The Health Fundamentals podcast

On today's episode of the Health Fundamentals Podcast we cover Health Fundamental #2:  The power of simplicity & consistency.

One of the books that we reference on today's episode is The Compound Effect by Darren Hardy.  This is an EXCELLENT book that clearly demonstrates the power of simplicity & consistency.  You can check it out here.

On today's episode of the Health Fundamentals Podcast we share a proven framework for structuring your health goals for repeated success.  As we move further into the year it can be increasingly challenging for many of us to stick to our new year's resolutions or general health goals.  What we will share on this episode is a simple way to increase the likelihood of success with your goals.  

In this episode we reference a great book "Be Your Future Self Now", you can check it out here.

On this episode of The Health Fundamentals Podcast we discuss a new approach to helping people struggling with Thyroid problems.  Whether you've been through the common conventional approaches or perhaps some alternative approaches, you're definitely going to want to listen in to what we have to share.  To learn more about what we're doing you can go to:

https://www.alignmeridian.com/health-restore-program/

On today's episode we discuss a powerful program that we have used to help patients end their knee pain and avoid surgery.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 42 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be talking PRP and regenerative medicine with dr Robin devel. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:15)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:34)
So on today's episode we have our special guest, none other than dr Robin devel. Dr Robin devel is amazing for a number of reasons, but first and foremost, she is our medical director and nurse practitioner at align integrated medical. And so I'm quite frankly, I'm surprised it's taken us this long to have you on the podcast. So thanks for being here with us. Thanks for having me. Yeah. So, um, we're really excited to dive into this topic. You know, we, one of our first episodes of the podcast, we talked a little bit about STEM cell therapy. Um, but um, we're excited because now we can dive a little bit deeper into some of the other realms of regenerative medicine, some of the things we do with the clinic, but then also diving a little bit deeper into your experience. Um, dr Robin, I don't want to steal her thunder, I'll let her kind of go into it, but she's got a really diverse background, uh, in terms of her clinical experience. And uh, and so I guess a good maybe starting place for us is kind of maybe give them a kind of a quick snapshot of your, your whole experience, kind of what got you into where you're at today, what, what got you where you're at today?

Speaker 3: (01:39)
Sure. Well, I started out as a chiropractor and after a while I realized there's a lot more people I want to be able to reach with holistic medicine and lifestyle changes. And so after being in practice about five or six years, I decided to go back to be a nurse practitioner. And when I got out, I had this fantastic opportunity to work in a clinic for st Luke's. And so most recently I've been working in wound wound care and I've worked at, uh, acute care hospitals as well, working with really, really sick people. So I went from working with generally really, really healthy people to the S really other end of the spectrum. Yeah, exactly. And so, um, I've gotten to see a lot of, a lot of the spectrum of how people are in their healthcare.

Speaker 1: (02:28)
Right? So you've seen, you know, the best of the best, the worst of the worst and pretty much everything in between. Yeah. Um, and, and that's what's really interesting, you know, is that what Robin has brought to our team, uh, has been, uh, an incredible amount of experience. Um, because so much of what she sees and learns in her experience has direct application, if for no other reason than to help serve as a warning signal to people in terms of like, this is where things go when you don't take care of. Because, you know, we were talking just before the podcast, a significant number percentage of the people that you deal with are people where it's chronic conditions brought about as a result of lifestyle choices. You know?

Speaker 3: (03:11)
That's exactly right. As a matter of fact, I get people from time to time in my clinic who have literally 10 to 15 large significant comorbidities I've talking to heart disease and kidney disease and diabetes, and they've gotten so far down the spectrum and then they hear these commercials about, Oh, tumeric is a great thing and it'll help inflammation, right? And so they go off, they go to some store and they buy a bottle of American. They think that they're, everything's going to be cured and they can get off their medications. And you know, so there's this spectrum where we have to help people, but sometimes people go a little too far, the illness spectrum, and it's hard to get them back.

Speaker 1: (03:50)
Right. And it's interesting that you bring up that example, you know, because I think to a large extent, that's what's happened either intentionally or unintentionally with the world of regenerative medicine. You know, that that's, it's become this very popular, uh, concept and idea that I think a lot of people have, have clung to and have maybe, perhaps incorrectly viewed as this savior of, of this thing that will, uh, basically undo decades of self-abuse basically of, of poor lifestyle choices that I can just do that one magic bullet. And that's gonna undo all that and it's going to, it's going to fix everything. And I think that has been a huge disservice, uh, to people because I think it's, it's served as a very loud and clear wake up call to them, yet again that, that, that's, that's not what regenerative medicine is really all about.

Speaker 1: (04:43)
In spite of the fact that some clever marketers have, have positioned it that way, that it's this magic bullet that all you need to do is just get this one injection. And then regenerative medicine is amazing. But one of, I'll never forget a story and I'm pretty sure it was, it was in college that I had heard it. Um, you know, people have this, we have this crazy trust that if something goes wrong, my doc's gonna fix it. Right. And there was a, there was a, I believe it was an instructor, he was saying, my dad, he was talking about his own father. Um, he said he drank a ton, he smoked and, and here I am, uh, getting out of chiropractic school saying, you got to stop this, it's going to kill you. It's bad. Right. And his, his dad was like, whatever. He says, if I have a heart attack, he's like, I'll just, you know, have heart surgery and I'll be fine. And literally the exact thing happens, right. His dad, you know, 10 years down the road has this massive heart attack and his life is completely changed. Yeah. They did do heart surgery and they did fix it, but he was not even close. And he was, and he came back to his son and he's like, I can't even tell you how bad I wish I would have listened because here I thought that, yeah, they're just going to do surgery and fix it. You know? So what my back blows

Speaker 3: (05:58)
out. Yeah. They'll just do a surgery and fix it. Right. And, and, and again, I think there is this, um, incorrect, uh, belief that, you know, it's like, yeah, if something's wrong, I can go have surgery and my shoulder can get put back together. But guess what? You know what if we can, if you have a little bit of an injury and we do do regenerative medicine, we can fix those things before they ever become this horrible thing where now, Oh, the only option is we've got to replace your entire joint. And it's almost become cliche. The phrase, uh, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. And I think it's even more than that. I think an ounce of prevention is probably worth 10 tons of cure. Um, right. But it's true. It is true. And I think when you look at somebody who does regenerative, uh, functional medicine, you really have to make sure they're not practicing exactly like a doctor would.

Speaker 3: (06:49)
But on the other end of the spectrum, because I've heard people and had people come to me that say, yeah, I went to this function medicine doctor and they told me I just need to be on this supplement for the rest of my life and I cure everything. Well, that's no different than a medical doctor prescribing something that's prescription. It's the same thing. So you really do, there is some personal responsibility that needs to happen. You really do have to start taking care of yourself as a patient and um, and look at the entire spectrum of your life, not just the, the supplement panacea or the prescription pill panacea. Right. And it's interesting you bring that up. I think that's a good segue into, when you look at from a mile up, let's just say, when you look at all the best evidence regarding regenerative medicine, whether we're talking STEM cell therapy, uh, PRP, platelet rich plasma or amniotic products or things like that, most all the research in general says these things work great, but they work the best when it, when part of a complete picture, instead of it being, you know, this just do this thing and it magically, it's just going to fix everything.

Speaker 3: (07:51)
But rather they say, and this is the way we've always tried to describe it to our patients, is, uh, you know, it's a catalyst. That's what it should be viewed as. This is an opportunity. It's, it, it provides a window of opportunity for us to then really begin kind of an unwinding, the, the, uh, the, the ball of thread, so to speak, over the years. So, uh, in terms of PRP, for those who are listening or watching, um, can you kind of describe maybe in layman's terms what's the, let's start with PRP and then maybe the difference between that and say STEM cell therapy and or amniotic therapies. So PRP is platelet rich plasma. And so what that means is they take a person's blood, they spin it down in a centrifuge, and that separates the red blood cells at the bottom and white blood cells with, from the plasma at the top.

Speaker 3: (08:43)
And the plasma at the top is rich in protein. And so you're just using that top portion of the protein. And when you use that in the body, it attracts your body's own STEM cells. It helps modulate inflammation. Um, it kind of acts as a, as, um, it will attract your body's own STEM cells and ability to heal, right? So it's a catalyst. When you look at amnionic products, that is something from outside your body that is derived from, uh, scheduled C-sections. It's processed down, and then it's made into a form that you can either inject or topically apply to a wound. And, and they refer to those again as STEM cell magnets, right? Where it's injected into the area. It attracts your body's own kind of, it kind of begins the healing cascade, you know, where all of a sudden the body starts to heal itself.

Speaker 3: (09:36)
And then lastly, STEM cells, STEM cells in this house, which are the actual STEM cells and they are used in the same way and they, they generate into whatever STEM cells your body needs. And that's based on all the different signaling molecules and growth factors that your, your body's cells produce. And it tells them what kind of salvation become. Yeah. And in terms of STEM cells, there's been kind of this ongoing debate for a while in terms of which is best, what they call autologous STEM cells, which is your body's own STEM cells. You extract them and then process them and then re-inject them in or STEM cells that are derived from, uh, uh, is it, is it, uh, um, umbilical cord STEM cells, cord STEM cells, cord blood, things like that. Right. Um, any updates on that in terms of the, the debate where that's at?

Speaker 3: (10:26)
Well you've heard, so I'm still hearing, well, if they're frozen or if they're alive, there's problems with counting them. So how do you know how many STEM cells are getting? Um, I, I S they're still super expensive. There's cord banks all over the place that are pitching their products as the best. And honestly, there's, I haven't done enough research to know exactly what's the best and whatever, but I just know there's so many competing companies out there that I would be super careful. You're not getting any of them. We, uh, I think we do a pretty good job at our clinic of trying to stay on top of the research and trying to sift through what's just really good marketing and looks and sounds good. Um, and so for us, you know, and that, and that's, I think something that I hope those watching or listening can kind of clean too, is that when you come into our clinic, we don't have a set agenda.

Speaker 3: (11:21)
You know, from a financial standpoint, it would make perfect sense for us that everybody coming through, we're just going to pitch STEM cell because that's the most expensive. And we're going to make the most money that way. But that's not what we do. Instead, I think to the contrary, typically we focus a little bit more on let, let's, let's start at the lowest end, see what that does, see if we can get, just get you better that way. The, the, uh, the most affordable option, you know, and then move from there. But, but again, it just depends on everybody's situation, you know? But I think also one of the important things that I like about working with you guys is that there is such an emphasis on we have to fix the core of the problem. Yes. So if the door hinges off and you're still creating that grinding on the floor, it doesn't matter how many times you replaced the floor, it's going to come back.

Speaker 3: (12:04)
You've got to fix the hinge, right? Yep. Or even put WD 40 on the hands, you know what I mean? At the end of the day. And that was the thing that was kind of the precursor to a lot of the um, uh, regenerative medicine products was, uh, the highly ironic acid products, which is basically a joint lubricant for lack of a better way of, of putting it. And that showed some pretty promising results at the beginning. And I think to a certain extent can be helpful in that it helps by some time. Um, but, but the, what you just brought up, there is such a critical piece of the puzzle that we try and help people understand. And that leads to a really good question that we can kind of talk about is one of the most common questions that people are going to ask with this is what can I expect in terms of how quickly will I see results?

Speaker 3: (12:47)
So let's talk about that. And then the second follow up question to that is how long is it going to last? You know, so let's start first with the first question. You know, if somebody comes into you tomorrow, we find that they're a good candidate. You say, yeah, you're going to be a good candidate for PRP or amniotic or whatever. What can I expect in terms of how soon can I see results? Well, that is partly individual. So it depends on how a person heals overall in general, what their general health picture is. Because even medications that they're on for other things may interfere or other health conditions like hyperthyroid or whatever may interfere. But in general, you've got to expect that your body has to produce these cells and that doesn't happen overnight. Right? So, you know, it may take a few weeks to even begin to notice anything and then maybe a month or more to start really feeling like there's a difference.

Speaker 3: (13:35)
And at first people may be actually be more sore than they, right? They feel sore first cause there's something happening and then they start to feel better. Um, how long it lasts depends on how well you fix the underlying problem and how much you work on it. So whenever you have a joint problem, you have an imbalance problem and all the muscles surrounding the joint. And, um, and maybe there's problems up there or down the spine. Um, so how well you address those and really balance out the muscles and do some physical therapy that's gonna determine how long the relief lasts. You know, our experience at our clinic has been pretty cool because we've seen, you know, I would say on average, uh, the cases that we've worked with within a few weeks, we see pretty significant changes. That was the case with one of our patients, Jim, who came in. He had a bilateral knee problems, pretty significant wear and tear on his knees. Um, he did, uh, the amniotic injections and did phenomenal on, well, he did wonderfully well, but, but his first week he was, he was in a world of hurt. You know, he was just like, man, it really flared up. But that was a good sign. That was, that was a sign that the body's beginning, that inflammatory process to begin that, the healing processes. So, uh, so he, he did, he did quite well with that within, uh, within a few short weeks.

Speaker 1: (14:52)
But, but then the other part of that that you talked about, you know, let's just use as just a hypothetical example. Let's say somebody who is significantly overweight, which is perhaps one of the single greatest risk factors for degeneration of the knees, right? They say that, you know, for every 10 pounds overweight, you aren't, it puts a significant, I don't remember the figures, do you remember what the numbers were? But I mean, it just puts a ton of ton of force on the knees, right? So let's say they come in and they do this, what can they expect in terms of the longterm results? Well, probably not that great if you're not willing to lose some of that weight or all of that weight, you know, um, because you're still gonna have the same stressors that brought you there in the first place, then I think that's the biggest thing.

Speaker 1: (15:33)
You know, we were talking about this before we even started is, you know, the problems that we see that, that are, um, that respond well to regenerative medicine are typically chronic degenerative problems in nature. And if that's the case, chronic degenerative problems don't just spontaneously happen. Um, they'd been, they'd been building over years and years and years. And so this, this idea that, that, and these are problems that need to be addressed. Like you said, you know, if we're, if we're going to really, really fix these issues and so we need to, we need to set correct and realistic expectations. Now that being said, it almost might feel like here amongst this conversation here that we're downplaying these things and that's not that anything but that we want people to understand. These are really powerful, powerful tools that we have available to us, um, at this day and age.

Speaker 1: (16:26)
But, uh, it would be a shame and we'd lose out on a huge opportunity there and maximize that opportunity if we didn't fully address, you know, those underlying issues. Well, you know, one of the things about regenerative medicine that is so beautiful is the fact that it's very natural. All right. You know, there are a lot of things that have been done in medicine for a long time. Different surgeries. I mean, uh, for, for instance, they used to bad sprains. They would cast your ankle for six weeks, you know, they would immobilize it or rice it or I would, there's different things that we thought at the time were the correct things to do or um, going in and cleaning up the, the arthritis in the knee, you know, there's tons of surgery or, uh, studies that say that, that's terrible. Like it, the results are worse by going in and cleaning it up.

Speaker 1: (17:15)
Then actually just leaving it alone so well and they used to just straight up remove the meniscus in the knee. It's just like, let's get rid of it. Let's look preemptively. These, these are like new opportunities to correct something in a very natural way without having to go to the, the extremes of surgery. Because the thing was surgery and the thing with a lot of these metal medications are, the dangerous thing about him is sometimes there's a point of no return. Like once you've cut into those tissues and created more scar tissue, there's no going back. If you fuse a joint, that joint is

Speaker 3: (17:50)
fused forever. But if we can, if we can get these regenerative therapies in soon enough and do the correct rehab and the correct strengthening and, and really kind of work this man, you could, you could really erase a lot of damage that you've done over the course of decades. Yeah, and I could just tell you from all my experience of treating people who've had surgeries and actually being in on some surgeries, there is no way I would ever have a surgery on my knee unless I literally, it was, I was dying and it absolutely had happened. I mean, there's, there's just no way. And um, certainly I would never do anything like that without having conservative therapy first because you're right, once you go the surgery route, um, and it's, sometimes that is the option, but once you go that route, when that's not the only option, you can't undo that.

