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    Columbidology (PIGEONS? YES) Part 2 with Rosemary Mosco

    en-usApril 24, 2024

    Podcast Summary

    • Pigeons and Doves: Same Species, Different ContextsDespite common misconceptions, pigeons and doves are interchangeable terms for certain species, with the distinction based on historical and cultural contexts rather than any inherent differences.

      Despite popular belief, pigeons and doves are not distinct species, but rather, the terms are used interchangeably for certain species. The distinction between the two is not based on any inherent magical or non-magical qualities, but rather on historical and cultural contexts. For instance, when people refer to "doves" in the context of weddings or religious symbolism, they are often referring to white pigeons. The terms have been used differently based on regional preferences and traditions. So, the next time you see a white bird soaring in the sky, you might be looking at a dove or a pigeon – it's all in the perspective! And remember, pigeons deserve more recognition and appreciation for their unique qualities and contributions to our world.

    • The 'pigeon' and 'dove' terminology and their connectionThe terms 'pigeon' and 'dove' refer to the same bird species, but their usage can vary based on historical and regional contexts. Distinguishing between males and females is difficult due to their shared anatomy, necessitating DNA tests or observing behavior for identification.

      The terms "pigeon" and "dove" refer to the same type of bird, but are not scientifically distinct. The Norman Conquest introduced both words into the English language, and as English speakers encountered various species within the columbid family, they assigned common names based on their appearance. The evolutionary connection between pigeons and doves is tenuous, and it can be challenging to visually distinguish between the genders due to their shared anatomy. Both males and females possess a cloaca, a single hole for waste and reproductive functions. During mating, they press their cloacas together to exchange genetic material. As a result, determining the sex of a pigeon requires a DNA test or observing their behavior and reproductive duties. Despite these challenges, pigeons, including notable war heroes like Cher Ami, have played essential roles in history.

    • Misunderstanding the Gender of a Famous Pigeon and the Importance of Ongoing ResearchDespite our efforts to understand the natural world, there are still mysteries. A famous pigeon named Cherami was initially identified as female but later found to be male, emphasizing the importance of continuous research. Pigeons have elaborate mating rituals, mate for life, and both parents produce milk to care for their young.

      Despite our best efforts to understand the natural world, there are still mysteries that elude us. For instance, the gender of a famous war hero pigeon named Cherami, which was initially identified as female but later found to be male. This misunderstanding highlights the importance of ongoing research and the limitations of our current knowledge. Another interesting topic discussed was the mating rituals of pigeons. These elaborate behaviors include the male's "bow coo" display, where he bows and coos to attract a female. Pigeons mate for life and both parents are responsible for raising their young, which is facilitated by both producing milk. The bonding process is crucial as it allows them to work together to care for their offspring. The discussion also touched on the curiosity and fascination people have with the mating behaviors of pigeons and other animals. It's a reminder of the delight and wonder that can be found in observing the natural world. So, if you have some time, go watch your local pigeons and witness their fascinating mating rituals.

    • Unique way pigeons feed their youngPigeons produce milk in their crops and feed it to their young by regurgitation, showcasing convergent evolution in nourishing offspring.

      Pigeons, like humans, produce milk to nourish their young, but they do it in a unique way by secreting it into their crops and regurgitating it into their babies' mouths. This discovery highlights the convergent evolution of similar solutions to the challenge of providing nutrition to offspring. Pigeons also exhibit various mating strategies, from monogamy to seasonal partnerships, and their strong loyalty and defensive behavior towards their mates. The iridescence on their feathers serves as a display for mating purposes, enhancing their attractiveness. Despite the challenges they face in urban environments, pigeons' commitment to their mates and their vibrant appearance continue to fascinate us.

    • City pigeons' colors vary due to distinct bloodlines and urbanization impactCity pigeons' colors differ based on their specific regional histories and urban environments, influencing their genetic makeup and behavior.

      The colors of city pigeons are not uniform across different regions, but rather a result of the specific bloodlines that have been present in each area. This is due to the fact that pigeons don't travel far and the initial populations in each city were likely different. For example, New York pigeons have a different genetic makeup than Boston or DC pigeons. Additionally, urbanization can impact pigeon behavior, with pigeons in more densely populated areas being more likely to fly away from people. The study of feral pigeon genetics across the Northeastern Megacity found that the dividing line between Northern and Southern East Coast Pigeons is likely due to reduced urbanization across Coastal Connecticut. The study of urbanization and flight initiation distance in feral pigeons across New York City found that pigeons in cities with more people and traffic are more likely to fly away from people at closer distances. Overall, the colors and behaviors of city pigeons are shaped by their unique histories and environments.

