The Business of Open Source

Jono Bacon’s passion for building communities has been a driving force in a career taken him from Canonical to GitHub to founding the Community Leadership Core community accelerator. In this episode, Jono shares his definition of community, how a community can create a movement and the differences between the two. We also get a bit of insight into how he developed his passion for building communities and why he continues helping companies build and support theirs through the Community Leadership Core. When Jono speaks about communities he is involved with, he uses “we” instead of “I” to describe their achievements, so I had him dig into that a bit more as we explored the power dynamics that have a huge influence on the success of a community or movement. 

Highlights:

• I introduce Jono, who is the founder of Community Leadership Core (0:28)
• Jono shares more about his passion for building communities and why he started Community Leadership Core (0:51)
• Jono goes into his background, discovering how Linux was created, and finding connection to others through open source (2:47)
• Jono reflects on his time at Canonical and what he learned (10:46)
• How Jono defines and thinks about “community” (13:10)
• The difference between building a community and creating a movement (15:50)
• Using “we” vs “I” in communities to encourage collaboration (18:05)
• Where Jono sees companies missing the mark in community building (20:03)
• Jono explains what delivery looks like in the context of community (22:31)
• Jono shares examples of successful communities (27:05)
• Communities Jono enjoys participating in (28:44)
• How to start a community from scratch (31:22)
• A quick summary of the Community Leadership Core (32:40)

Links:

Jono

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jonobacon
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/jonobacon
• Company: communityleadershipcore.com

Michael Cheng is an M&A Specialist who has had an extensive career that includes a former stint at Facebook as a Product Manager and his current role as a Lawyer. In this episode, Michael returns to the show to have an in-depth discussion around acquisitions. Michael shares his thoughts on why most acquisitions leave everyone involved feeling unsatisfied, and what he thinks should be done by both parties to mitigate the high failure rate of acquisitions. We also chat about the common grievances founders have after going through an acquisition, and the approach Michael recommends to mitigate those regrets. Michael also shares insights on why it’s harder on an open-source company to be successfully acquired if they are in between being a purely services-based or SaaS company. 

Highlights:

• I introduce returning guest Michael Cheng, whose illustrious career spans roles as a Product Manager for Facebook, a Lawyer, and an M&A Specialist (00:22)
• Michael gives some background on his career history and why he’s pursued so many different roles (01:00)
• Michael and I discuss the bird’s eye view of the steps it takes to get acquired (02:23)
• Why most acquisitions fail (06:11) 
• The common grievances that sellers have after going through an acquisition (08:11)
• Michael’s thoughts on the likely outcomes for acquisitions of open-source companies (10:28)
• What open-source founders can do to favor a successful outcome when approaching an acquisition (13:32)
• How Michael thinks success should be measured when evaluating the outcome of an acquisition (17:56)
• Why looking at the open-source community of companies being acquired is so crucial and often overlooked (22:13)
• How the due diligence process is different for an open-source startup versus a SaaS company (25:20)
• Michael describes how each core function in a company is affected by an acquisition (28:12)
• The advice Michael would give to founders to help them make peace with the outcome of an acquisition (33:42)
• How you can connect with Michael to learn more (37:02)

Links:

Michael

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/priorart/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/SYOTFS
• Company: https://www.aalyria.com/

Lars Kamp is the Co-Founder and CEO of Some Engineering, the makers of Resoto. In this episode, Lars describes what he’s learned from founding and working at multiple start-ups, as well as the main differentiators he’s experienced founding his first open-source startup. Lars describes his though process when it comes to selecting co-founders, and illustrates why it’s even more important to be discerning when selecting investors. Lars and I also discuss the advantages that open-source gives to founders who are focused on the distribution strategy for their product, and Lars reveals why he is a big proponent of having docs be a part of your product-led growth strategy. Throughout our conversation, Lars’ insights create a detailed picture of what second-time founders think about and how SaaS startup experience relates to open-source business strategy.