Speaker 3: (18:43)
And so sometimes the best treatment for somebody, maybe it is a chronic problem that has been there for a years and you can't absolutely fix the underlying problem. You may at least be able to do a maintenance and keep it from getting worse or at least slow down the progression of some disease. Right. So, um, I think even if you can't 100% fix the underlying issue, a lot of times you can get people relief and um, and help them by just slowing down the process. No, that's huge. And the thing I would like maybe it kind of be in, in kind of closing here to, to really, uh, hone in on is the experience that you've had, uh, working with, uh, the, a lot of wound patients and things like that has really shown you, you know, kind of the, the dark side of it is the fact that this is what happens when you don't take care of, of, of things.

Speaker 3: (19:35)
But I would see the flip side that you've seen as well that can really, I think this will pull in on a positive note, is the miraculous nature of the body's ability to heal itself. You've seen some pretty miraculous things as well by a combination of using some of these regenerative technologies as well as some and as well as just the body's own innate capability of being able to, uh, be, be a regenerative in nature itself. Right. Even in some of these people that I've talked about that have multiple comorbidities that are very serious and they may have gone through a back surgery or may have been hospitalized for a long time and have deep, uh, pressure ulcers, I've seen pressure also is where I'm looking literally at the bone. I've seen back surgeries that have failed and I'm literally looking at the hardware attached to the bone in the spine and I will tell you it was bright blue and shiny metal and it looked just like a bicycle chain. I mean, that's how clearly I saw it. I could have read the knob because you had x-ray vision because the wounds were that deep and that open. I mean, just shocking. And the thing with the PRP that I saw is it works amazing. We, we do. Um, we have some research that

Speaker 1: (20:48)
we do in our clinic with PRP and we have a PRP available at the acute care hospital and placing that on wounds and watching them change from week to week. And sometimes, you know, every couple of days you're like, Oh my gosh, that has improved. Yeah. Massive improvement. Yeah. Powerful, powerful. And so I, I think the take home that, that I think would be the best way to end this particular episode is this idea that far too often people think that they're a lost cause and so they'll put off, uh, at least investigating or exploring the possibility. And sometimes people just resigned themselves because maybe they've tried certain things. Maybe they've even tried some of these things before. Uh, but I'm confident that you haven't tried what we do at our clinic because we do a very comprehensive approach in what we do. Again, we don't use these things as a, you know, a Hogwarts magic wand or magic bullet, you know, type things.

Speaker 1: (21:42)
We use this as part of a whole comprehensive approach to really helping you not only get relief, you know, in the short term, but in the longterm, helping you function at a higher level so that we can really address some of those root issues. Um, and, and so we're really grateful that we have a dr [inaudible] with us as part of our team. It's been phenomenal. She's, she's such a, uh, an incredible asset to our team. Uh, she's easy to work with. She's, she's got such a phenomenal bedside manner. Nurse practitioners tend to have a really solid reputation. Um, but even in that, amongst the peers, I think she, she's head and shoulders above in those terms. So she's phenomenal. So for those listening and considering, especially those people who, who are maybe local here and they're saying, I wonder if they can help me. Uh, we always say what we say to everybody and that is, we give a definite, maybe let me give a definite, maybe because we don't want to make those kinds of guarantees.

Speaker 1: (22:37)
Cause that would just be foolish to say those sorts of things. And so what we do guarantee though is that we can find out if we can help you when you come in. And so, uh, this is an open invitation to people to come in and sit down with dr devel, meet her face to face, knee to knee, whatever you want to call it. Uh, I think the thing that I can guarantee it is I can guarantee you that you will truly feel after speaking with her, that she's really listening to you, which is a great thing. I think most people want that, you know, from, from a doctor. Uh, she'll really listen to you. She'll hear, hear you out. And she'll really, us as a team, we'll go to work to find out if you're a candidate for, for what we do here with some of these regenerative, um, tools, uh, as well as the rest of what we do at our clinic.

Speaker 1: (23:21)
And then from there we can, uh, put together a plan that can help you. So, uh, any final thoughts? Dr. Allen, dr devel. You know, I think we kind of covered things, you know, these, these different, I don't know that the reject, the regenerative therapy to me is exciting because I mean, I've, I've actually experienced it myself on a few different areas. Yeah. Am I shoulder my shoulder? And every time I've a massive difference and a massive improvement. And then again, on the other, the flip side of that, having worked on people and treated people who have had to go the more drastic route of knee surgeries or shoulder surgeries, man, I, I mean, I feel fantastic and I'm like, ah, man, I wish I could have got ahold of you five years ago, right, one year ago. You know what I mean? Like, cause the potential is massive.

Speaker 1: (24:08)
So, um, it's one of those things don't, um, don't go the easy route. The easy route is letting, trying to let someone else do everything for you and to think that, Oh, surgery's just gonna make it better. Or the medicine's gonna make it better. It's Jen, Sharon's converse this. So I'll just do exactly like that is the path of least resistance. And unfortunately when it comes to your health, that is not the proven track record. It really is not. It's not the best way to go. And well the problem with those things, again and I know we're kind of to some extent beating a dead horse, but just understand that the bill will come due later. You bet. And in the longterm the cost is going to far outweigh any of what you thought was beneficial from that. So any other final thoughts there? I can only echo that.

Speaker 1: (24:56)
I have just seen it time and time again. And I guess that's why I said earlier, I so passionately said it would be my last resort because I have seen it and uh, you can't undo it and there is a longterm cost that comes to you. And so it, it just behooves anybody to just try the more conservative thing first. And if that doesn't work, then consider start exploring, start exploring other options. And I would say included in that is something as seemingly simple and easy as a cortisone injection. Uh, cause even with that, there's a huge price to be paid there. You know, the, the research has come back. It's definitive. People understand cortisone deteriorates tissue, it weakens the, the integrity and the structure of muscle tissue, of, of ligament, of cartilage, of all those different areas. And so it's, uh, it's not this simple, uh, you know, easy process seed.

Speaker 1: (25:50)
It'll, it'll come at a, at a very, very steep price. And that's not to say that you can't do it or that even you shouldn't do it, but you shouldn't do it lightly. Um, cause it's, it's pretty potent stuff. So, um, hopefully this has been really valuable for you guys. Hopefully we've given you some really good information regarding, uh, PRP and regenerative medicine. Some things to consider if you know, other people that could benefit from, uh, the information that we shared and for those local, if you know somebody, uh, you yourself or somebody that could benefit from a consultation with dr devel at our team, uh, just reach out to us, uh, at our website. Uh, we're on Facebook, we're just about everybody everywhere online and, uh, and we'd love to meet you in person. And I know dr Vel would love to be able to find out if we could help you. So, and Dr. Bell, again, thanks for being here with us. We appreciate you as always and uh, we'll talk to you guys on the next episode. Have a good one.

Speaker 2: (26:47)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop. And in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
What's going on, everybody, Dr. Chad Woolner here, and Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 41 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be talking about CrossFit. Is it bad for your health? So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:13)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show is about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:32)
So, Hey everybody, hope you guys are having an awesome day. We are here with our good friends, Brandon and Ashley. They are the proud owners of power seekers CrossFit here in Meridian. And uh, so we thought we would bring them on for this highly controversial episode. Not really, but uh, but anyhow, we're, we're going to be talking about CrossFit, uh, all things CrossFit. So thanks for being with us guys. Absolutely. Thanks for having to be here. Yeah. So, um, so let's first start with kind of a quick introduction of who you guys are, what got you guys into CrossFit in the first place, and then ultimately what got you guys to take the plunge of, of owning a CrossFit gym? Sure, go ahead. Go first. All right. So Brandon and I've been doing CrossFit for about four to five years. Um, got into it kind of by accident and got a Groupon and did it, loved it.

Speaker 1: (01:24)
Uh, found out I was pretty good at it and you know, fast forward a couple of years we went to power seeker or I went to power seeker, uh, my first year and a half. And, um, Brent owned it then and then, uh, we kind of left, went to different gyms and heard through the grapevine that there wasn't good things happening. And so we took the opportunity and reached out to Brenton, uh, talk to him about maybe taking it over and man, we just, we fell into a good thing at a good time. Good. It's really what happened. So fast forward two years, another opportunity came up and bam, we're loving life, man. That's awesome. Yeah. Yeah. Brandon and nationally both torture me on a regular basis. That's right. When I get my rear end to the gym, um, they do a fine job. Yeah. That's a lot of fun. I learned this week that if buddy is rolling around, just leave him alone. Yeah. We, it was a about a million and a half toes, you know, reaching your legs up and touching the bar or so it felt like that. And then like I didn't want to waste any extra energy, so instead of sitting up to go do my next activity, I would roll to my stomach like a dead man and then get up and Ashley came over. She was like, are you okay? Do I need to call someone? Yeah.

Speaker 1: (02:47)
All right. That's a, that's just called economy of motion. Yes. That's exactly it. We're going on a different process of how to get up. There you go. So, uh, and, and Ashley, your story with the CrossFit. So for me, I was a collegiate soccer player and then I transferred to Boise state. And I, long story short, I thought I wanted to go to law school and that didn't end up happening because I spent all my time at the gym instead of in glass. Okay. So I was a drop in and power seeker and Mike my first day there, Brent was like, Hey, do you want to coach for me? So that ended up happening and Brandon and I actually met at power seekers. So it was a great outlet for me to go from being a collegiate athlete, still needing like that competitive atmosphere. So needing something to keep myself active.

Speaker 1: (03:35)
Um, Lee's were seeking other opportunities, other like communities within the treasure Valley. And then we ended up back at power seekers. So, Oh, you forgot though. We started dating there as well. Yeah. That's where we met. I kind of figured as much. Yeah, I kind of figured that's kind of how things evolved. So it's been a, it's been a very, uh, interesting circle. Yeah. You know, it's crazy. Yeah. I, I, you know, CrossFits uh, an interesting culture to say the least. Um, you know, you said you kind of jumped into it by mistake. Uh, I first started doing CrossFit, uh, about four, four. You probably about the same time as you. A friend of mine, like literally begged me, just come try it. He's like, just try it for 30 days. And in my head I had like this image of like, uh, people in a garage like throwing rocks and jumping over garbage cans and stuff like that. Just like this very like we're trying to be as primitive as possible, you know? And, and when I got there, I was pleasantly surprised. Like my experience with CrossFit, at least with, with him wasn't anything like that. It was like, what I loved about it was that it took a lot of the thinking out of the equation for me. You know, I would, I would find myself prior to going to CrossFit, going to the gym and like walking around aimlessly. Like, Oh, that machine looks good. I'll try that.

Speaker 1: (04:58)
You know, I'm sure there's some video footage of me floating around out there somewhere of like that guy who's doing the machine completely wrong or he's like doing, you know, like the, the head, the head twister or whatever. And it's like not meant for that at all. And so, uh, anyways, but, but, uh, my experience with CrossFit was really positive and it changed a lot of my perceptions from what I had heard. Cause there's a lot of, a lot of, uh, you know, misconceptions and stigmas associated with CrossFit. And so I guess we can kind of dive right into the question. Is CrossFit bad for your health? Yes. No, maybe so. I think a hundred percent. No, I mean, I agreed. Yeah. So, so then the other question then, if it's not bad for your health, where do we hear like all these or where and, or why do we hear a lot of these classic misconceptions about it that it, that it's going to hurt you, that you're going to get injured if you do CrossFit?

Speaker 1: (05:51)
Uh, there are some doctors that we've had experiences with that, that, uh, dissuade or even tell their patients don't do CrossFit. You know, some chiropractors even say that to their patient, friends of ours don't do CrossFit. It's, it's bad for you. You know, you're just asking to get injured. I've had doctors say, Oh, CrossFit CrossFits great for business, ya know, they keep sending me, right, right. Like, come on. Couches are great for business one. I think a lot of that, you know, uh, depending on where you go and how often you go and the coaches that are there, you know, everybody can have an awful experience. Go into Chevron. You know, everybody can have a great experience going to Sheva I think. I think the mentality that you get from places is, you know, I can do, I can do a setup. Cool. Okay, well if somebody teaches you how to do a proper setup, then that's what it is.

Speaker 1: (06:37)
But if they teach you how to do an incorrect set up, of course you're going to get hurt. You're going to strike something. And then there's where CrossFit is not the issue. The coaching is the issue, right. We are all in. And the interesting thing, I saw an interview with Greg Glassman for those who don't know who Greg Glassman is, he's the founder of CrossFit and he's a very kind of outspoken, fairly polarizing individual, uh, you know, no, yeah, yeah. He's, he just, he, he's, he's definitely a very charismatic individual, but I thought it was really cool, his response because to that end of the coaching that a lot of people criticize, uh, in the interview anyways, they were kind of saying, people are kind of critical that you could get certified to be a CrossFit coach in a weekend. And they were like, that's kind of, and he's like, yeah, isn't that great?

Speaker 1: (07:21)
And they're like, what do you mean? He's like, well, at least we have standards. Oh no. He's like, he's like, there are some standards that are there that you have to abide by, you know, that the, you know, it's like, at least that's the case, you know? And uh, and so it was just that, that, that perspective he had on it was, was really good. And I would, I would wholeheartedly echo what you just said there in the sense that my experience has been, it's not CrossFit as a whole, it's the coaching and or the, the, the, the gym that you go to in terms of what happens there is really going to determine the, the experience that you have. I think the benefit of, of having that weekend to get potentially get certified, cause you have to take an exam and if you fail the exam and you don't get to be a coach, right.

Speaker 1: (08:04)
So, but I think the benefit of that weekend is you're going in there and you're actually applying what you're learning. So it's very hands on. Yeah. You're not just taking the test online or reading a bunch of books. It's very hands on. And then you're actually learning how to apply it in class where yeah, if you maybe take like the ACE test or if you take a personal training class online, it's not giving a tool as of like this is how you apply it and this is how you see and correct a flaw. This is what, this is the criteria. Now you figure out how to apply it. That's not what CrossFit is about. And I think that's the benefit of those two days of being with the best coaches in the world. And there they're giving you their tools, they're giving you their secrets. Yeah.

Speaker 1: (08:47)
You know the, the other interesting thing that I think we were, Dr. Allen and I were talking about this just a couple of days ago in preparation for today's interview is the thing that I think that's really interesting about CrossFit is that it's a sport, right? You, you have the, the fitness side of it, but then you also have the competition side of it. Um, and the thing that I find funny is, is that in the competition side, injuries are, we'll just say a common occurrence. People at that, at that level of, of competition and people like they, they like almost thumb their thumb. Their nose is to the right. Like they, they, they look down on it like, Oh, that's so stupid. Why would you do that and get yourself injured? And the thing I find interesting is no one says that about football or any other, any other sport where injuries are just an inevitable part of the game.

Speaker 1: (09:36)
You know, soccer, football, you know, baseball, any of these places, injuries are just an inevitable fact of competition that anytime you push yourself to a higher level, there's always running. You're always running some level of risk. Like you said, motor cross motorcross how many motorcross uh, patients have you seen over the years? I've seen tons of them busted. One of the very first I ever saw it was a 22 year old kid. And I'm like, how many bones have you broken? And my first question, how many bones have you broken? Cause he competed, right? And he's like, Oh, probably 20. At least. Here's a 20 year old, 22 year old kid that's broken. 20 bones. Don't kid yourself, you know, so, so I mean, yeah. What were you gonna say? I mean, CrossFit really has been around 10, 15, 20 years, right? The idea that, or it actually getting out for just your general public to see it is pretty new.