    • Pigeons in Cultural Traditions and SurvivalDespite being overlooked, pigeons contribute to culture through traditions like weddings. They have unique adaptations to survive in different climates and come in various colorations due to complex genetics.

      Pigeons are often overlooked but play a role in various cultural traditions, such as weddings. Contrary to popular belief, pigeons are sometimes released during weddings, and they have unique adaptations to survive in different climates. The genetic makeup of pigeons results in various colorations, including those with white spots or all-white bodies. These colorations are a result of complex genetics and the descendants of fancy breeds. Pigeons are able to survive in colder climates by utilizing warm buildings and poofing up their feathers to trap warm air. So, next time you see a pigeon, appreciate its uniqueness and the role it plays in nature and culture.

    • Harming Animals for Entertainment or Gender RevealsAvoid releasing dyed or live animals for events, consider alternative methods, and respect animal welfare. Fact: Pigeons don't bob their heads, they have numerous neck bones.

      Humans sometimes harm animals, like pink-dyed pigeons, for entertainment or gender reveal parties. This practice can lead to injury and even death for the animals. For instance, a pink pigeon named Flamingo in New York City died likely from ingesting the dye while trying to clean its feathers. Instead of releasing dyed or live animals for such events, consider using alternative methods. Additionally, be aware that some animal handlers might not be available for rent, leading organizers to buy animals from markets, which can result in animals' distress or even death. So, let's treat animals with kindness and respect their well-being. Another interesting fact is that pigeons don't bob their heads; instead, they have numerous neck bones that give the illusion of head bobbing.

    • Understanding Pigeon Behavior and Debunking MythsPigeons' head bobbing is an adaptation for navigation and they're not major disease vectors, debunking common misconceptions about these birds.

      Pigeons have a unique way of moving their heads and bodies while walking, giving the illusion that they are constantly bobbing their heads. This behavior is actually an adaptation to help them navigate their environment and avoid obstacles. Additionally, the label of "rats with wings" was first used in the 1960s to describe pigeons as part of a larger issue with undesirable elements in public spaces. The myth of pigeons being major disease vectors is not entirely accurate, and the label is a disservice to both pigeons and rats. Understanding these facts can provide a new perspective on these often-misunderstood birds.

    • Pigeons are not invasive speciesHistorically, pigeons were not responsible for habitat destruction or significant problems, unlike the passenger pigeon which was hunted to extinction due to human activities.

      Despite their ubiquity in urban areas, pigeons are not invasive species and have minimal ecological impacts. Their presence is largely due to human activities and abandonment. Contrary to rats, they do not pose significant problems. Historically, the passenger pigeon, a different species, was once abundant in North America but was hunted to extinction due to human activities. Pigeons and passenger pigeons belong to the same family but have distinct differences in anatomy, behavior, and sound. The passenger pigeon's extinction was a result of habitat destruction and overhunting, with the last known individual, Martha, dying in a zoo in 1914.

    • Exploring the World of Pigeons: Loss and New BeginningsThe bond between humans and pigeons holds both sadness and potential, from the loss of the passenger pigeon to the possibility of de-extinction, and the appreciation for these birds extends beyond practical uses.

      The world of pigeons holds both the sadness of loss, as seen in the passing of Martha Pigeon and the potential for new beginnings, as explored through the Revive and Restore Project's efforts to de-extinct the passenger pigeon. The bond between people and pigeons is strong, with many expressing curiosity about various aspects of these birds, from their potential resurrection to their fashion. The tradition of pigeon whistles, particularly in Asia, showcases the beauty and harmony that can be found in the relationship between humans and pigeons. It's important to remember that while some interventions, like gluing hats onto pigeons, are not beneficial, others, like the use of whistles, can enhance their lives. The appreciation for pigeons extends beyond their practical uses, as evidenced by the donation made in memory of Vincent Mosco to Great Lakes Pigeon Rescue.

    • Pigeons Wear Pants and Protect Their FeetPigeons may wear pants to prevent indoor pooping and protect their feet from injuries. Their feet can get injured from tangled human hair and strings.

      Pigeons can wear pants to help prevent pooping indoors, and their feet can get injured from various reasons including tangled human hair. Pigeon pants are popular among pigeon owners, as some pigeons may not be easily trained to use a potty. Parrots, on the other hand, are less likely to wear pants or use a potty as they are not domesticated animals. Pigeons' feet get damaged easily due to their foraging habits, which involve a lot of walking on the ground. Human hair and strings can cause injuries to their feet. If you see a pigeon with injured feet, consider joining Facebook communities like "string foot saviors" to help rescue and rehabilitate them.