Highlights:

• I introduce Lars, who is the CEO and Founder of Some Engineering (00:23)
• Lars describes what he does at Resoto and the user groups they work with (00:47)
• How a tweet by Jeff Barr inspired Lars and his co-founders to start working on Resoto (01:37)
• What it was like for Lars to start a company with co-founders he didn’t know very well (05:03)
• Why Lars went from working with closed-source SaaS companies to founding an open-source company (07:26)
• The main differences Lars has found between founding a SaaS startup and an open-source company (09:24)
• Lars describes the value he sees in investing in really good docs (10:44)
• Why Lars focuses more on distribution than product as a second-time founder (13:19)
• What third time founders think about and what they don’t (16:18)
• Lars’ advice to founders (18:40)
• Why Lars sees a big advantage in open-source business models, especially when it comes to distribution (20:09)
• The advice Lars would give himself if he could go back in time to the early days of Resoto(28:31)
• How to get in touch with Lars (32:23)

Links:

Lars

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/larskamp/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/l1rs
• Company: https://some.engineering/

Amanda “Robby” Robson is a Partner at Cowboy Ventures and the co-host of the Open Source Startup Podcast. In this episode, Robby shares insights on what she’s looking for in open-source founders to potentially invest in, including the importance of being able to manage both your community and your paid model simultaneously. Robby and I also discuss the importance and pitfalls of choosing a monetization strategy, as well as the dangers of having too many monetization models too soon. Throughout our conversation, Robby highlights the specific challenges that open-source founders face, and how she’s seen successful founders either avoid or overcome them.

Highlights:

• I introduce Robby, who is a Partner at Cowboy Ventures and the co-host of the Open Source Startup Podcast (00:22)
• Robby gives some insight into how she evaluates startups from an investment perspective, and the peculiarities that go into evaluating an open-source startup (00:45)
• The nuances of evaluating the market opportunity for an open-source company (05:20)
• A common mistake Robby seeks early stage founders make when evaluating their market size (08:06)
• Robby shares what she’s learned about best practices for seed-stage startups who are looking to determine their monetization strategy (10:02)
• The dangers of having too many monetization models as an early stage startup (13:22)
• Traits that Robby feels are most valuable for an open-source founder to possess (14:48)
• Robby reveals the common traps that open-source founders fall into (17:13)
• Why Robby feels that successfully monetizing an open-source company has more to do with resources than timing (19:46)
• Robby’s thoughts on whether she would ever found an open-source company and how she would approach it (21:18)
• How Robby’s thoughts have changed on whether open source projects need to intentionally become a company or vice versa (23:44)
• What it’s like to advice against the open-source business model as a venture capitalist (29:10)

Links:

Robby

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/amanda-robson-7227685b/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/amanda_robs
• Company: https://www.cowboy.vc/

Daniel Izquierdo is the Co-Founder and CEO at Bitergia, an open-source company that provides software development data and analytics. In this episode, we connect at the Open Source Summit in Bilbao to discuss how he went from working in academia to co-founding an open-source company. Throughout our conversation, Daniel shares interesting anecdotes on the unique journey he’s taken to build Bitergia, including why they haven’t focused on growing fast so much as they have focused on growing in a way that supports their employees and customers. He also shares insights into how to measure an open-source community, and the knowledge gaps that he sees in people who can’t contextualize the data they’re getting on their community. Daniel also walks us through the other open-source business models Bitergia tried before discovering what worked for them.

Highlights:

• I introduce Daniel, who is the Co-Founder and CEO at Bitergia, as he joins me at the Open Source Summit in Bilbao (00:24)
• Daniel describes the work that he does at Bitergia (00:41)
• The story of why Daniel helped to co-found Bitergia during the finalizing of his PhD (01:38)
• How Daniel and his co-founders got by as they transitioned from academia to founding an open-source company, and what the first year of running Bitergia was like (03:28)
• Daniel explains how Bitergia makes money as an open-source company (06:04)
• The main types of customers that Bitergia works with (07:50)
• The metrics that Daniel feels are critical when measuring an open-source community (08:50)
• Daniel describes the knowledge gap he observes in clients who can’t contextualize the data they get on their community (11:16)
• The story of how Bitergia tried other open-source business models before finding what worked for them (13:41)
• Why Daniel feels it is a disadvantage to have his company based in Spain (16:07)
• Daniel shares his growth philosophy for Bitergia (18:47)
• The challenges facing Daniel and his team at the moment (20:21)
• Daniel’s advice to aspiring open-source founders (21:53)
• The most interesting mistake Daniel feels he made in building Bitergia (23:57)
• Daniel shares what he feels is the main difference between starting a company with and without an open-source component (25:33)