Speaker 1: (10:29)
Um, football, soccer, all of these big sports have been around for ever. And so I mean it's more common to just see that football injury and then be like, Hey, they're just going to go back in the chair and they're going to get a shot and then they come back out on the field. Right. That doesn't really happen in the CrossFit world. And I mean those competitive athletes who are showing at the CrossFit games, that's less than 1% of our community, right? So it's not a matter of if they're going to get to hurt, it's a matter of when they go into that profession, like they make CrossFit a career, knowing that that's part of the game. Any competitive level athlete of any kind, you're going to have those types of injuries right here. And that's what I would say too, is for your guys' experience.

Speaker 1: (11:11)
You know, the average CrossFit goer, which would be like me, which even then, I don't even think I'm to that level yet, but what's my risk of injury? High, low, low. I think for us, I mean, and I would like to hope that every CrossFit gym is like this, but unfortunately it's not for us. We're not trying to make you come into the gym to be a CrossFit games athlete, right? Trying to make you functional to apply it to your life outside of the gym. Right? We're trying to make sure you're picking up the dog food the right way. Right. I think everyday life movements mimic everything that you do inside the gym. It's just can we teach you a better way to do it? Right. That's, yeah, that's a great point that you bring up there too, because I heard, uh, I can't remember who it was.

Speaker 1: (11:58)
It meant it might even been that same Greg Glassman interview that I saw, where they talked about, well, you're having old ladies do dead lifts, which for those who aren't familiar with dead lifts, it's lifting the bar belt, obviously using proper mechanics, uh, straight from the floor, you know, and, and when people see that, that image of an older woman or an older man like doing that, like very like, uh, you know, uh, you know, heavy lift for the, and, and we, and we shouldn't even say heavy because you're obviously gonna modify the weight accordingly. Um, but his response to that was, well, yeah, is that old lady ever gonna pick something up off the ground? Grandkids, you know, groceries. Right, right. And so that's the thing is these are very practical and very functional things that you guys are doing with people. So, so yeah, very, very practical from a day to day standpoint, even for people that wouldn't consider themselves like athletes or competitors or anything like that.

Speaker 1: (12:55)
And that was the thing for me that I noticed when I was doing CrossFit regularly. So my quick story real quick, cause I did it for, like I said, it was about four years ago, but I haven't been doing it for four years. I did it for about two or three years pretty consistently. And then I started, uh, converting my garage into my own little personal kind of CrossFit ESC setup, which yeah, tight time-saver for sure. And I know I'm not getting nearly the same level of workouts that I would be getting. Uh, if I had like professionals like you guys actually preparing those workouts for me because it's a lot easier to, uh, to, to make the workouts easier on yourself than to have them, uh, designed by you guys. But uh, but that's the, anyways, th th th the point being is when I was doing those workouts in CrossFit, I noticed that they were very practical in terms of, you know, strengthening your core and strengthening your, just your overall frame and making sure that you could do a lot of that.

Speaker 1: (13:47)
Just regular things that you do on a date it day in, day out basis. So any help. So what do you guys love most about being CrossFit coaches? Oh man, go ahead. I got too much to say about that. For me it's the people like yeah, I could really care less about the business side of it. I just, I love coming in and getting to know every single person and knowing them, like knowing them outside of the gym. Yeah. So I don't want to, I obviously need to know and I want to know your injuries and your limitations and all of that stuff inside of the gym. But I want to know was work crap today cause that's going to affect your workout inside of the gym. But I also want to know how are your kids, how's your wife? Yeah. What are you eating outside of the gym?

Speaker 1: (14:34)
Like I, I love the relationship side of CrossFit. Perfect. That's awesome. I would say I would totally coming from someone from the outside, you know, attending your gym before CrossFit. I was just like Chad, I mean I and I worked out pretty regularly at the gym and um, I remember yeah, it was w for at least four days a week consistent. I thought I worked out hard. I remember my first week of CrossFit workouts and I was like, Holy crap, have I ever worked out a day in my life? You know, like it was a different kind of training and then it was, it really was the, um, like if, if it's left up to me, I'm never going to push myself as hard as, um, as I, as I should or as I actually even think I could the workouts and CrossFit, I would never, you know, there are certain workouts that I'm like, I would have, first of all, whoever thought this up cause they're insane.

Speaker 1: (15:23)
But what's crazier is when you actually do them and you're like, I finished it, you know, like it's, that's awesome. So that, that community part of working out for me is, uh, is just massive. So being held accountable and like not cutting that squat short and going just low enough to feel that burn. Like are you still getting below parallel? You still hitting that target with that wall ball every time or you go on a few, are you cheating yourself? Yeah. Yeah. [inaudible] box at the top. Yeah. I think for me like what, what I enjoy the most is, is seeing that expression on somebody's face after you convinced them that putting those two and a halves on each side are going up five pounds heavier. The expression on their face after they do it and they're just, I mean, just amazed and the happiness that you see in them.

Speaker 1: (16:16)
Sure. I mean it just, I mean I could just float away. I mean it made sure so good seeing people break through either physical and or mental barriers that they will, 90% of it is mental. Like nobody's ever convinced me to do that or nobody's ever told me that I should turn the box over to a 24 instead of a 20 or you know, like that Oh shit factor. So yeah, but you're good. That is, that's it's a huge show and and no, and the critical thing is knowing just how much to push that person to where they can do it and not hurt themselves, not hurt themselves. Right? That is, that is such a fine line of am I doing it correctly, am I doing it properly? And then that expression in that gratitude that person has is man, right? It's believing in our members when they can't believe in themselves.

Speaker 1: (17:08)
Truly believe in. If you can just, if you can have that confidence for them through that and then just help them, help them reach that goal, you believed in them and then at the end of the day they believe in themselves. So awesome. I think what you guys are saying are all elements are at the heart of, of what good coaching is all about. It's really finding what you said, that kind of fine line of of stretching somebody to the point where you know they're going to break through some of those barriers. But then also knowing where that, where that limit is in terms of, you know, cause you can run that risk of injury and or whatever. But but knowing that is again, that's going to come from years of experience of knowing that those kinds of, and just like any other profession, I mean you guys, you guys go to school and you get your certificate or your degree, it's not like you just stopped there.

Speaker 1: (17:57)
Right. You continue to learn, you continue to drive and you continue to make yourself better. It's the same for us. It's not like we go to that one week and then we get our level one and then we just go, okay well now we can own a gym at the top. Yeah. I mean how often do you guys, that being said, how often do you guys do continuing education? I mean, I mean it will say we'll say a formal continuing education cause obviously every day in the gym, like just like everyday in practice, you know you're learning. But in terms of like how, how often do you guys go to conferences and things like that. So I don't, I don't go to any conferences. I have another business that I go to 100% of the time too. And so my learning, my learning is more visual and physical, like being on on spot.

Speaker 1: (18:40)
Like I learned from people every day. Okay, that cue worked for this guy, but it doesn't work for that guy. So how am I going to make up something that I can say the same thing but in different ways? Sure, sure. I think for me, for me having, um, a dictionary of cues that mean the same thing, you know, is, is a huge learning experience for me. And I think I get a lot of that every single day, every class. And even when I'm on the other side of coaching as an athlete. Sure. Hearing people talk to one another, sharing their personal cues. And then I just absorb that because it was awesome. Sure. And so I learned a different way. I learned from the athletes themselves and yeah, no, that makes sense to me. And how about you saying no. For me, I think you could have all the credentials in the world and I honestly don't think that they mean anything if you're not providing results.

Speaker 1: (19:34)
Right. Yeah. I have my level one and I have my level two and I would potentially love to get to level four. I think being seminar staff would be an incredible, incredible opportunity. But, um, every day, like I'm watching videos, I'm trying to read books, I'm listening to podcasts. Last week she just bought some a anatomy book for my favorite anatomy books. There you go. You've got her. Netters there we go. I mean, there are tons of opportunities. Um, they don't all come to the treasure Valley area. So if you want to get that CrossFit oper offers a ton of online certifications that you can get. But if you want the hands on one, a lot of times you're going to have to travel for them, which is fine. We traveled for my level two and that was awesome. Um, I mean we have a lot of certifications and stuff, but like she said, you know, if you don't, if you don't practice that are in the trenches doing it.

Speaker 1: (20:30)
Yeah. It doesn't make sense. Yeah. Cool. I got 900 certifications. Cool. Yeah. But I haven't taught anybody anything. Right. Yeah. Right. That's for me. I don't, I don't want somebody to come into the gym be like, Hey, um, today's my first day. Like what can you guys offer? I got my level two you're going to be, you're in great hands cause I got my level two, no, I'm going to make sure that I provide a result for you and then I don't care about any of the certificate and all that. Makes sense. Um, so for those who are listening who are local, uh, what would be the best way for people to get in touch with you guys? Go ahead. Okay. So we just updated our website. If you had ever been on our old website, it was, boy, I mean when we took over a power secret, there was no website.

Speaker 1: (21:18)
It was literally you typed in power to your crossfit.com and it was like, do you want to buy this bill? So we had a, um, one of our coaches, her husband put our website together and all we said was like, we need a phone number, our address and our class times. That's all we need on it. But then now with this new transition, I was like, okay, okay, we got to get a website, legitimate website. We have to have something. And so you can go to our website power. So your crossfit.com, it's our seeker, crossfit.com. We'll make sure in the show notes we have the link there. Powerless on Facebook or Facebook, Instagram. Um, we have emails, phone numbers. I don't know if we want to put all of that stuff in there. Yeah, we can put, we can put whatever. Yeah. And we'll put links to everything.

Speaker 1: (22:02)
So, um, for those who, yeah, for those who are here locally, um, that's how you get ahold of them. Uh, what would somebody locally, so let's say we've got people who are like, I want to check this out. What can we expect, uh, coming in for the first visit at power seeker CrossFit? So, um, we don't offer an OnRamp class. We just, we invite all new people to just jump into class. Okay. Um, if, if you're super intimidated or you haven't worked out for a really long time, I would say don't come to the five or 6:00 AM cause those really big classes. Sure. Okay. But Oscar levels all abilities, it doesn't matter. Sure. Size, age. And I guess for those people who are maybe intimidated, is it an intimidating experience coming? So I, I love, I love the fact when somebody comes in and they're, you know, have their arms crossed and they're kind of standing by the front door and you go up and you're like, Hey, how's it going?

Speaker 1: (22:58)
You know, what can I do for you? And they're like, well, I've heard about this and I want to try it. And then you're just pumped and you're excited and you tell them about it and they're like, Oh, so it's not that bad. Right. Getting in the car, driving to the gym, that's the hardest part. Driving down, knowing that you're scared out of your mind and then you get there and then you see everybody, all walks of life in, they're working out, sweating and cheering everybody on. You know, I think, I think that helps out a lot too because everybody from a to Z in our gym, you know, and it, they all love it. Yeah. That was the thing, I think that really did actually surprise me quite a bit when I came into CrossFit for the first time, was seeing a very diverse, uh, you know, clientele in terms of that, you know, that there was people from, like you said, a to Z in of levels of ability.

Speaker 1: (23:46)
And so that made it far less intimidating to me, you know, in terms of getting started where I'm like, these other people are doing it so you know, you, and we naturally think some sometimes identify where we fit in the line. You know, like, I'm like, that guy's probably a little bit stronger than I am and a little bit more fit than me. But I definitely know I'm probably better than him. So, and in my case I had to like, look at the women. I'm like, I'm, I'm better, I've gotta be better than her. She's like 80 and then I wasn't in a classic statement as well. I need to get in shape to go into CrossFit. Right? No you don't. You just need, yeah, I need to get, you know, I need to go run or get some workouts in and then I'll come to CrossFit.

Speaker 1: (24:25)
Yeah. And it's not like if we program a handstand pushup or a muscle up, if you can't do that, you can't show up today. Right. Show up and we're going to give you something and modify it for you. That's still gonna well, if you came in, if you came in ranger motion, yeah. If you came in to any class, anytime we're open 11 hours a day and if you came into any one of the classes, I guarantee you half of those people are doing a different movement. Excuse me. The same movement, but in a different way. Yes. Modification are doing the same. Weighted motion. Different poundage, right? Yeah. So everybody's doing the same workout so they don't feel isolated or you know, Oh, well why is that person doing that when I'm doing this? Yeah. You know, everybody has the same workout. It's just modified to their ability and everybody finishes roughly in the same timeframe and it's awesome.

Speaker 1: (25:14)
That is awesome. Yeah, we'll, uh, we appreciate you guys taking time out of your schedule. Again, I'm sure you guys probably have classes today and tomorrow going on, so thanks for, uh, thanks for being here with us and taking time to share this with us. Uh, for those who are interested, uh, power seekers CrossFit, um, hope this has been valuable for you guys. If you know other people that could benefit from what we've shared, uh, share this with them. Uh, be sure to subscribe to the podcast and we'll share more with you guys on the next episode. Awesome. Thanks. Appreciate it.

Speaker 2: (25:42)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop. And in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here. And I'm Dr. buddy Allen. And this is episode 40 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're here with our good friend, Dr. Scott Lewis, and we're going to be talking about how to help kids heal from concussions. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:13)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:33)
Alright everybody. So we're here with our good friend, Dr. Scott Lewis. Uh, he's actually just down the road from us, which is really cool, really exciting. Uh, we've known Scott for quite a while here and, uh, he does some really, really cool stuff. And so rather than me do a poor job of giving a synopsis of what it is that he does, uh, well the first question we'll start with kind of tell everybody a little bit about, uh, who you are, kind of what got you into the field that you're in. All right, great.

Speaker 3: (00:58)
So I'm what's called a developmental optometrist. And I went to optometry school thinking I was going to sell glasses and contacts like every other optometrists. But what I didn't realize is when I started optometry school, my eyes weren't teaming together. So I got through high school and college reading with one eye covered and leaning over because if I tried to look with both eyes the words, then it makes sense to me. They kind of moved on the page and I'd get a lot of headaches. And it wasn't till I was in optometry school that said, Hey, or somebody said, your eyes aren't working. And I'm like, what do you mean? I see 2020. When I cover one eye? They're like, who cares? Your eyes aren't lining up. And so I did therapy in school and I got my eyes lining up and it made it so I could track.

Speaker 3: (01:43)
Um, my grades went to a 4.0 life was good after I did therapy. And that's what I made the decision. I've got to figure this out. And then my wife and I were thinking I had a concussion when I was 12. And at that point I had been in gifted classes all the way through elementary school and in the beginning of middle school. And then once I had that head injury, I was getting a 1.9 GPA, 2.0 GPA, headaches every day. Life was not fun. Um, and I just had to cope because I'd go to the eye doctor and I saw 20, 20 because everybody checks with one eye than the other eye, but nobody looks to see how well, how well are the eyes lining up? How well are you tracking? Do you process the information you see? And so it was that revelation. And after being going through therapy myself and life was so much easier. That's when I decided I've got to practice this way.

Speaker 1: (02:38)
So you finished optometry school, which is what, four years after? Uh, it's a graduate level program. Right. Doctorate level program. Uh, and then after that, what did you S cause cause you weren't specialized at that point in time, right? No, I I really like vision therapy,

Speaker 3: (02:52)
but I did a three year fellowship, um, with the college of optometrist envisioned development and I worked a doctor in DC for 18 months who only did vision therapy before I moved to Idaho for my practice. And what sorts of cases, I mean obviously you talked about a concussion. What, what sorts of cases do you typically see at your clinic? All right, so the majority of my patients are, um, kids that don't learn to use their eyes correctly. I see a lot of kids with eye turns, lazy eyes. And then about second, third, fourth grade, there's a lot of kids that are falling behind in school because they're struggling learning how to read and, and comply in the classroom because their eyes are playing tricks on them. And so they're really smart kids, but they're now falling behind because of the mechanics of reading haven't developed.

