dystopian takes on what growth looks like for the world [01:04:28] - Juxtaposed positions in big tech against the industrial story [01:08:45] - The kindest thing someone has ever done for him