Links:

Daniel

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/dicortazar/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/dizquierdo
• Company: https://bitergia.com/

Leszek Manicki is the Engineering Manager at Wikimedia Germany. In this episode, we connect at the Open Source Summit in Bilbao to discuss what he has learned being a part of Wikimedia movement and how that inspired his talk at the summit, How Not To Make Open Source. Throughout our conversation, Leszek describes the challenges Wikimedia has experienced in trying to get more contributors to their projects while also having a high security standard and a complex architecture. He also describes what he has learned from these challenges, and gives recommendations for other organizations to consider as they look to get more contributors to their own projects. Leszek also shares his experience representing a non-profit organization that seeks to offer free knowledge at an event that features more commercialized open-source offerings, and how he hopes this will bring about a positive socio-economic change.

Highlights:

• I introduce Leszek, who is the Engineering Manager at Wikimedia Germany as he joins me at the Open Source Summit in Bilbao (00:23)
• Leszek describes his role at Wikimedia movement and what brings him to the Open Source Summit as a speaker (00:39)
• The number one thing that Leszek believes open-source organizations shouldn’t do (03:41)
• How Wikimedia has attempted to get more external contributors to their projects and what they learned from their successes and failures there (07:17)
• Leszek describes the relationship between the creation of knowledge and the creation of software in the Wikimedia organization (12:57)
• How Leszek and his team are increasing collaboration with external sources to build software (15:43)
• Why Leszek advocates for simple architecture when you’re building a project that will seek external contributors (17:38)
• The inherent value that Leszek sees in having a community of contributors on a project (18:52)
• Leszek reflects on his experience attending the Open Source Summit and his hopes for the future (20:20)

Links:

Leszek

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leszek-manicki
• Company: https://www.wikimedia.org/
  
  

Brian Proffitt is the Senior Manager of Community Outreach at Red Hat’s OSPO. In this episode, we connect at the Open Source Summit EU to discuss how Brian uses events to drive both lead generation and community-building efforts. Throughout our conversation, Brian describes how measuring the ROI of an event can be tricky and why it’s important to look at events as a long game strategy. We also discuss why events provide some of the most valuable feedback when testing your positioning and messaging, and what can be done to increase the odds that your events are successful and produce good outcomes.

Highlights:

• I introduce Brian, who is the Senior Manager of Community Outreach at Red Hat’s OSPO as he joins me at the Open Source Summit EU (00:28)
• How Brian categorizes the different types of events he attends and hosts (01:55)
• The primary metric and objective for lead gen events, and what can be done to increase the odds that your lead gen events bear fruit (05:18)
• Why events are such a valuable part of testing your positioning and messaging (09:14)
• Brian delves into the value of community events and what the ROI for those looks like (12:50)
• The strategy Brian employs for getting the most out of community events when ROI can be difficult to measure (15:40)
• Brian shares why he feels that events are more of a long game strategy (23:24)
• The advice that Brian would give to an open-source founder or start-up that is looking to get the most out of their events strategy (25:28)
• The best ways to learn more and connect with Brian (31:34)

Links:

Brian

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianproffitt/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/TheTechScribe
• Company: https://www.redhat.com/en/blog/channel/red-hat-open-source-program-office

Kim McMahon is the leader of Open Source Marketing & Community at Outshift by Cisco, which is Cisco’s emerging technologies and innovation unit. We recorded this episode at Open Source Summit EU, and talked about Kim’s strategies and tactics related to helping guide users to the correct edition of your product — ie, decide whether the open source option or a commercial option is best for them.