Speaker 3: (03:41)
Um, then I see a lot of patients with, um, post ABI post TBI, so strokes, um, head injuries, concussions, we see a lot of patients, um, to do that rehab side. But we also have a lot of athletes that come in that want us to take their visual system and make them better. So I'm the eye doctor that works the visual system, so eyeballs back. Okay. So I don't do the front of the eyes, I don't do glasses contacts. I make sure that the brain's processing the information and using what we see and understanding it and interpreting it correctly and then that the brain's controlling the eyes so that they move correctly. You know, a lot of it sounds to me like you're a very neurologic based optometrist or a neurology type optometrist. Is that a fair thing to say in terms of description? That's a really fair, some of my colleagues are now using the term neuro optometrist.

Speaker 3: (04:34)
Okay. Yeah. So, um, that's interesting. So I mean in two broad categories you could say that that your patients either fall into a camp of they've got a problem and they want to help get your help solving the problem. Uh, which is I think what most doctors typically think of. But then there's another where it's kind of more of a performance based kind of a group of individuals that you're working with where things are working. Okay. There's no real clear pathology or problem, but rather you've got these people who want to, who want to improve that area. Uh, in terms of their sports performance, baseball players flip, I mean, people absolutely coordination. Uh, this morning we had a basketball player and a baseball player in the office. I'm on the coaching staff for Boise state. I'm on the baseball team. Um, we see all the players every week and if there is a deficit, we definitely take care of it. But then we take them and we make them take them to the next level. If we can make that fast ball look 20 miles an hour slower, if we can develop reaction time depth, the focus speed of focus, if we can improve that, it makes a world of difference when you're on the field. Yeah. Um, what would you say in terms of do how many people like cause cause for me, uh, prior to even meeting you, I didn't even know there was such a thing as, as what you do. Is that a pretty common

Speaker 1: (05:57)
thing? Do most people not know that this is even in existence? Like

Speaker 3: (06:01)
no, I get that everyday patients come in and go, I was referred here but you're an eye doctor, how can you help my brain injury?

Speaker 1: (06:08)
Right. Well how about the symptoms? I mean you kind of said some of them for young kids, you know, like, and even for yourself, like you were doing great and then all of a sudden things, you know, like things stopped matching up or things stopped working correctly. Like, what are some of the symptoms that both children and then maybe even adults would be like, wait a second, that might be me. You know what I mean? Yeah, that's a great question. Yeah.

Speaker 3: (06:31)
Um, it's interesting because children sometimes don't understand their symptoms because that's their normal. And so symptoms are a little different in kids. You have to ask lots of questions. Um, and then they go, Oh, you mean that's not right? And so the thing I look for in kids, especially if the eyes aren't lining up, I always ask about double vision words moving on the page. If they lose their place, if they get done reading a page and forget what they read, um, we look at me, I know, right? Big time. And I also talked about headaches. Vision, headaches happen in two places. They happen frontally right here. And then they'll happen at the back of the neck. And people always go, well, how can a vision headache happen at the top of your neck? Well, if you're holding your head in a funny posture, trying to figure out a place where your eyes will line up or make it clear, well then your neck is sore because it's holding this huge head of yours of funky. And you guys

Speaker 1: (07:29)
absolutely. Um, you know the thing that when you, when you talked about that as far as like kids doing well at a certain age and then all of a sudden there's this decline. I'm curious if, you know, any statistics of kids who just get lumped into this category of, you know, special education, right? Where they just, they need a special plan and curriculum for them because they're just not at that normal level in terms of reading and testing and all that stuff. What percentage would you save if you were to guess or maybe, you know, this fall into the category as a direct or indirect result of some of these things? So it's [inaudible]

Speaker 3: (08:04)
interesting. They actually say that, um, every child that's in special ed should have a good, thorough visual examination and not a quick 10, 15 minute I check, can you see the letters far away? But to find out, they actually say it's as high as about 60%. Um, it's interesting because like my mentor practiced in San Diego and the San Diego school district will actually pay for vision therapy because they've found it so much cheaper to fix a kid in third grade than to keep them in special ed for the next nine years of their Scholastic career. Oh wow. Right. That makes a huge difference there. Yeah, it actually does. It's, it's fascinating. Um, they, the national PTA put out a statistic years ago that said one in four kids has a vision issue that affects their ability to read and learn. And if you think about 25% and you know you that there's not a lot of developmental optometrists out there. I'm the only board certified developmental optometrist in the state

Speaker 1: (09:02)
and the entire state of Idaho. It's crazy. That is crazy. Wow. You know, it's funny you say that, cause you know my, I didn't even know this until probably five, 10 years ago. My dad, he said, he says, I had an instance when I was in grade school. He says, my teacher said I was the dumbest kid she had ever met and he didn't find out until after getting made. Hey, you made it all the way through high school, managed to, you know, just eke it out. You know? And it was, the whole thing was a struggle. He found out after he graduated that he had processing issues with reading and an issue. And so it was like, here he was, he thought he was stupid, you know? And it was just because of a teacher saying, you're a dummy, you know, and you know, that's a horrible thing. So doubt. Well, obviously you focus a lot of attention on concussions. Um, what would you say for parents, um, are some things that you do to help with that area? And I, I guess maybe a better question is what's kind of the general accepted kind of standard of care right now in terms of concussion recovery? You know,

Speaker 3: (10:07)
well, the best tests that you can do for a concussion, and let's talk about testing because we have to diagnose a concussion. Self-reporting of a concussion is the worst diagnostic criteria pay. How do you feel you fill in? Okay, yeah, coach put me back in. And then they go back in and they get a second hit. And now we're dealing with second hit syndrome, which is a whole other topic, right? Um, one of the best things you can do for a concussion, especially for yourself, for your children, is to have a processing speed check. Because if your brain is under some sort of duress, your information processing is going to be reduced. There's a test we run in our office called the Dem or the development time movement test. There's another one called the King [inaudible] and the King DVBIC. Recently I'm joined forces with the impact test.

Speaker 3: (10:54)
Um, all it does is it looks at eye tracking and it measures how long it takes you to track your eyes process information. There's the ran, which is the random random automaticity of number naming correlated with eye tracking. And if you're in the middle of a sporting event, um, it's a perfect sideline test. So when you're in the middle of a sporting event and they run that test with your adrenaline up and if you're pumped for the game, your speed should be faster than sitting in my office. But if it's slower at all, we've got to pull you from the game. We've got to figure out what happened, what's going on. Because what we don't want is that second hit syndrome. Right. You know, with the typical concussion, um, and well I assume everybody knows it typically takes about two weeks to recover. A concussion is normal. So when we talk about concussion, let's, do you mind if we talk about the pathophysiology that happens with the kids?

Speaker 1: (11:49)
Sure. No, that, that, that's totally fine. I think the thing, just back one quick before, no, no, no, no, no. I was just going to say, you know, in terms of looking at it from a mile up, the problem with the current state of things that you're saying that you just said is subjective tests. Don't give us an accurate picture because there's, there's a hidden agenda or not a hidden agenda, but there's a clear bias in terms of the individual. They're not going to want to be sidelined from the game. And so subjectively, when you ask them, you know, and a lot of these questionnaires are purely just that, is these subjective assessments? Do you have headache? Do you have blurred vision? Do you have [inaudible]? Are you experiencing these things? And they're like, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, not really. You know, I'm, I'm good.

Speaker 1: (12:30)
You know, like, get me back in the game. Whereas what you're talking about here is objective performance to base measures that give us a clear and very accurate, unbiased picture of what's really happening. And so parents need to be aware of that so that they can know that, you know, if, if, if the doctor or whoever is assessing your child or you, if it's you, um, you know, the, that just asking subjective questions is not going to get to the heart of the matter. So, so dig in further then in terms of the pathophysiology of concussion. Right. I'm glad he's here to clarify what I say.

Speaker 3: (13:04)
And one thing I thought of when he was talking is these two tests I'm talking about, they're eye tracking tests, but looking at information processing while you're moving your eyes. So it's a divided attention type test, right? And so the pathophysiology that happens when you have a concussion, if you think about your skull, it's about the consistency of concrete. And then the brains the consistency of jello. If something hits that, that skull, the school's gonna move and the brain stationary, so the brain hits against the wall, or the head's moving and a hit against another object and the brain moves and runs into the wall of the brain or the of the skull. Well, everybody thinks about the actual impact site as where the damage happens. What we don't think about is the tension on all the neurons coming up through from the spinal cord up into the head.

Speaker 3: (13:55)
And if that brain gets twisted and turned, there's all that tension that happens. If you have a very severe head injury, sure you're going to have bleeding on the brain, you're going to have some ripping, tearing of the tissue. But what if you just have a single nerve who gets twisted or bent and now it can't send the signal because the microtubules are broken? Well, now you lost a pathway that will never be picked up on an MRI. It will never be picked up. We have to look at function, right? So if we can look at objective functioning, we can find out, Hey, there's some deficits. Now let's figure out what it is and let's figure out how to rehab them. Um, they're now saying that concussions don't have to necessarily be a head hit, but any hit on your body that causes that pressure to change, kind of like whiplash or even a bad football hit, the head's stationary body starts moving and now you get that torsion or that polling on all these neurons.

Speaker 1: (14:56)
Right? And that's, that's really surprised. I think that's surprising to hear. You know, that, that it does. Most people equate concussion and that would make total sense. You either knock heads with somebody else, you get your head knocked into something, you fall, you know, that sort of thing. But you're exactly right. You know, any sort of force that's going to take the body one way and the head and neck, you know, I mean it's, I keep thinking of that, uh, what's that movie? So she married an ax murder where he's talking about his son with a massive head, like an orange on a toothpick is, you know, uh, that's what our heads are though, right? They, they weigh a a significant amount and so there's, there's this weight and so, uh, you know, you're vulnerable to a lot of those issues. You know, a lot of people, especially when they come in after accidents, they don't hit their head on anything, but they have this brain fog, that cloudiness, which is that, that first symptom, I think this easy to be.

Speaker 1: (15:48)
It's just like, you can't, you can't carry on, uh, you lose your train of thought easily. You know what I mean? Like just, yeah, you're like, man, I just don't feel like I can, you know, you know, roll like I normally would. So the standard of care right now currently is such where it's just kind of a wait it out and hope everything heals and then looking at again, symptoms or absence of symptoms. If there's no more headaches, if there's uh, no more pain, no more fatigue, et cetera, et cetera, you're good to go as typically kind of a the standard approach.

Speaker 3: (16:20)
Well that's typically what you hear about is Hey, stay in a dark room for a couple of days. No TV, no cell phone, no reading. Um, what we found is if a concussion is going to heal on its own, usually takes about two weeks. First couple of days. You do want to avoid tasks that cause increased pressure, headaches, increased brain fog. But then after a couple of days you want to slowly start introducing things back in, especially for kids at about two weeks. They're back at school, they're back doing homework. It's the patients that it takes longer than two weeks. Those are the patients we really want to talk about because they're the ones that aren't self healing and they're the ones that usually fall through the cracks. A lot of my patients, they've been dealing with their post-concussion issues for five, six years. By the time they come in to see me, I am definitely the last box they're checking,

Speaker 1: (17:16)
right. They've gone through all the other different people. Chances are they probably seen medical doctors, chiropractors, physical therapists, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Yeah, you name it.

Speaker 3: (17:26)
And it's interesting because people don't usually think about the eye doctor as fixing a concussion cause we think of glasses and contacts. But if you think about the visual system and the visual pathway, it traverses from the eyeball back to the primary visual cortex and then it comes back forward to process all the information. And so when we start looking at that, then my job, it takes me about two, two and a half hours to do a thorough evaluation, which I have to do on multiple days because these patients don't have the stamina before it get fatigued. Sure. Yeah. Um, then we could start to figure out, Hey, where are the deficits? What do we have to put back together? Um, what can you do? 70% of all sensory information comes in through our visual system. And so there's not a part of the brain that's not primarily or secondarily involved in vision.

Speaker 3: (18:14)
Vision is pervasive in the brain. And so when we start looking at that, we can start to figure out what's going on. A lot of my patients have trouble teaming their eyes, tracking their eyes, focusing. Um, a lot of times they're, their filters are, are broken. So all the sensory information comes in and they don't know what's good information and what's bad. So sometimes they filter out things that they need to pay attention to and they pay attention to noise. It's kinda like, okay, right now, do you feel your feet inside your shoes? Can you feel your shoes right? But did you three minutes ago, right? Because you weren't paying attention to it, you filtered it out. Well, sometimes after a concussion, sometimes the brain fog, the way I relate it is you don't know what to pay attention to. One, not to say you're paying attention to all this background noise that needs to be ignored.

Speaker 3: (19:06)
And so a lot of it is even knowing what information to process or pay attention to. That sounds exhausting. Very much so. Um, a lot of my patients are at their wit's end, let's be honest. Oh, sure. Yeah. Yeah. They're frustrated with life and so what we have to do is we have to make them feel comfortable. Um, if you think about the typical symptoms of what you'd imagined PTSD to be, I don't feel like myself, I can't do what I used to be able to do. Or a spouse might go, they just act different. I used to be able to rely on them if I said, Hey, I need you to run to the store after work and do this. They come home without doing that because they can't remember. They're so overwhelmed and exhausted just doing their activities of daily life. Right. It's like the brain is in survival mode.

Speaker 3: (19:53)
Just trying to do what it can to cope with anything. So. So w in a general sense, I mean obviously we could be here for hours talking about it, but what are some of the things that you typically will do to help, um, kids and or adults for that matter, uh, recover from concussions at your office? Great question. So the first thing we do is we do what's called awareness of process. We show them how it feels to line up their eyes to focus, to track. We want them to start to fill it, all the things that we take for granted so that they can learn how to control everything. Again, we teach them how to process information. We do a lot of puzzles, we do transpositions, Hey, how would this look flipped upside down, side to side. We start to get their brain processing information and we give them feedback loops because I need to teach a patient how to self monitor and self correct. Because if they're at work and that brain fog comes on, Hey, what do you do? Okay, okay. When this happens, I've got to get up. I've got to go get a drink. I've got to disconnect from the activity that's causing the symptom reset myself. Now I can come back and work for another half an hour. Does that make [inaudible]?

Speaker 1: (20:59)
Sure. Yeah. It almost sounds very similar to like what an occupational therapist would do for, for like a stroke victim or whatever in the physical realm, in terms of manual [inaudible] teach, teaching them how to use those motor skills. Again, you know, you're basically doing that for the eyes is what it sounds like a very similar process. It's very similar. Yeah, that's powerful. So kind of moving away from the clinical side, I would assume I know kind of what you love about what you do based on what you're saying. I mean that sounds like pretty rewarding, but I'll let you kind of answer that question. You know, what is it that you love most about what you do?

Speaker 3: (21:36)
I like being able to fix patients. The other professionals have said, this is all we can do. I like being able to take a person and make them so that they can function life again. I want to give them their life back and day in, day out when we see that happen, I go home well and sleep well. That's awesome. Um,

Speaker 1: (21:55)
we had an episode, uh, not, not too long ago where we talked about, you know, one of the greatest disservices that doctors can do for their patients is putting these very, um, stringent kind of caps on, you know, you'll never be able to do this again. You'll never be able to go to the gym or to play football, whatever. You know what I mean? Things that you used to do that you enjoyed there, they'd be like, Oh, because of this injury, you can't do this. We had a, we had a patient, uh, uh, who came in, um, about six months ago and he, he had some lower back issues he's had, he had on his x-rays, some degeneration and some other things like that. Uh, he younger guy, I think in his late thirties, um, but he was told by a doctor that he would never be able to play sports again, that he was going to be virtually crippled by the age he was by the time he was like in his forties is pretty much what the doctor told him.