    • People's love for pigeons extends beyond practical usesPeople find value in pigeons beyond their usefulness and dedicate time to caring for them, showcasing their worth in art, entertainment, and compassion

      Despite the negative perceptions and stigma surrounding pigeons, there are compassionate individuals who dedicate their time and effort to helping and caring for them. From pigeon rescuers to trainers used in movies, these individuals show that people have a soft spot for these birds and recognize their worth. The appreciation for pigeons extends beyond their practical uses, such as message delivery, and into the realm of art and entertainment. Movies like Home Alone 2 have showcased the love for pigeons in a positive light, and there's even a pigeon movie database to explore the representation of pigeons in films. Ultimately, the care and dedication towards pigeons serve as a reminder that there is goodness in humanity and that even the seemingly insignificant creatures deserve our respect and compassion.

    • Appreciating Pigeons' Charm and HistoryThe speaker admires pigeons for their unique abilities and historical significance, advocating for their welfare and inviting listeners to explore her books on the subject.

      Fascination and appreciation for pigeons, despite the challenges of writing about their injustices and the isolation of the writing process. The speaker shares her admiration for pigeons, from their ability to produce milk to their historical significance in inspiring famous figures like Tesla. She also expresses her desire for more investment in pigeon welfare and invites listeners to explore her various books on the subject. Despite the challenges, the speaker's passion for pigeons shines through, making the experience of discussing them a delight.

    • Connecting with unexpected communitiesEngaging with strangers and their unique passions can lead to meaningful connections and new perspectives. Curiosity and openness are key to fostering these relationships.

      Engaging with people, even those we might overlook like pigeon enthusiasts, can lead to meaningful connections and new perspectives. Alie Ward, the host of Ologies podcast, shared her experience of talking to "pigeon people" and how they were eager to share their passion. She encourages listeners to approach strangers with curiosity and openness, just as she did with these pigeon lovers. Additionally, the podcast team shared updates on new merchandise, upcoming episodes, and special announcements. A secret revealed was Alie's discovery of the best pair of tweezers she's ever found, which she serendipitously found on a film set ten years ago. The team also mentioned their commitment to creating educational content, covering various scientific fields from pachydermatology to nanotechnology. Overall, the episode emphasized the importance of curiosity, connection, and the joy of learning new things.

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    From the Vault: Finn McCool, Part 2

    From the Vault: Finn McCool, Part 2

    The Irish mythological hero Finn MacCool is known for many exploits, from the slaying of a great fire monster to the creation of Giant's Causeway. However, he’s also known for his magical thumb, which he could suck on to gain knowledge. In this Stuff to Blow Your Mind two-parter, Robert and Joe consider the thumb of knowledge and its relations to other myths and even a little bit of science. (originaly published 03/17/2022)

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    How to find food in your own backyard (w/ Alexis Nikole Nelson)

    How to find food in your own backyard (w/ Alexis Nikole Nelson)

    It’s easy to forget that the packaged lettuce you bought from the store originally grew out of the ground – but it did! What if you could cut out your trips to the store – and get more food right from your own backyard? Foraging is a fantastic way to reconnect to your natural environment and Alexis Nikole Nelson is an outdoor educator, food writer, and expert forager. This week, she’ll help ignite your curiosity about the green spaces around you, even if you live in the concrete jungle.

    For the full text transcript, visit go.ted.com/BHTranscripts

    From the Vault: The Seven Day Week, Part 1

    From the Vault: The Seven Day Week, Part 1

    Our modern world is bound to the seven day week, but why is this the case? Is there anything in the cosmos or the inner workings of the human body that dictate this arrangement? In this episode of Stuff to Blow Your Mind, Robert and Joe explore the history and invention of the seven day week. (originally published 03/03/2022)

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    169. An Atheist in the Realm of Myth | Stephen Fry

    169. An Atheist in the Realm of Myth | Stephen Fry

    On this episode of the Jordan B Peterson Podcast, I am joined by Stephen Fry. Stephen Fry is a noted British actor, writer, comedian, political figure, journalist, poet, intellectual and much more. You may have seen him in the films Chariots of Fire, A Fish Called Wanda, The Life and Death of Peter Sellers, V for Vendetta, Sherlock Holmes: A Game of Shadows, and The Hobbit film series. He’s also served as the president of a mental health charity. Stephen’s list of accomplishments is far too long to list here.


    Stephen and I discussed a variety of topics in the realm of drama, literature, and politics. We also discuss among other topics, atheism, religion, rationalism, empiricism, myth/story, bartering with reality, Greek mythology, Egyptian mythology, resentment, cruelty in the world, constitutional monarchy versus a democratic republic, and much more.


    Find more of Stephen Fry on Twitter @stephenfry, his website stephenfry.com, check IMDB for his many movie and television appearances, and his many books.


    This episode was recorded on March 28th, 2021.