Kim talked about the tricky balance open-source companies must strike between embracing open-source principles and driving revenue as a business, Kim’s tactics for community building and why it’s so important to be clear on why you want to build a community and the outcomes you expect from your investment in community building. 

Highlights:

• I introduce Kim, who is the leader of Open Source Marketing & Community at Outshift by Cisco, as she joins me at the Open Source Summit EU in Bilbao (00:25)
• Kim gives an overview of the talk she is giving at the Open Source Summit, which is on the topic of self-identifying when to shift to a managed version of open-source products (01:35)
• Kim and I discuss the different personas of open-source software users, and the role that product-led growth plays for open-source companies (03:07)
• Why Kim feels it’s critical to not treat your community as a sales database but rather to provide educational content to drive sales of open-source products (09:10)
• Kim and I discuss the challenges of marketing an open-source project and whether positioning truly falls under marketing (10:49)
• How Kim created a feedback loop on her team between sales, marketing, and product to ensure alignment when bringing open-source products to market (13:31)
• Kim walks through her thought process for community building from scratch (17:23)
• How Kim evaluates if a community-building strategy is working or not (24:34)
• What Kim learned about being a part of a community by being a member of a food co-op (28:09)
• Where to connect with Kim and learn more about her work (34:44)

Links:

Kim

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kimmcmahonco/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/kamcmahon
• Company: https://eti.cisco.com/
  
  

Alexander Krüger is the Co-Founder and CEO of United Manufacturing Hub, an open-source company that develops software for the manufacturing industry. Throughout our conversation, Alexander describes the unusual path he took in going from a services-based consulting company to a product-led company. He also describes the opportunities and challenges of selling open-source software to an industry that has historically been slow to adopt new technology, as well as his choice to hone a go-to-market strategy before exploring fundraising.

Highlights:

• I introduce Alexander, and he gives some background on his company United Manufacturing Hub (00:22)
• How Alexander decided to develop open-source software for manufacturers (01:39)
• Alexander describes the early days of launching United Manufacturing Hub and how he got his first customers (04:06)
• How long it took to go from a consulting firm to a product-based company (06:57)
• Why it’s important to Alexander that United Manufacturing Hub is an open-source company (08:20)
• Alexander describes the go-to-market strategy at United Manufacturing Hub and how it impacts their fundraising efforts  as well as their monetization model (11:06) 
• Alexander describes an interesting mistake he made and what he learned from it (19:10)
• How different it is to sell open-source software in the manufacturing space versus other industries (21:31) 
• The biggest challenges facing United Manufacturing Hub today (22:35)
• Alexander describes the pros and cons of going from a services company to a product company (25:44)
• Where people can go to learn more about United Manufacturing Hub and connect with Alexander (29:38)

Links:

Alexander

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/alexander-krueger/
• Twitter:
• Company: https://www.umh.app/

This week I’m chatting with Steven Renwick, CEO of Tilores. As you’ll hear in the episode, we connected when I mistook Tilores for an open-source company. Steven graciously agreed to come on the show to discuss why they decided against making the product open source — which is actually a conversation worth having, and one that open source founders should probably have more often. 

There are a few options for companies building SaaS tools to solve problems for engineers and enterprises, from open source and open core all the way to completely closed source. In this episode, Steven and I discuss some of these options and why his company decided that going closed source would be the option that provided them the greatest opportunity for growth. Steven himself thought they would start the company as an open-source company, but upon further examination, realized they weren’t leaning in that direction for the right reasons. Listen to hear the journey from the beginning of their search for funding, to heading into the end of their second year in business as a closed-source company.