Speaker 1: (22:51)
And so he was in this state of like constant fear of like his life was just this ticking time bomb that once he got to, you know what I mean? He was resigned to the fact that in his forties, he was going to be disabled, you know? Yeah. Just disabled, you know? And so it's, it's powerful when you can get doctors who are willing to help people break through those kind of mental and emotional barriers. And it sounds like a lot of your job is doing that with patients, really helping, um, exceed expectations, you know, that they might have fixing the unfixable. Yeah. That's awesome. Amazing. Um, so for those who are watching, who are local here, um, and that say they or someone they love a child or whatever, they're like, man, a lot of the things that he's talking about sounds like our situation or, or they just know, yeah, my son sustained a concussion or daughter sustained concussion. Um, how would be the best way for them to reach out,

Speaker 3: (23:48)
do you? Um, the easiest way is to go to our website. It's focused idaho.com and all of our office information's there. If they're not local, the best website to go to is cob D. dot org and that's the college of optometrists and vision development. Okay. And you say find a doctor and that has a nationwide search worldwide. Actually they will find a doctor that's closest to you. How many are there worldwide would you say? There's about 550 of us that are board certified. Okay. So basically like

Speaker 1: (24:23)
a handful in every state pretty much is what that is. So. Wow. That's crazy. Um, wow. So, uh, and, and we've been, I've, I've been to, uh, Dr. Lewis, his office. It's a state of the art facility, brand new facility. Amazing. Um, you've got a full basketball court in there for athletes to be able to train on and do specific drills there. Some other cool equipment that I didn't even recognize or know what it did, but it was awesome looking. Um, yeah, it's, it's amazing. It really is an amazing facility. And so, uh, Dr. Lewis has, is able to help a lot of, uh, patients that a lot of other doctors quite frankly, aren't able to help. And so, um, you know, hopefully if nothing else from this episode, what happens is you become less of the last resort and now more of a, Oh, you know, I'm just gonna put this away in the back of my head that if I notice this, we'll call Dr. Lewis in his office sooner or a, a, a vision development. A optometrist is, did I say that right? Vision. Developmental developmental optometrist. Right. So, um, any other final thoughts on this? Anything you want to share? Dr. Lewis? No, just thanks for your time and thanks for letting me come on. Yeah, no, awesome. It was awesome having you, man. Uh, yeah. If you guys know, uh, somebody that could benefit from this, share it with them. Subscribe to the podcast, uh, holler at Dr. Lewis. Uh, if you or someone you know, needs help and we'll talk to you guys on the next episode. Have a good one.

Speaker 2: (25:49)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here. I'm Dr. Buddy Allen and this is episode 39 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we have our good friend and special guest, Brett Hughes with us. He's going to be talking with us about goals, transformation and modeling success. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:16)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. Buddy Allen. And this show is about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:35)
All right, everybody. So we're super excited about today's episode. Um, we're not actually talking about modeling in terms of Brett as a model, although I'm sure you could be. No. Um, we're actually going to be talking with Brett here, uh, about a recent experience that he had, uh, with, uh, a really a significant transformation. But, uh, we wanted to kind of extrapolate that a little bit bigger in terms of, uh, not just physical health, but other areas of health as well and other areas of life. Um, because we were talking about this, uh, Brett, Brett and I actually go way, way back. We've known each other for golly, over a decade, haven't we? Yeah, it's been awhile. I think we met at Russell's. We did. We did like 10 years ago. Yeah. Yeah. Well this was back in the day. Uh, so, so, so Brett is, we were saying just before the interview, Brett is an actual serial entrepreneur.

Speaker 1: (01:25)
Um, sometimes people like to use that term serial entrepreneur when they're just people that like to start things and not finish things. But bread actually starts things and finishes things. In fact, he's had a handful of extremely successful businesses right now. Uh, one of your businesses is Boise premiere real estate. Um, people who live here in the treasure Valley. You'd be blind not to know or hear about, uh, Boise premiere. You guys are one of the fastest growing brokerage firms, is that correct? Yeah, that's right. You might notice the lion signs. Yes. That's kind of like the distinguishing factor. Yeah, I know it's a great logo. So, uh, I guess to get started with, uh, maybe just give those who are listening or watching a little bit of a background, who you are, kind of what your story is. So, Oh man, it's one of those things like you, you don't know where it started, right? Like even when I was a little kid, I would wake up early and rake leaves if it was fall or I would, you know, deal with shovel walks or whatever if it was winter. So I was always just like an opportunistic kid. Sure. And I'd try to drag my friends or my brother who typically didn't want to be a part of it, right. Because even we were little kids, I would make him be the secretary.

Speaker 1: (02:30)
But that was the kind of the idea is like, I've just always been like financially motivated. And so I think even when I was attending Boise state, I started flipping some houses and I really liked real estate and I was cognizant that so many people had made so much money in real estate. So I really want to be a part of it. What'd you go to school for in Boise state business management. Okay. Okay. I started out in accounting because I was like, it's the ultimate language of business. I'm like, I've got to do it. But really quickly, I remember teachers like, Hey, Brett, stay after class today. I'm like, all right, cool. She's like, you're not an accountant. I'm like, all right, I appreciate that. Thank you. She's like, that was the intervention you needed. It really was asking some question like why would we keep track of this? And she's like, see me after class.

Speaker 1: (03:14)
You're not cut out for this. No. And I knew it wasn't. I just wanted to learn. Sure. No, no, no. That's good. Um, so fast forward now, uh, you had a really successful carpet cleaning business. That's kind of when we met. Right? Um, is that still an existence? He had told us still in existence. I sold it to my brother and he just, he runs that. But real estate has always been my thing. I actually went to that course cause I had to think of like one business in particular, which was challenging. And so I chose carpet cleaning, but it's never been my focus development, real estate brokerage and, and even like new construction has always been my big focus. And so in terms of, uh, w we'll just use this as a, a feather in your cap bragging moment. That's okay. We can kind of give you the [inaudible].

Speaker 1: (03:55)
What are some cool things, accomplishments and or accolades, things that Boise premier has done. It's one of the fastest growing, isn't it? Not. Yeah. Well, okay. So in real estate it's really challenging to start your own independent brokerage. But I was so dumb or naive that I didn't realize that would be such a challenge. So even in my business, sometimes ignorance can be a good thing in that regard. Right. You know, you don't have your own limiting beliefs getting in the way. 100 per seriously. Yeah. So I worked for a small brokerage downtown, an amazing broker, but it was one of those places where you just show up, you call her when you need a question and that's it. And so I thought brokerage looks like that, right? Cause that's, she had a bunch of agents all very similar to me. So when I started my own, I'm like, Whoa, these guys are needy.

Speaker 1: (04:36)
They need a lot of stuff. But, um, but I loved it and I really liked the, um, I love the agents. I love their entrepreneurial mindset. And so, you know, my first goal was 50 agents and then a certain number of transactions, and then it turned to a hundred and then it was 150 and now it's 200 and we're right at two a hundred right now. Wow. So, yeah, it's like, let's see, 10 years then it's like 10 years. But it was like, it's a lot like this transformation. It was the physical transformation. It was fun and it wasn't like dreadful in the, in the moment. But we're looking back on it. It would, I wouldn't want to do it again. Right. That's, that's how I look at Moe school. That's how I look at starting the practice. That's how I look at a lot of things.

Speaker 1: (05:14)
That's so true. So, so tell us kind of a little bit about your experience recently. You had a really cool experience with, uh, you know, uh, physical transfer, bicycle transportation, health, transportation, w tell us about kind of what sparked that in the first place and kind of the journey and the story. Okay. So my wife has done a couple of these. Okay. And she is extremely driven. Like when she sets out to do something, she does it. Okay. And so I was like watching what she was eating and her and her, um, exercise. And I was like, wow, this looks really hard. I wonder if I'm paused, if, if, if I could do it. So I just kind of put that in the back of my mind. And then we're in Hawaii. We go there each winter at a certain time. Like in January. Don't blame you.

Speaker 1: (05:52)
Yeah. Boise's cold. Yeah. Kind of January. And I remember we were at this beautiful waterfall. Okay. And there's this rope swing and I was doing these backflips and so I wanted to see the picture and the video. Okay. So the very first video I look at, I'm like, huh, that's a bad angle. I look kind of chubby and then I looked at this camera's doing weird things. Yeah. Is doing weird things. Cause as guys, we look in the mirror straight on, we don't look at the sides. Right? Right. And so I look at another picture and I'm like, wait a second. And then I asked my wife, I'm like, do I look like this? And she's like, yeah, why? And I'm like, Oh my gosh, I'm chubby. I didn't even know this. And I remember distinctly thinking like I'm a Boise state football fan, right?

Speaker 1: (06:30)
Yeah. I'm like, I'm six two, 205 pounds. That's like that's what an athlete it looks like. No, not exactly. My formation was much different than a rock solid, you know? And so it kind of like that was a spur where I'm like, okay, like you're getting older, this stuff, age is not going to like, you know, it takes everybody so you have to do something, otherwise you're going to be that guy. Right. And so that was kind of the catalyst for you? That was like the defining moment that, yes. And so what did you do at that point then? What did you decide? What did you, so I do the same thing every time. I'm trying to figure anything out, right? I want to find out who's done it successfully, who has been the smartest at it and who can actually help me. Okay. So for this one it was easy because I saw the transformation my wife made.

Speaker 1: (07:15)
Now she's always been in good shape, but she went to exceptional shape and so on. And I remember thinking like Eric at Mecca, he had a really good approach to it. So you could, you would track your macros, which is proteins, carbohydrates, and fats. And you wasn't like you to have the same thing every single day. You had some flexibility. Right. And Megan was drinking water the whole time. Like it wasn't like she was dehydrated or like unhealthy in any way. And then even after the competition he brought her back out slowly, like you reverse diet back out. And I thought it was like a really careful, thoughtful, um, approach. So I started working with him and when I first went there I was just kind of working out and getting stronger and getting better and then find that decided let's just do it. Let's just turn up the heat and see if we can, you know, if I can actually do one of these competitions.

Speaker 1: (07:59)
Right. So couple of things cause I want to talk about that competition. Um, you said something at the beginning of there that I think we need to kind of back up just a little bit so people can kind of pull some, some value out of this. Not just in terms of the physical value or physical transformation, but the, your first inclination was to find someone who already had a proven track record or a proven method. And that's what we mean by modeling. We were joking at the beginning about modeling, you know, yeah. As he let her style. Um, but, but, but this idea of modeling is a common denominator that you will find amongst the most successful people in just about any endeavor, whether it be physical health transformation, whether it be a mental or emotional health transformation, whether that be, uh, you know, improvements that they want to make in business or any other goals that people want to set and achieve.

Speaker 1: (08:54)
Um, you've got basically in general two choices. You can either forge that path and be a pioneer, good luck to you and more power to you. That's, that's amazing. Or the other approach that you took, which I think most people would find a wiser approach and a better expenditure and use of energy would be to find a proven method and just model that and do things more over. Um, when you really look at this, so many people actually look at themselves or think of themselves as I, you know, like I fit outside of this box of, um, it worked for him, but it probably won't work for me. Right. So I'm an exception. Yes. I'm the exception, not the rule when, what your saying is, it's absolutely the rule. Every time you've ever been successful, it's been, when you've found someone to model that was already successful, you do what they do and you get similar results.

Speaker 1: (09:46)
And just thinking about like how many years they've put in to their craft, there's no way I can catch up, right? Nope. So why don't I just pay them and get the result? Like it just seems so much easier. You know what's funny about that is, is that's my secret to success with fishing. Is that, uh, Albertson's, no, no, no. That's a really cut in the middle man. Now I'm not that bad up Noah. I've got a good buddy of mine out in Washington that, that buddy and I go, Dr. Allen and I go fishing with every year and he is a pro. I mean he is just, he is a seasoned pro. He's been doing it for, uh, two decades plus and you name it. He's, he knows how to catch it. And so we just go with him. And every time we go, we, we catch fish.

Speaker 1: (10:32)
It accelerates the learning process and makes it really easy for us. Instead. It's a lot more fun. So yeah. And it's a lot more fun. Instead of spending your time not catching anything, you actually go and catch stuff. So, uh, you know, at the end of the day, I think we're, we're, again, we're talking about this idea of, you know, how do you want to expend that energy and you could expend that energy in learning process and there's no Downing that for people if that's what they're want to do. You know, they want to really devote themselves to that process and uh, and, and do that, that there's, there's no shame in that or no problem in that. But for people who want to accelerate that, uh, whatever transformation you're looking for, um, a far more efficient, that's the word I would use as efficient approach is exactly what you did in what are the chances that you're going to be equally motivated as that guy to get the learning.

Speaker 1: (11:20)
Right. And I remember when I started wasting premiere, we, my business partner at the time, we basically split up five or six people that we would call and we would talk to them about their model and we made sure they're outside of our state so they didn't have any, they didn't care if we succeeded or failed. Right. And then we took the top two and visit him. So we actually went to Denver and Utah and we visited them and we looked at their location, what their office staff looked like, how they did it. And it was like, okay, just do what they did. Right. And so far so good. Yeah. I mean and making minor changes, but for the most part you're not reinventing the wheel. Right, right. That's huge. So tell us a little bit about the actual contest that you entered, kind of that experience.

Speaker 1: (11:57)
What was that like? What did you do to prepare for it? A little bit more detail there. Yeah, so it was interesting, like the actual working out is not that much different on a daily basis of what I did before. Okay. So it might be like 45 minutes to an hour or something like that. So not crazy. The diet was a little bit more challenging because I had a couple of really bad habits. One, I didn't have enough protein in my diet. So before I actually was cognizant of this has probably happened like 60 70 grams of protein a day. And for like, uh, you know, a male, you've got to have like at least our body weight and when you're trying to do something like this or trying to keep around 200 grams of protein. So that was a quick adjustment to, I love dr pepper.

Speaker 1: (12:35)
Well, one of those little cans is 42 carbs. Okay. So if you're only getting 150 carbs a day, what are the chances of you drink one by the way? Right? Pretty low. So you're wasting your energy and your, your carbs on these drinks. So it was kind of nice because something I didn't think I'd ever be able to kick the habit of. And I actually listened to one of your guys's podcasts on the addiction one and I was like thinking about some of the, just the things you do daily, daily, you know, so those were two big pieces. But the nice thing about the workouts is that they were programmed and so they're on like eight week or 16 week blocks. And so you don't think about that either. Like I don't know if it's going to be like three sets of two today or if it's going to be five sets of 50.

Speaker 1: (13:16)
I mean not that you would do that, but do you know what I mean? Like a program for you? Right. So that took some of the mental energy away from the whole process. You didn't have to expend that. You know, when, when I did CrossFit, that was one of the nice things that I liked about CrossFit was I would joke with people and say, I liked doing CrossFit cause I'm lazy. And that sounds paradoxical, but the thing that's nice about it is when you have somebody do the programming for you, um, that's just one. And, and, and you wouldn't think that that portion of, of the process is, is a big deal, but mental energy is a huge part of it. And you actually hit a really solid point is I think more people are way more capable of achieving these types of goals. But the problem is because they don't have a plan that's already laid out.

Speaker 1: (14:01)
Yes. What happens is, uh, they, they're great all day long. All right? They make good choices in the morning, all day long during work. And then by the time that the end of the day comes, they're beat down, they're tired, then maybe they're a little stressed. And at that point that there's actually a physical thing called decision fatigue where you start making poor decisions because you're just tired. And so if the decisions already made, if the plan is already there, it makes it infinitely more likely that you're going to achieve that goal because you don't even have to think about it. It's already there. It's kind of like a presetting up, the bumpers in bowling, you know, before you start bowling, you know you don't have the gutter that you're going to go into. It's just kinda like, yeah, you've got that, you know, plan in place to kind of keep you in that lane in that path.