Highlights:

• I introduce Steven, tell the story of how we met, and he fills us in on the origin of Tilores. (0:32)
• Steven delves deeper into how Tilores started and why they decided against open source. (1:47)
• Steven and I discuss how companies sometimes get into open source before they fully understand all of the licensing options and how it will effect their business. (6:05)
• I point out that transparency is a commonly appreciated value in open source projects and Steven agrees that while it hasn’t been an issue so far, that is something that may push Tilores to open source in the future. (8:58)
• In seeking funding for Tilores, Steven found investors hesitant to buy into an open source company, so he explains why he thinks that is. (10:37)
• Steven and I discuss the many reasons going closed source keeps things simple. (14:27)
• Steven and I debate the idea that being open source implies a grander vision or hope of becoming the standard of service. (16:01)
• I mention that companies have gone from open source to closed source, which leads us to how open source can make it difficult for a company to become profitable. (19:43)
• We then dive into what the difference in vision between making boatloads of money, hoping to become the standard of service, and hoping to serve a particular niche. (21:06)
• If you don’t have a really good reason to go open source, maybe you shouldn’t. (24:15)
• Steven recalls a mistake in the early development of Tilores. (27:12)
• Steven shares his advice for folks making a product for engineers. (29:22)
• Steven reviews Tilores’s biggest challenge now. (30:58)
• Steven shares some final thoughts on open source. (34:07)

Links:

Steven

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/stevenrenwick/
• Twitter: @Major_Grooves
• Company: tilores.io/

Philippe Humeau is the CEO and Co-Founder of CrowdSec, an open-source security company with a very unique business model that doesn’t fit the usual open source patterns. Philippe talked about how to focus on providing a fair exchange of value between maintainers / open source companies and users, and how to monetize a project that is providing value for free.

Philippe also talked about why he thinks open-source founders are under more pressure to get their business model right at the start, tips on making the right hiring decisions, and how to communicate with the community in an effective and transparent way. I also liked Philippe’s cynicism: why he views open source as primarily a pragmatic choice for his business, given the type of company he wanted to build. 

Philippe also shares the logic behind his uncommon view that only making certain features available to paying customers isn’t a truly open-source business strategy.

Highlights:

• I introduce Philippe, who gives some background on his career journey and what he does at CrowdSec (00:22)
• Philippe explains why it seems that security companies are underrepresented in the open-source space (03:19)
• The most common mistake Philippe sees when people start an open-source business (05:03)
• Why Philippe believes that open-source companies are under more pressure to get their business model right the first time (09:26)
• How Philippe came up with Crowdsec’s unique business model (16:15)
• The pushback that Philippe got when he presented his business model initially (19:33)
• Why Philippe views open source as a means to an end, and how that has affected his choices at CrowdSec (25:10)
• The most interesting mistake Philippe has made since starting CrowdSec (27:28)
• Why Philippe believes open source business models are more promising than closed source (31:19)
• The advice that Philippe would give to an open source founder who is looking to build a successful company (34:11)
• Why Philippe feels that having certain features behind a paywall is not a truly open-source business model (35:53)
• Where you can learn more about Philippe and connect with CrowdSec (40:11)

Links:

Philippe

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/philippehumeau/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/philippe_humeau
• Company: https://www.crowdsec.net/

Samuel Stroschein is the CEO and Founder of inlang, an open-source company that is looking to not only make localization easy for developers, but also to help companies achieve revenue growth through localization. 

I was particularly excited to talk to Samuel because, back in my way back past, I was a translator, so I’m always interested in solutions that exist to facilitate translation; but also because localizing software is a good example of the intersection between business problems and technical problems. Inlang also strikes me as a company that could see its primary market as developers, or could see its market as CMOs — because of the way localization is both a technical and business problem. And Samuel is clear about this: He says “What we're basically saying is if you want to make more money, you've got to localize.”

Lastly, another thing that stuck out to me about our conversation was that, as we talked about Inlang’s future monetization strategy, Samuel said he thinks that it will likely be around services — which I hadn’t heard from anyone before. His reason: That the software will ultimately become commoditized.  

Listen in to learn why localization is such a challenge for developers, what impact it has on revenue growth, and how Samuel took inlang from an open-source project to an open-source company.

Highlights:

• Samuel introduces himself, describes his background and explains what inlang is solving for (00:37)
• Why localization is such a challenge and how it led Samuel to create inlang (01:21)
• The circumstances that pushed Samuel to turn inlang into an open-source project (04:30)
• Why Samuel decided to take inlang from an open-source project to an open-source company (05:43)
• Samuel explains how localization is a growth opportunity, and how that impacts inlang’s market (09:00)
• The way Samuel and his team are thinking about monetizing inlang (13:22)
• Why being an open-source company is important to Samuel (15:15)
• The collaboration that open-source brings and why it’s so valuable to Samuel (19:00)
• How financial stability, problem-solving, and the nature of building software all contribute to the success of open source in tech (26:06)
• Samuel explains how he views mistakes as stepping stones to positive outcomes (28:41)
• The learnings that Samuel has gathered when hiring for inlang (30:13)
• How you can connect with Samuel and learn more about inlang (31:22)

Links:

Samuel

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/samuelstroschein
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/samuelstros
• Company: https://inlang.com/

Kevin Muller is the CEO and co-founder of Passbolt, a security-first, open-source password manager, and he joined me to talk about the risks of having too much time and money, the value of getting trashed on social media and why he values in-person interactions with the team.

There were a lot of interesting pieces to pick apart from this episode. First of all, Kevin talked about the importance of not commercializing too early. I think he's the only founder I've ever heard say something along those lines, but he makes a good argument. (Also, Tim Chen and I talked about the timing of commercialization last week, my takeaway is that no one feels like they commercialized at precisely the right moment). Second, we had a good discussion about how the different priorities of European versus American investors can push companies to make different decisions. The subtext that we didn't address directly is make sure you are aware that your investors priorities are going to influence how your company evolves, choose your investors with that in mind. (and check out the episode with Markus Düttmann if you want more on the EU vs US investment environment for open source startups). Lastly, password managers have been in the news, and not in a good way — and how to best react to a super embarrassing situation for a competitor is not always obvious. So we talked about how Passbolt has tried to steer the conversation about password management in light of recent high-profile hacks in the ecosystem. 

Highlights:

• Kevin introduces himself and describes his work at Passbolt (00:26)
• How Kevin got the idea for Passbolt and the story of how he brought his idea to life (01:07)
• The mistakes that Kevin and his co-founders made when launching Passbolt (05:03)
• What happened when Kevin and his co-founders officially launched Passbolt in 2016 (08:12)
• How Kevin and his co-founders decided to move from a purely open-source product to a commercialized product (09:32)
• Why Passbolt is a hybrid company and the value Kevin sees in having employees spend time in the office (12:41)
• Kevin describes why it was so important for Passbolt to be an open-source company (15:58)
• Why Kevin feels it’s important not to commercialize an open-source product too quickly (19:07)
• The different priorities of European VCs versus U.S. VCs (21:58)
• Why honest feedback is so valuable and how Kevin and his team evaluated the feedback they got at the launch of Passbolt (24:26)
• Kevin’s reaction to data breaches that happen to other password management solutions (27:09)
• The biggest challenges that Kevin and the team at Passbolt are working on currently (31:09)
• Kevin’s advice to open-source founders (32:47)

Links:

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/kevinmuller80/
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/passbolt/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/passbolt
• Company: https://www.passbolt.com

Tim Chen is a Partner at Essence VC and also the Co-Host of the Open Source Startup Podcast. Through these channels, he has the opportunity to speak with a broad variety of open source startups. Throughout our conversation, we explore the patterns that Tim sees in the open source startup space. Tim talked about how too many founders take the decision to build an open source company too lightly and the path that he would take if he were to start a venture-backed open source startup tomorrow. We also discuss the different monetization models of open-source startups and the true business value of an open source project. 