Speaker 1: (14:48)
And it's fascinating too, cause you, you seeing food in a different way. It's more of like a fuel. You can still have fun with it and it's still good and everything. But I realized at night I would grab like a bowl of ice cream. Okay. Right. So, and it wasn't terrible. Ice cream wasn't like high fat. It was like actually like three and a half grams of fat. Not bad, but it's 30 cars. Right. We'll even a bowl of cereal. One cup of, of cereal is like 35 carbs. So if you're done for the day, like if you've had your 200 grams of protein, you've had your 150 carbs and you're at 60 grams of fat, well you can't have 30 more. Right. And you've logged it all in your phone, you know, you like, there's a bunch of like free apps for that. And it was just, it just took the decision making away, which was nice.

Speaker 1: (15:30)
Yeah, it was just one last thing you had to expend energy on and thinking about. Right. So what was the name of the competition that you enrolled in it? Was it a, was it a, it wasn't a bodybuilding competition was, what was it? So there is bodybuilding there. So it's like, it's called, those is called the Idaho cap. Okay. And so there's like serious bodybuilders and then there's like classic bodybuilders and then there's men's physique. So this is men's physique. So it's like, you know, it's like the lowest of that group, but you're going for a different look. Right. It's more of like the athletic lean look as opposed to like a big and writing. Yeah. You're not trying to put on a massive amount of size. Yeah. So, um, what are some other lessons that you learned from this whole experience and so many lessons for one.

Speaker 1: (16:13)
I know that's kind of an open ended broad question. I guess the biggest one, like specifically to this. Okay. Two things. One, it's another, um, it's another good experience of like success leading to more success. Right? So you've done something, you followed it, you could do it, right. Yeah. So that was nice. It's just, you're just compounding it now it's like, okay, what else could I do? Right. Which is great also for this particular piece as far as the physical, your relationship with food is very fascinating. Yeah, no doubt. Eat out of boredom. You eat out of debt. It's their stress stress in the way that the modern house is set up. The kitchen is usually a center point of any house, right? I mean, great rooms in particular. And so like you're like walking by the pantry and you're just like, Oh, what's in there.

Speaker 1: (17:01)
So it's just fascinating. Like even like our modern lifestyle. Yeah. You said something there that I want to touch on that I thought was really important. I'm a good friend of mine. Uh, he has a saying and I've loved, this is like stuck with me ever since I heard it. I just heard it. On a month ago. Um, he said, how you do one thing is how you do everything. And I think that's such an important point that you touched on there, that you know that again, you're using this as [inaudible]. And the term that I use a lot of times is personal legitimacy. You know, I'd say for a lot of us, that's something I think most people can relate to and struggle with is that our work, it's far easier to, for most people, to break their word to themselves than it is to another person.

Speaker 1: (17:40)
If I promised you something, it's gonna happen, you know, because that's my integrity that's on the line. That's my word on the line that, you know, but I can promise things to myself and no one's gonna know, you know, I can, I can, I can break those promises all day long. And so the, the point that you talk about, they're, they, how you do one thing is how you do everything. Meaning, you know, that you, you, you're going to use that success in other domains of your life as well as, uh, as fuel, as a catalyst, as evidence, uh, to really strengthen what we, what I call personal legitimacy, that, that when you say you're going to do something, it means something. There's, there's, there's teeth to that, you know, and this seriousness level stepped up once you signed up. Right, right. So it was like three months before and the three months is the hardest part because you're starting to like now you're lowering your carbs and it starting to become more challenging and, but there was like this not, it wasn't a carrot, it was like embarrassment.

Speaker 1: (18:35)
Right, right. And it's like, Oh I do not want to show up and be that guy. You know what I mean? So like the embarrassment level popped in cause you, you made a commitment and I made a, Kim came into my, to my friend who challenged me to do it, but then at the same time it was like, okay, now it's real. Right, right. Making things real. That's a huge part of it too. You know, cause I think for a lot of people to uh, you know, the, the saying easy come easy go, comes to mind, you know, that if you don't put some skin in the game, it's a lot easier to kind of back out of it, you know? Whereas when you, like you said it got real when you signed up, you know, so I know that it's been your, your experience with running Roby.

Speaker 1: (19:12)
Right. I despise running and I've always known I've tried it and I've done it lots of times and everyone always would say, Oh, once you do it enough, you're going to love it. I never ever found that love. Okay. That point. But I knew I needed to get better lungs and better kind of like you said, I'm getting older, I want to be able to keep up with my kids. And uh, it was one day I was like, I heard an advertisement or saw an advertisement. It's like Roby Creek signup is today. And I'm like, and it was like 10 minutes away. I'm like, Oh, well if I'm going to get better at running, I better sign up. I mean I need some, I need some motivation. And what's funny about that is you didn't have any clue at that time how difficult it is to actually get into it.

Speaker 1: (19:49)
And you're like, I've never, never run a race in my life. Anytime sells out in like seven minutes. And part of me saying I'm going to sign up for it. I was thinking, I'm not going to get in. Cause everyone said it was so hard and when I hit enter and it says, Oh, congratulations. I'm like, Oh crap. What? Like a real, real quick. Yeah, no, no, no. So yeah, I could feel your pain there. Yeah. So, um, you know, I know you're a busy guy, Brett, and so we appreciate you being here with us today. Uh, I think you've shared, you know, it's, it's, it's interesting when we first invited you on the podcast, you know, this is this being the health fundamentals podcast. I think for people, if they knew who you were, they'd be like, well yeah, he's a real estate broker.

Speaker 1: (20:28)
What does that have to do with health? You know? But I think there's a lot that we can draw from, not just this experience, but other business experiences that you've had in terms of, uh, some powerful life lessons that I think people can take and utilize. And so I'm hoping that for those either watching or listening, they gleaned some nuggets that I think are here for them to take. You know, you shared some really profound wisdom, uh, that I think could really change a lot of people's lives. And so we hope that that's, you know, for those listening, for that one person, that, that hears just that one thing that they need just to make that, that little shift or big shift in their life, whatever it is, um, for a dramatic difference for them. I think you've, you've, you've shared a lot of great stuff.

Speaker 1: (21:06)
Um, any closing thoughts, Dr. Allen bread? Anything you want to include? Any, any favorite sayings for life? Any words of wisdom and partying? Tom, man, I should've thought about this. I love reading. I mean, I really liked the compound effect. Oh man. The whole idea of like, I mean, there's so many good books. I can think of, but as far as a parting gift is just like when I think of the compound effect, it's like remember the spot where they have the three people? Yes. The one who makes the slight improvement, the one who does nothing. And the one who makes a negative improvement, right? Or negative, whatever you said, some sort of negative thing. And it's like you can't tell anything after a year. You can barely tell anything after two years, but it was three years where they all separate. Right. And I just think about that.

Speaker 1: (21:45)
Like that's, that's the whole fundamental, but I'm trying to do, like, I'm not going to beat anyone being the fastest or strongest whatever, but I've been really consistent throughout the years and that's where I can win, you know? And I think that's where anyone can win is just by being consistent. You know, it's, it's, it's powerful that you end on that because our mantra, uh, on the health fundamentals podcast, this whole podcast is based around what we call five fundamentals of health. The first being that health comes from the inside. The second being what you just said there, that we're going to be, we're going to be most likely to achieve whatever it is we want with our health. When our approach is one of simplicity and consistency, it's huge. You know, and then it goes on from there. But that, but that's really it. You know, what you're talking about here is so in harmony and we and you didn't even know that. So that was like perfect. So, um, anyways, uh, hope this has been valuable for you guys and if you know other people that could benefit from this or other episodes, obviously subscribe to the podcast, share it with them and we look forward to sharing with you more. Great information moving forward on the next episode and even more to come. So thanks again, uh, to Brett here for being with us. We'll talk to you guys later.

Speaker 2: (22:49)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop. And in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here. I'm Dr. Buddy Allen and this is episode 38 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we are here with our good friend and special guests, Dr. Chuck riddle. And he's going to be talking with us about balance and the vestibular system. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:15)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. Buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:35)
So, Hey everybody, uh, we want to welcome our good friend, dr Chuck riddle here with us. Thanks for being here with us, Dr. Riddle. Thanks. Thanks for having me. Appreciate it. Yeah. Um, so we go back quite a ways. In fact, it's been a while since we last chatted. Uh, a lot has changed over the years. Um, but, uh, Dr. Riddle and I, um, Kelly hasn't been nearly 10 years ago, almost 10 years, almost a decade. Um, we started working together, uh, collaborating with patients. Uh, it was a lot of fun to be able to, uh, to refer patients over to him and get referrals back. And, um, there was definitely some overlap in terms of what he did and what we did, but obviously his expertise and experience in physical therapy, uh, came in handy for a lot of the more challenging cases in those realms where we just needed some, uh, some help and maybe even another set of eyes to look at those things. But, uh, so we kind of go way, way, way back. But, um, obviously your story starts even further back from there. So for those watching, uh, I guess the first question maybe tell us a little bit about your story in terms of what got you into physical therapy in the first place. Obviously your physical therapist, um, over at I can, uh, I can be is that I can physical therapy. Um, so kind of give us a synopsis of, of where your story begins.

Speaker 3: (01:49)
Um, it goes way back to when I was in high school and junior high. I was very active. Um, I had some health issues at the time, specifically with running and, uh, saw a few physicians that really made, made my life kind of difficult. Um, I was hoping to go to med school and that was my plan. And, uh, in the end, um, had a couple of bad experiences that drove me towards physical therapy instead. And, uh, so went to high school, college under that same guys and ended up going all the way through and finishing a doctoral degree in physical therapy.

Speaker 1: (02:19)
You know, it's funny because it, it, uh, sounds very reminiscent of so many chiropractic stories that we, you know, uh, some pivotal experience or a set of experiences that people have either in high school or in college that really shape, uh, you know, in a very powerful way that future for them. And so you could literally insert, had an experience with a chiropractor and you, you know, it sounds so similar to so many other stories that we hear. So, uh, you know, one of the reasons why we've always loved working with Chuck over the years is that, um, and, and I know, uh, people paint chiropractors with broad brushes as well, but, but sometimes we paint physical with the broad brush of, you know, so often one of the primary complaints that we hear, uh, about physical therapists is, is that it's nothing more than like a glorified gym experience where you've got a babysitter who hands you a sheet of exercises, they go off in the corner. They do that. I'm sure you hear this too from people who didn't like their previous physical therapist. Um, Chuck obviously takes a far more hands on approach with his patients and does things maybe for those watching. Uh, what would you say are some of the key differences between your approach, uh, versus that kind of unfortunately stereotypical approach?

Speaker 3: (03:36)
Yeah, I, yeah. Unfortunately, a lot of physical therapists do have a bad name because they set people up on timers. Do this thing for a couple minutes and I'll come back to you. People get lost in the mix. And even people that I know, here's your sheet, go to it and get it done and, and we'll see you in 30 minutes. That's not our approach. It never has been my personal approach. Want to be there every minute with every patient talking with them through the process. Uh, it's very important when you're doing the things the way we do it. Um, and making sure that every posture, every exercise, every repetition is completed properly so that it's not just another exercise at the gym.

Speaker 1: (04:09)
Yeah, it's funny you say that cause I've had a patients that they'll say, I can do that at home. You know, someone you can hand me something, I can do that at home. I can go and do that to the gym. Uh, but to have someone sitting there saying, well, maybe you could, but I'm going to make sure you're doing it correctly or make sure you're activating the right muscles. Stretching the right area, whatever it might be. So that's a, that's kind of a, a major part of why you would need to see a professional is, am I doing it correctly in the first place? Right. And, and that's the key, right? What you said there is, it's not just the what of what's being done, it's the how. And that's why you're paying a professional, like a doctor of physical therapy is not for the what necessarily, but more so for the how important.

Speaker 1: (04:53)
We've all seen the funny videos on YouTube of people doing crazy exercises using equipment completely wrong. Right? So, uh, yeah, so people say, I know what I'm doing. And then you watch them at the gym and you're like, mm, maybe not. Exactly. Maybe not. Yeah. So one kind of key area, uh, that you really specialize in or focus on, uh, is balance and stability or the vestibular system. So, uh, let's first kind of maybe for those watching put in plain English, what we mean by the vestibular system and then talk kind of the importance of balance and how you focus on that.

Speaker 3: (05:28)
So the vestibular system is made up of a couple of different parts in your brain, obviously eyes, ears, and then your body and all of these parts communicate together. And if you imagine that there's kind of a traffic cop in your head telling you what is and isn't appropriate, um, it has to bring in your eyes and say, okay, what do I see? What do I, what, what's on the horizon for me? The ears tell me about movement. And then your body tells you about whether or not you're positioned or planted in space. And when those three parts correctly, you get upright balance. You get the ability to stand, walk, sit, comfortably tolerate movement patterns. If not, then you're tipping over and people wake up. You know, occasionally with that, that old spinning thing going on. If there's something that confuses your brain, like alcohol for example, you get the spins, you've heard of that before. And that's because there's some kind of confusion in that system. So your vestibular system gives you all of that information together and organizes it, analyzes it, and allows you to progress and function.

Speaker 1: (06:29)
What are some of the most common, uh, vestibular disturbance issues that you see in your practice? We see a lot of [inaudible]

Speaker 3: (06:37)
of, um, BPPV which has benign paroxysmal positional vertigo. Um, we're pretty close to a couple of primary care clinics I should say. And um, so people come in, they wake up with the spins. Like I said, they wake up just completely dizzy for a variety of reasons. And with a few simple maneuvers, we're able to get them back on track. Um, also as people age, they tend to lose balance. They tend to lose the ability to be active for whatever reason, health function or physical maladies. And so we help those individuals also restore normal balance, uh, to be more active.

Speaker 1: (07:11)
Yeah. But, you know, balance is such a, I think unsung or underlooked or over under overlooked. I'm not sure which, uh, uh, keys to overall health and function. You know, I, I don't know if you had heard of that, uh, Brazilian study that was published, uh, Kelly five, 10 years ago, something like that. The sitting, rising test, um, where basically what this test predicted was your mortality in the next five years. Basically what they did, the abbreviated version of the test, it's far more sophisticated than that what I'm saying here. But they basically assessed, could you stand and then go from a standing position to a sitting position and then a sitting position to a standing position without significant assistance or help, significant shaking, faltering, uh, balance problems or whatever. And what he found was those who scored in the lowest tier, it was a score out of 10 basically is how they scored it.

Speaker 1: (08:02)
And you're familiar with what I'm talking about, obviously. Um, and what they found was those who scored in lowest, the likelihood of them dying within the next five years was like way high. It was frightening. I mean it was scary. And, and, and the point was, without getting into the minutia or the specifics of it is the point is balance is such a huge part of our overall health and function. And, uh, and, and what we've, what we've said in our practice, cause we look at balance in a pretty simple way, um, is, is balanced, is one of the most simple windows into looking at how the brain is communicating with the body and the body with the brain. And so assessing balance and helping people restore balance to you know, full function or as close to full function as possible, um, is such a, again, I think overlooked thing that that sometimes happens, you know, with health and with well, and moreover when you look at a lot of people will look at their balance.

Speaker 1: (09:00)
Um, as they get older they're like, Oh, I've always had bad balance or my balance is getting worse or I've never been able to touch my toes. And, and it's kind of funny to be able to show people and you very much like us, we get to say, just because you haven't been able to do it doesn't mean you can't do it. They act like it's like this one, a road they've or a door they've gone through that they can't turn around and walk back through. Right. Life is just this inevitable decline, you know, cause so often we get sold that, right? Yeah. Bye bye. Bye. [inaudible] doctors, they tell us, you know, like you're just getting old either. Exactly. It's just, it's just part of aging and it just kind of like, that's like the catchall excuse for things that we don't, we're too late on the stand or lazy or too lazy to take the time to dig in further and figure those things out, you know, sink into the recliner. Right, right. Exactly. So, so what are some things, I mean in general, obviously we could talk for hours and hours, but what are some things that you do specifically to help people address balance issues? Obviously you talked a little bit about BPPV, you talked about some maneuvers and things like that, but other areas for balance. What are some, some general or specific things that you guys do to help?