Highlights:

• Tim introduces himself and describes his role at Essence VC as well as his work as Co-Host of the Open Source Startup Podcast (00:22)
• The common patterns that Tim sees having worked with so many open source startups (02:25)
• Tim describes the landscape of open source and how it varies from open source projects to venture-backed, open source companies (06:48)
• What path Tim would take if he were to start a venture-backed, open source startup tomorrow (09:31)
• How Tim views different monetization models and their potential profitability (17:29)
• Tim’s views on the pros and cons of an open-core model (20:34)
• The business value of an open source project according to Tim (24:47)
• How Tim’s evaluation and investing tactics have changed as he’s worked with more open source startups (31:58)
• Where listeners can find more information about Tim and learn more about his work (37:47)

Links:

Tim

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/timchen
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/tnachen
• Company: https://www.essencevc.fund/

Franz Karlsberger is the CEO of Amazee.io, an open-source platform that seeks to make developers’ lives easier by abstracting their day-to-day workload. Throughout our conversation, we explore what it means to join an open-source start-up as an external CEO, and why Franz put so much emphasis on go-to-market strategy. Franz also walks through the importance of knowing what open-source business model your company will follow, and how to measure the success of an open-source project.

Listen in as Franz shares some of his most interesting mistakes, what he’d do differently if he could start over, and why Franz feels open-source is more than just a type of software, it’s a company ethos that affects everything down to the team culture. 

Highlights:

• Franz introduces himself and his company Amazee.io, which is a ZeroOps application delivery platform (00:50)
• How Amazee.io went from being a point solution to a platform solution (06:20)
• Why Franz was brought in as an external CEO for Amazee.io to accelerate growth (10:03)
• How Franz adjusted to working at an open-source start-up and what that learning curve was like for him (11:47)
• The importance of open-source at Amazee.io and why it is baked into their core values and ethos as a company (15:30)
• How the go-to-market model differs for Amazee.io’s cloud offering versus their managed offering (17:51)
• Franz describes some of the most interesting mistakes he’s made and what he’s learned from them (23:25)
• Franz’s views on measuring the success of an open-source project (26:29)
• How listeners can connect with Franz and learn more about Amazee.io (32:37)

Links:

Franz

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/franzkarlsberger/
• Twitter: https://twitter.com/fkarlsberger
• Company: https://www.amazee.io/

It’s kind of a cliche, Vlad A. Ionescu, founder and CEO of Earthly, says, but his first attempts to build something really awesome focused on amazing technology. With hindsight, he doesn’t think it’s so surprising that those efforts weren’t successful. It’s not that passion doesn’t matter, but rather that he had to learn to build things that inspired passion from both the market and the builders. We also talked about:

• Leaving a job, blowing through his savings, going back to a job before finding entrepreneurial success
• Realizing that if he wanted to have the kind of impact on the world that he wanted to, he had to figure out a way to make it as an entrepreneur, because the alternative was climbing the corporate ladder and that didn’t sound like fun
• Why it’s important to be brutally honest with yourself and what you suck at
• How Vlad finally found success at Shift Left (now Quiet.ai)

I also really liked his ideas about cutting corners — that startups will always have to cut some corners, it’s just up to you to decide which ones to cut. 

Highlights:

• Vlad recounts lessons learned from early entrepreneurial failures. (2:31)
• Taking failure personally to overcome weaknesses (5:19)
• Vlad explains what led to his first success with Shift Left (7:40)
• Vlad shares his journey from Shift Left to Earthly (13:40)
• Why open source? (17:03)
• How Vlad and his team built Earthly based on what he learned from building Shift Left (25:07)
• Breaking a product down to its components to find more value (31:38)
• The Startup Hierarchy of Needs (34:02)

Links:

Vlad

• LinkedIn
• Twitter
• Earthly
• Qwiet.ai
• Personal Site

Markus Düttmann, a former Principal at Nauta Capital, is steeped in the European open source scene. From his beginnings in theoretical physics, Düttmann’s hard pivot into venture capital funding granted him a spot in the developing tech world as a connoisseur of the culture and a champion for start-ups. He even contributed to Nauta Capital’s European Open Source Report detailing the state of the ecosystem as of October 2022.

On this episode of the Business of Open Source, listen to his insight into the European markets, the various business models generally used for open source start-ups, and what he looks for in an open source start-up.