Speaker 3: (10:06)
Uh, we do, we do a whole series of exercises including gait analysis to make sure that the, the patients we see are functioning as high as they can. Um, the research you're alluding to research, a lot of the research suggests that as our current baby boomers age, um, the number one predictor of, of mortality as you described is going to be a fall. And so we, we assess falls. There's about a dozen different tools that we use. Um, the timed up and go, um, turnaround tests, uh, standing tests as you said, the sit to stand test, um, that give us an idea about how your balance is. And then with eye exercises, standing exercises, even some sitting exercises, we can help them restore balance. Um, there's, there's some great stuff out there that we use. So we took a class, like I said a little bit ago and, um, we, we've been really successful with a lot of the aging population that we see. Um, we, we hope to make a change for them because that's going to be kind of the wave of the future is making sure everybody has decent balance.

Speaker 1: (11:01)
Yeah. And, and, and, and you think about such a fundamental component of function that would allow people to enjoy those years. You know, that's the irony that I see so often is that people delay and put off and make so many sacrifices for this period of time in life, you know, retirement, you know, the golden years or whatever. And we wind up seeing far too often that those are anything but golden for people that unfortunately, uh, those years are, are again, that slow and steady decline for people. And so that's got to feel or be extremely rewarding for you to see, uh, the impact that you're making in terms of helping people enjoy that time in their life. You know, at least for that population. I haven't seen, no, that's not the only population that you see with, with balance issues too. I'm, I'm assuming you probably see athletes as well and things like that

Speaker 3: (11:51)
as though young people that when they can't jump, all of a sudden they can, they're like, yeah, I can jump again. The, you know, the aging population, when they can do something they haven't done for five years, it makes a huge difference to them. They're very thankful for that.

Speaker 1: (12:02)
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So, yeah, that's important. So anyways, uh, what, let's kind of wrap up with, with one last question for you. What's one thing about what you do that's maybe a huge misnomer that would surprise people about physical therapy or at least your approach with physical therapy?

Speaker 3: (12:21)
I think the biggest, the biggest thing I see is that people come into physical therapy with the concept of I'm going to hurt. And I'm literally the biggest side effect that we can report as a physical therapist. A profession is pain, however, it's intentional pain and it's like peeling off a bandaid. You know, you've got an injury, it's got to heal, we have to cover it and keep it clean. But at some point you got to peel that bandaid off and essentially we're peeling the bandaid off to let you heal and go and do. So it may hurt a little bit, but we're going to make it fun. We're gonna make it enjoyable. We're going to probably feed you while you're at, uh, at our office. Um, and, uh, we're gonna, we're going to keep this thing really lively for you so you're not going to notice it. Like go into the gym and sweating it out at 5:00 AM this is a, this is a different experience,

Speaker 1: (13:04)
right? No, and that's good. And we've seen, we've seen what Chuck does. He makes sure that the environment there is a really inviting and friendly environment. So it's a lot of fun. And it's interesting on that note, you know, talking about pain, uh, we have such a different concept when it comes to pain. A very, I would say very unhealthy relationship obviously with pain here, uh, in, in the Western hemisphere and the Western hemisphere. You know, obviously as evidenced by the opioid epidemic that we see. Um, I, I had a friend of mine who lived quite some time in Taiwan and he said over in Taiwan, there was like this philosophy that they had where a small amount of pain on a daily basis, they equated to good health is what they, you know, if you didn't feel some sort of pain in, and especially with like therapeutic interventions, like the more painful the process was, the better it was for you is what they truly, I mean that's, they equate that like that's a sign that you're alive.

Speaker 1: (13:59)
You know what I mean? And that's something that that Dr. Allen has said a lot, you know, with, with patients that he sees too, is it's like, look, if you're not feeling some sort of pain, your dad, you know, T T to live life is to feel a, a, a wide palette of sensations, pain being one of them, you know? And so I think that's a misnomer. I think that we see too sometimes that I go and I see the chiropractor or the physical therapist for that matter. Therefore I should never feel any pain the rest of my life. Oh, what Dr. Riddle did, didn't work. I'm feeling pain again. It's like that's part of life to a certain extent, you know,

Speaker 3: (14:35)
but some point I can get a whole bunch of rash on the front of me from laying on the beach cause that would be

Speaker 1: (14:40)
yeah, that's right. I know, right. Ain't no brain. I like that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. So anyhow, well, uh, dr [inaudible], we know you're a busy guy and we appreciate you taking time out of your schedule to be here with us. Um, uh, for those who want to be able to get ahold of you, maybe they've got further questions about balance or vestibular system or anything else for that matter of physical therapy related, what would be the best way for people to reach out to you?

Speaker 3: (15:02)
Yup. I can t.com I can check us out on Facebook and um, and go check out our website. We do offer free consultations. Uh, they're quick, but we'll make sure you get at least some information. So

Speaker 1: (15:12)
cool. Awesome. And we'll make sure in the show notes that we get, uh, everybody your contact information there. So just a quick link that they can click on if they have any questions for you or anything. And he's not too far from us for those who are watching. We're a local, um, he's just down the road, uh, Eagle and Overland and, uh, so yeah, so again, thanks a ton for being here with us. Has been a ton of fun kind of reconnecting. We haven't chatted in quite some time, so it's been good. Good getting to see you again and uh, anyways, uh, yeah, we're looking forward to sharing more with you guys. Hopefully this has been valuable. Share this with others who you think could benefit. If you know, friends who maybe have some balance issues that they may be, are looking for answers towards or uh, or maybe they're just looking for a really awesome physical therapist. Uh, dr Chuck has our endorsement, uh, hands-down. So, uh, thanks again guys, uh, for watching or listening and we'll talk to you on the next episode.

Speaker 2: (16:01)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here, and we have a special guest on today's episode. This is episode 37 of the health fundamentals podcast. And we're going to be talking to Dr. Krista burns on posture. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:13)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. Buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:32)
So, Hey everybody, I am super excited about today's episode. We have a good friend of ours, dr Krista burns here with us. Thank you so much for being here with us. Dr. Krista,

Speaker 3: (00:42)
thanks so much, dr Chad. I appreciate the opportunity of sharing today with you and your audience and look forward to Shelly sharing more about health.

Speaker 1: (00:49)
Yeah, awesome. So, uh, for those who are watching here, uh, we have kind of a local connection here. So, uh, this podcast obviously, uh, uh, we have a clinic here in Meridian, Idaho. For those who are local for those obviously not local, um, that, that may or may not mean anything. But, uh, dr Krista, you're an Idaho native yourself, is that correct?

Speaker 3: (01:11)
Yes, I grew up skiing in sun Valley, so just right down the road.

Speaker 1: (01:16)
Yeah. So not, not too far from us. So perhaps maybe that's a good place to start. You know, when we talk about, um, the American posture Institute, which you and uh, Dr. Mark Wade founded, um, several years ago, uh, the story actually starts probably in sun Valley doesn't it? Yes. When I was about three years old, because that's when I started ski school and ski

Speaker 3: (01:40)
school, I won, I had the dream of being an Olympic skier. And so I was on sun Valley ski team. I was skiing every day of the week. I was just so committed to this, this goal that I had for mogul skiing. And so I was skiing seven days a week. I was competing at a national level. I was doing junior national championships, national championships, you name it. And it was actually the morning of us ski team tryouts in winter park, Colorado. And I suffered a fall that morning and I hurt my back. And so I got pulled from the competition and this was a big national competition. And that morning I didn't realize it but that would actually be the last competition I would ever compete in. And when I got to the bottom of the course, I remember hugging my coach and I was crying cause I got pulled out of the competition and he said, well don't worry, I have the solution for you.

Speaker 3: (02:27)
And so he recommended that I take weekly flights over to Seattle actually. And I was flying weekly and I was instructed to get injections into my spine cause I was told that this was the conservative care to prevent surgery. And so my senior year of high school, I would leave whatever river high school and go over to Seattle each week, spend two days, miss two days of school and get injections in my spine under anesthesia. And after this grueling process of eight weeks in a row, not only could I not ski, but I could barely walk. I had visual bruising that lasted on my for two years after the injections. Every time I would bend forward to put my socks on, it was like breathtaking pain like I would scratch because it hurts so bad. And so just like that from the time I was three years old, I had dreamed of being an Olympic skier and that was taken away from me.

Speaker 3: (03:14)
And what I learned from that process was that there had to be a better way. You know, I was a young union tool, I was in great shape. Like how could I not overcome back pain? What somebody that's so common. And so from that point I really became obsessed with back pain. And what I wish is that at the time I knew people like dr Chad who could have taken care of me because really what I had was postural distortion patterns. And had I prevented this from a young age, I could have gone all the way to the Olympics who skiing. And so from that point I became obsessed with back pain, went to chiropractic school and then created the American posture Institute for complete postural correction systems. So that leads us to where we are today. But I know exactly how anybody who's listening to this right now who has ever experienced back pain, I want you to know that I'd been in your shoes. I know that it hurts and I do want to tell you that there is definitely a better way. And people like dr Chad can take such good care of you to prevent you from getting to the point where I got where I was flying, you know, across the country to get injections in my spine that then made it so much worse than the end. So there is a better way and I'm glad that you listen to this podcast to learn more.

Speaker 1: (04:18)
Yeah, well and, and I appreciate that. But the thing that I think that people could take home really fundamentally from the story, which is really cool, is that it might sound a bit cliche, but it's that classic when one door closes, another door opens, you know, you're looking, looking back at it now years afterwards. Uh, I mean the trajectory and course of your life completely changed as a result of that. And, and while, you know, some people could have like taken that as like, well my life is over cause I'm, I'm sure that was probably pretty devastating. You don't, you don't get to that level of competition and then, and then have that taken away without that being pretty traumatic. And yet, um, you use that as fuel to change the course and you did some pretty remarkable things. And so you, you know, you did chiropractic college. Where did you go to chiropractic college app in Davenport, Iowa. At Palmer college.

Speaker 1: (05:09)
You finished chiropractic college. And this is where I love where your story kind of begins, which is so cool, is that most people like myself, we go to chiropractic college and we say, you know, I'm going to set up for us. We lived in Portland and we, we really loved Idaho, so we're like, we're going to set up shop in Idaho. That's not what you did though. You said, we love what we're going to head to Italy of all places we're going to, did you guys like spin the globe and like point your finger? Is that what happened or how'd that old process come? Undergraduate

Speaker 3: (05:38)
study is, I had spent about six months over in Italy doing undergrad. I'm doing study abroad and I had such a phenomenal time. I just fell in love with the Italian culture. After graduating from chiropractic school about four years later I thought, Oh, I want to go back so badly. And of course a little bit of fear sat in and I thought, can I really do this in the second language? Can I really go start a practice over in Italy? And I knew from that moment that if I started a practice in the U S I'd never end up going because as you know, I mean when you, when you start a business, you're very dedicated to the growth and the development.

Speaker 1: (06:10)
Yeah. A plant deep roots.

Speaker 3: (06:12)
Exactly. And you want it to be a legacy, that lid that you leave behind. And so I said, if I don't go now, I'm never going to end up going. And so right after school packed our bags, my partner and I, dr Mark, and we moved over to Italy. And what was so crazy about that experience is we didn't know anybody. We didn't speak the language. If you guys remember about that time in 2011 Italy was in the worst economic crisis of Italian history. I mean, it was just all odds against our success. Like we've had no entrepreneurial experience whatsoever. We were fresh out of school and we said, let's go do this. So full of passion. We went over there. We struggled our first year, but we learned a lot of lessons, especially about specializing in our practice. And that's where with the Italian culture combined with, um, the injuries that we had seen personally as well as with our patients. We really honed in on postural correction build the greatest postural correction systems that have been, that have worked for me personally, which was really transformative for my perspective, but also watching this help thousands of patients. And then other practitioners were asking us, well, how'd you make all of this happen? How'd you move to a foreign country? And you know, create a big practice. And that's where the American posture Institute was really born, was sharing our postural correction systems with other people, other practitioners who are then implementing with patients as well throughout the world.

Speaker 1: (07:28)
That's, that's amazing. Like the, the courage and the determination that you guys took to do that. It's just always been so neat to, to hear about. Um, so, so let's talk a little bit about kind of a posture Institute a little bit more about that. And then specifically like posture, like what are some things that people, cause I think most people, at least this is my impression, I could be wrong, but I think most people, the furthest that they go with posture is that it's, it's slouching and that you shouldn't do this. Lao Ching and that's pretty much it. It's a nuisance, right? But obviously there's a lot more depth that especially when you start talking about these implicate longterm implications of what you're saying. Basically what you're saying here is posture is the root cause behind so many of these issues, if not the vast majority of them. So, so maybe start there, let's talk kind of some of the science behind posture and the, the health implications and then maybe kind of circle back on the American posture Institute and what that really is all about and everything. Is that cool?

Speaker 3: (08:24)
That sounds great. So first of all, when dr Chad does said the word posture, what did you do naturally? If you're listening, you probably did what most people do, which is you sat up a little bit straighter. You heard this one word and you physiologically changed the entire structure of your body because you heard a word, we've all heard the word posture before. Likely your mom told you to sit up straight. Your grandma told you to sit up straight. Your teacher told you to sit up straight. And so we know it's been ingrained within our physiology that good posture is associated with good health. What most of us don't realize is that poor posture, not just lead to neck pain and back pain and headaches, which it definitely does associated with that, but it also impacts the function of your body. You see that your posture is the structural framework within you within which you have your organs.

Speaker 3: (09:09)
So your, your structural framework is protecting your organic system. And so when we have compressed closed posture, we're pressing down on our organs. So when I go forward a slash posture in this position, not only is my head forward creating more pressure on my cervical spine or on my neck, but also I'm compressing my diaphragm. So if you guys want to try this with me right now, as you're listening, if you have a hunch, your shoulders forward, try taking a deep breath in from this position you feel really restricted. Whereas when you're seated up straight and you take a full depth, deep breath in and out, you have full range of motion of your diaphragm, which is your muscle of respiration, meaning you can breathe so much better. Now if you have poor posture for one breath does a banner, no, not so much, but now imagine 20 years of slouched posture.

Speaker 3: (09:55)
How that's impacting your entire respiration system and how this is showing up for a lot of adults is asthma and problems with their breathing. They feel out of breath. Whereas if they just changed their posture, they'd been changed the entire function of their body or their physiology, their ability to function at a high level. Some other examples that posture is related to is your balance. So how you balance upright against gravity. Now what's interesting is gravity's always pressing down on our bodies. So naturally if we lack fitness, we tend to go forward with gravity. And then from here we have less postural stabilization, meaning that you're setting yourself up for falls or rolling your ankle when you go out for a run or feeling more out of breath because you're in this compressed posture. So it's important to stand upright. Now, one of the greatest inhibitors of good posture in the digital age is smartphones.

Speaker 3: (10:43)
So how many of us have one of these in our pockets, right? And every time we look down at our phone, what happens to our posture? We completely collapse forward. It's called tech neck posture. Now this posture right here actually adds up to 60 pounds of pressure to your cervical spine, to your neck every time you look down at your smartphone. So I really encourage everybody, what we'll talk about, some posture tips quickly before we wrap up today. But I really encourage you that when you're looking at your devices, make sure to bring those devices up to eye level. So instead of collapsing forward with gravity while it can at your devices, you can maintain nice upright posture. I always say that posture is declining at the speed of technology in the digital age because we spend so much time like this hunch forward on our computers or staring down at our cell phones. So if you walk away with knowing one thing from today's conversation, it's that in the digital age we need to have better posture. And the best way of doing that is bringing our devices up to eye level.