Note: Markus has since left Nauta and is on paternity leave. He also asked me to add a follow-up to the episode: After thinking more about the biggest danger to open source companies, he thinks most of them will fail from problems like not building the right team, failure to find product market fit and/or failure to monetize. Hyperscalers are a danger, but probably won’t be what causes most startups to fail. 

Highlights:

• The unique qualities of the European open source ecosystem (2:20)
• European market vs. the American Market in terms of funding (3:45)
• Advantages and disadvantages of a European open source company (4:40)
• Navigating the use of different business models within a business (8:14)
• How Markus evaluates open source start-ups (11:46)
• Don't be the open source version of an existing enterprise company (16:14)
• Signs of a company worth investing in (16:45)
• Potential risks to the open source ecosystem in the coming years (19:24)

Links:

Markus

• LinkedIn
• Twitter
• Nauta Capital
• European Open Source Report

This week Shanea Leven, CEO and Co-Founder of CodeSee, joins me to chat about demystifying code bases and building an effective team.

In this episode of The Business of Open Source, Shanea and I discuss the origins of her company, CodeSee, how it morphed from a training course to a SaaS product, and how they contribute to open source even though CodeSee is not an open source company. Shanea also shares valuable insight into working closely with your spouse, the importance of communication and empathy in building an effective team, and how she’s evolved as a leader. Listen to hear all of her insight and advice, and find out how the CodeSee SaaS offering helps companies understand their code bases and make critical decisions faster.

Highlights:

• How Shanea’s experience at Docker influenced her decision about whether or not to make CodeSee open source (1:51)
• Origin and history of CodeSee (6:58)
• How CodeSee progressed from a training course to a SaaS product (10:41)
• Shanea’s advice for other entrepreneurs interested in founding a startup with their spouse (14:36)
• Lessons Shanea has learned from the challenges of building a team (17:18)
• The importance of face time with customers (23:08)
• How CodeSee works (26:31)
• How CodeSee contributes to open source without being open source (30:14)

Links:

Shanea

• LinkedIn
• Twitter
• CodeSee

This week Heikki Nousiainen, CTO and Co-founder of Aiven, joins me to chat about building the business, his passion for open source and entrepreneurship, and his hopes for the future of open source in the public sector. 

In this episode, Heikki and I explore the successes and challenges he and his three co-founders encountered in creating and maintaining their global open source data platform. We discuss how they choose technologies to support, the importance of customer demand, how founders can learn to work together, and when to “kill your darlings.” 

Highlights:

• Origins of Aiven (1:40)
• Pros and cons of being headquartered in Helsinki (4:41)
• Aiven’s relationship to the open source community (6:02)
• How Aiven has evolved since its inception (7:34)
• How Aiven chooses technologies to incorporate into their service offerings (9:21)
• One thing that has been very successful for Aiven (12:51)
• Why Aiven chose their business model (16:33)
• The biggest challenge Aiven is currently facing (17:37)
• The State of Open Con and giving back to the Community (20:17)
• Barriers to more open source adoption in the public sector (21:24)

Links:

Heikki

• LinkedIn
• Twitter: @hnousiainen
• Aiven

Michael Cheng, Chief Legal Officer at Aalyria Technologies, is a master at strategy and execution for open-source products and companies. From his humble beginning spearheading the open source team at Meta (formerly Facebook), Cheng has honed his knowledge about the interworking of open source and utilizes it to its fullest potential.

In this episode of The Business of Open Source, Cheng talks about his time as Meta's lead in open source as well as what it's like to be an individual working for a large company. He also explains what happens in mergers and acquisitions with open source projects and the legality of being a small fish in a large pond!

Highlights:

• A little insight into Meta's open source (2:06)
• Detractors on a project (4:25)
• It's hard running a large company open source (7:47)
• Is it a problem to be individually driven? (9:45)
• Creating projects while working for large companies in open source (13:25)
•  Do they have a right to reprimand? (16:16)
• What happens in a merger for an open source company (17:53]
• Recommendations to an inquirer (21:47)
• Personality-deprived communities (24:48)

Links:

Michael

• LinkedIn
• Aalyria