Speaker 1: (11:38)
Yeah. I, you know, I saw on social media the other day, uh, I think it was a couple of weeks ago, maybe it was you that even posted it. Uh, some scientists did like a model of what they said the future humans are going to look like. If you saw that, you know what I'm talking about, they basically did like a like wax model or whatever. What a human's going to look like if things don't change, uh, for better in terms of posture. And basically they, it was like this hunchback of Notre Dame looking type person. It was, it was frightening. It was, it was crazy. Um, and then the other thing that I was going to see too is, you know, I've found it really, uh, very easy to grasp concept that we've been sharing with our patients that that balance and, or posture, they go hand in hand together. But balance is such an easy window into how the brain is communicating with the body and how the body is communicating back with the brain.

Speaker 1: (12:29)
And that's one of the things that we test for with all of our patients is we do a simple digital balanced assessment. And that is something that people just get. So instinctively they understand like, Oh, that makes perfect sense, that balance. And on top of that, when you look at that, if you're having balanced disturbances, which I w in our experience, I don't know what your experience has been clinically Christa, but our experiences, you know, probably a good 75, 80% of our patients if not have significant disturbances with their balance or balance problems. And, and when we actually test that with them, when they'll do like eyes closed balance tests and stuff, they're, they're, it's, it's, uh, it's eyeopening. Ironically, right. Having them close their eyes is very eyeopening. It is, it's very shocking for them to see significant disturbances with their balance. And that opens up that conversation to help them kind of begin to see that, that, that we're starting to get it more of the root of, of some of these problems.

Speaker 1: (13:26)
Because, uh, you know, again, I would say a very significant percentage of people who come into us can't readily point to a, um, a mechanism act of action to their problem. Right. That they're saying, I don't know what I did. I just woke up or I just been [inaudible] tied my shoes in my back or my neck quote unquote went out on me, or I quote unquote slipped a disc or I pinched a nerve or whatever the, the, the thing that they say, but they can't really point to like a car accident. I mean, obviously if you slip and you fall or if you're in a car accident, that's easy to point to. But a lot of these, I would say the vast majority are what we would call the clinical term insidious onset. You know, where it's, it's not something normal, it kinda came out of the blue or out of nowhere. And it's real easy for us to point to this fact that Oh well chances are it's been building for a while. Meaning it's been a postural problem and or a balance related problem or some other problem that has grown over time. And so, uh, you, you kind of talked about and hinted at, you know, what are some of the things that you guys recommend or that you do intervention wise in terms of posture to help people kind of correct some of these issues?

Speaker 3: (14:34)
Yeah, that's a great question. And the whole purpose of this is having better posture habits so that we can build our posture fitness. Because as dr Chad just mentioned, it's, you know, that feeling of, I bent over to put on my shoes and then my back went out. Like what happened with that? What happened was your inability a posturally your body upright, right? And so it went out so you collapsed forward. So what we want to do is have better posture habits throughout our daily life so that our bodies can function better. But also so we can have better postural stabilization to prevent our bodies from collapsing forward with gravity. And then leading to, you know, excruciating back pain like sciatica or you know, a slip desk or a hot low back. So some of the recommendations that I have, number one is bringing devices up to eye level.

Speaker 3: (15:17)
I'm going to resay that because it's so important. So if you work in a theater instead of being hunched over in this posture, bring your monitor up to eye level. So you're looking straight at it with your iPhone and you're gonna feel uncomfortable just holding your iPhone up here. So what I recommend doing is bring your elbows in close to your body so that they feel supported and then have your phone up in this position. So from here I'm at eye level, my arms are supported so that they don't get tired and I can still do everything I need to on my phone. I can still text message or scroll through social media, whatever it is I need to do. Number two is we need to move more more throughout the day. So in addition to going to the gym for 30 minutes in the morning or going for a run, you also need to move more throughout your day.

Speaker 3: (16:00)
So it's actually not enough to offset being sedentary eight hours a day by just going to the gym for 30 minutes in the morning. That is such a good habit. Keep doing that. In addition to it, we need to take more time for movement. So for example, if you have meetings, plug in your iPhone and walk and talk, do a walk and talk meeting. Get a standing desk where you can stand up more often. Also active sitting. So for example, if you sit on an exercise ball or a posture cushion, it's an in stable surface. So I'm naturally more active, meaning that I'm engaging my brain and my muscles to hold my body upright. Okay? Instead of just being completely slouched. And what you'll notice on an exercise ball when you're seated is that if you start to slouch, the ball starts to roll. And so what happens is that you naturally bring your body back into an upright position so that you can prevent yourself from falling over.

Speaker 3: (16:48)
So this is good because you're required to utilize your core musculature and it activates a part of your brain called the vestibular system for better balance. And then the third thing I want to leave you with is called a posture break. So everybody should do a posture break for 30 seconds, every hour of your work day. And we can perform this together right now. What I want to encourage you to do is bring your arms out to the side, straighten your arms, or bring your hands out to the side, straighten your arms, push your chest forward to drop your head back and just hold that position for 30 seconds.

Speaker 4: (17:18)
I'm doing this along with you here for everybody to see if they're, if they can't see you, I'm doing it here for you. I'm going to be your model.

Speaker 3: (17:25)
Perfect. So just for form of posture break cause what's going to happen is with gravity it presses down on your body so you feel like you that you naturally go into a slumped position. So let's offset that by going anti-gravity with a posture break. And so for 30 seconds, every hour of your work day, especially if you're seated at a computer, just perform a posture break. And what's going to happen is afterwards you go, Oh I feel so much better and it's so much more natural to then up straight because you just took a posture break to stretch the musculature that gets so tight from some forward posture. Okay, so those are some easy posture tips. Bring your devices up to eye level, encourage more movement throughout your work day with a standing desk or active sitting solution and take posture breaks for 30 seconds every hour of your Workday and that's going to help you have better posture to help your body function better, to prevent pain and to live a healthier life.

Speaker 1: (18:14)
That's awesome. I love the simplicity of it. And the thing that I would just caution, which is so common, the case, you know, sometimes people can be so quickly dismissive of simple solutions because they're just that they're, that's almost too simple. But the reality of it is, is that with these things, you know, we talk about, uh, in, in the health with the health fundamentals podcast, we talk about this concept of five fundamentals of health. Uh, the first fundamental is that health comes from the inside. But the second one is simplicity and consistency that we are, we are going to achieve the goals that we want with our health. When we approach it from simplicity and consistency, far too often we want some sort of magic, exciting, really cool. Like, okay, no, really, really, what's the secret? You know, and you're like, no, the secret is just do these simple little things consistently and it's gonna make a huge difference. So I, I love that fact that what you're sharing here, anyone can do. It doesn't require some new fancy piece of equipment or, you know, some expensive approach or anything. These are all really, really practical strategies. So, um, so

Speaker 3: (19:17)
at dr Chad, I just want to set up everybody for success. You've had your posture for years and years before listening today to today's conversation. So you're going to have all the best intentions in mind, but as dr Chad mentioned, it needs to be simple and consistent. So what you should do is just grab a little sticker and put it on your computer. Every time you see that sticker, it's a reminder to check your posture. It's a reminder to bring them up to eye level, to move more throughout your day and to take posture breaks. So use a posture reminder or even set one on your phone that reminds you to take your posture breaks so that you can maintain these simple yet consistent habits for health fundamentals.

Speaker 1: (19:52)
That's perfect. Perfect. I love it. So in closing, let's kind of wrap up, maybe kind of come full circle. You know, you're obviously the founder of the American posture Institute. Maybe let's talk about kind of a little bit about your mission purpose, what you do at the American posture Institute, and then obviously for people who may or may not have questions or want to connect with you on social media, maybe give them some information there in terms of how they can reach out to you and and and the American posture Institute.

Speaker 3: (20:19)
Thanks so much. Well, posture is declining at the speed of technology in the digital age. At the American posture Institute. We are committed to helping people just like you to prevent postural decline from impacting your health and your family's health. So with that being said, we'd love it if you joined us on Facebook over@facebook.com forward slash American posture Institute for ongoing free trainings and information for you. In addition to that, you can always check out our website, American posture institute.com and a huge props. Congratulations everybody who's listening in on today's podcast because honestly, you're in the right place to learn more about important health fundamentals. And dr Chad really is a health hero. So if you're local within the Boise Meridian area, be sure to go in and check him out. He's going to help you have a better health for a better life.

Speaker 1: (21:04)
Awesome. Thank you so much. And in closing, you know, for, for docs who are like, that's awesome, but I don't live in the Boise area. I live in wherever you guys have certified partners. Correct. Uh, through the American posture Institute, uh, healthcare professionals literally all over the world. Do you not? And, and on, on 50 countries. So in on your website, are they listed there? Is there a way for people to reach out and find out about, like, I need to get an NC, somebody who's been trained by dr Krista, uh, is there a way for them to find that out?

Speaker 3: (21:37)
100%. Just go to our website, American posture institute.com. Shoot us over a message and we'll make sure that you get taken care of.

Speaker 1: (21:44)
That's awesome. Yeah. Cause I know, um, they've done some pretty incredible training that I've seen and been through. Uh, we've actually, you, you had a kind of a micro training that we had our team go through all on posture taping, which was really, really cool. Um, and, and a bunch of other different trainings that they've had. And so, uh, for those who are like, man, I don't live in the Boise area or, uh, in sun Valley or, or, or whatever. Uh, there's literally, uh, you know, people who have specialized and have had this advanced training through a dr Krista and her team. And so, um, yeah, they'll be able to help you, uh, in those areas. But, uh, anyways, thank you so much, dr Krista. Uh, this has been incredible. One other cool little fun fact for everybody who's watching here. Um, you know, we, we really first met in person, was it three years ago, um, dr Christa and her, uh, significant other, uh, Dr. Wade, Dr. Mark Wade, two of the most wonderful people, uh, in the world. They're such good people. They host a really fun event called the Puerto Rico masterminds, which is a, a business networking event. Uh, an opportunity for entrepreneurs to get together in your little Island. They're down in Puerto Rico. Um, maybe just do a quick plug for that. Tell them about kind of what that's about and then we can kind of wrap up there. Is that cool?

Speaker 3: (22:59)
Yeah. Well, Puerto Rico masterminds, number one is a blast and number two, you're going to learn incredible information for your business. So we believe in strategizing, networking and para dicing. So it's um, you know, learning and connecting with other entrepreneurs in a paradise atmosphere in Puerto Rico. So it's a great time. We've had incredible speakers just like dr Chad share their wisdom with business growth.

Speaker 4: (23:20)
Yeah, no, we went to, I've been to two of them and they had been phenomenal and I am crossing my fingers that I'm going to be able to get to this year's as well. It's going to be amazing. So looking forward to hanging out with you guys again down there. But again, uh, I know you're crazy busy, but yet you were gracious enough to take time out of your schedule and be here with us. Dr [inaudible], thank you so much. And for those watching, if you thought that this was a beneficial and valuable, obviously share with friends and family, subscribed to the podcast, uh, obviously follow, uh, what dr Christa is doing over at the American posture Institute because she's continuing to just pour her heart. And so I see how hard she works, uh, with everything that they're doing to ultimately serve, uh, their community and serve the world. That doesn't sound too crazy or corny. I mean, it really is the truth. They're really working hard to do that. So we really love dr Krista and everything she's doing. So, uh, thank you guys so much for watching. We'll talk to you on the next episode.

Speaker 2: (24:13)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least. If you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 36 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we have a special guest with us, our good friend, dr Greg Gaiman, and we're going to be talking teens and teeth. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:15)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:34)
All right, everybody. So on today's episode we brought in a, a good friend of ours, dr Greg Gaiman, the one the only, he is a legend here in our area. Um, in fact, which is really funny, we were just talking before the podcast started. Um, I actually knew Greg Gaiman through, uh, we have a local water slide park here and his name is everywhere. He's got all these, like, uh, all the inner tubes, have his brand and logo on it for his, for his orthodontic business. And how long have you been doing that for?

Speaker 3: (01:05)
We've worked with them, actually. I treated the director of marketing a daughter, got to know her as she at one point worked for the news and then she moved over there. And so it's been 15 years, a long time, almost when they started. Wow. Yeah. That's crazy.

Speaker 1: (01:22)
So, um, so yeah, for, for, for those of us who are, uh, for those who are watching, uh, just give us a quick kind of introduction about what, uh, what got you into orthodontics in the first place, how long you've been here in the Valley, kind of a quick snapshot of who you are.

Speaker 3: (01:36)
Yeah, so I've been in the Valley actually 22 years as of last month. So I've been doing this for a long time. And when I got here, Eagle road was a two lane road, which is, uh, you know, that's crazy. It is crazy rounded. And, um, at that time, uh, there was one part time orthodontist in Meridian and uh, I came in and said, Hey, it looks like there's room, I'm going to do this. And so I jumped in, uh, full speed ahead and, uh, it's been an amazing journey unless I'm around 25 other orthodontists and followed your, your eyes, your example. I'm the only one, there's quite a few of us. And now you've got adults raised adults from that time on. Crazy. Yeah. So I'm a actually a son of a dentist, like a curse word as son of a dentist. Um, and grew up always thinking I was going to take over my dad's practice in Southern California and I used to, I was the only kid that would go in there and actually watch him do things and watch him do extractions and stick my head in there and Hey, can I watch this and let me see dad.

Speaker 3: (02:43)
So I, by the age of eight, I wrote in my journal, I am going to be a dentist like my dad and I'm the youngest of the three sons. And so interestingly enough, I was the one who followed through and decided I was going to be a dentist. I'm sure other brothers become anything. So no, not they. They never, they always knew they weren't going to be. Yeah. My dad, you know, my dad came home happy. He had Fridays off. He enjoyed his work. It wasn't complaining about his job every day, never had job insecurity issues. And I just, I think that in my head from very early on, it was kind of like, Hey, my dad's got kind of a cool gig. He's his own boss and he can, he can afford things and we can take trips and things. And, you know, I don't, I never felt like I was from a wealthy background or anything, but I certainly felt like we, my dad made sufficient for, right.

Speaker 3: (03:32)
So anyway, well, you know, I, I thought I was going to be a dentist, went to school in San Francisco for my dental school and, um, started seeing things in Southern California that I thought, I'm not sure I want to raise a family here. And, um, you know, having moved away for long enough, I realized that there was a life outside of Southern California, which I never thought, I thought it was kinda like the sun and everything revolved around it. And uh, so I'm starting at my dental school. I started driving the Western United States saying I'm going to practice somewhere else and I'm going to be an orthodontist and reason I'm an orthodontist is I had an uncle that was an orthodontist and my dad early on said, son, you know, this orthodontic stuff is pretty interesting and, and so I kind of in my head said, I think that's in the background and maybe a possibility.

Speaker 3: (04:18)
But then when I got to dental school they told me, uh, there's only about a, a less than 10% of the students that want to get into ortho school get into ortho school. So I might go highly competitive, highly, highly competitive, super competitive. So I knew right away that I was going to be in the, have to be in the top 10% of my class. So I, out of 80 80 students I was going to be off to be top eight and that kind of set the bar really hard and which made me a little nervous to say I'm going to be an orthodontist or nothing because there was a possibility I was nothing. And I had went to a really sharp dental school with, you know, it was a hard school to get into as it was. So I thought I'd had this great barrier and I look around, I'm like, dude, I think I'm in the bottom 10% in intelligence level.

Speaker 3: (05:01)
And so, you know, I just had to work extra hard and sorry, grounded out. But anyway, while I was in dental school, along with that, knowing that I wasn't going to be in Southern California, I started driving the Western United States and just trying to, you know, my wife and I kind of created a list of what we considered utopia, what it, what it would look like. And, and we drove a lot of places and a lot of places did not look like the utopia we had on our list. I didn't have any family in Idaho, uh, at the time and drove through here and there's just something that grabbed me and I'm like, this is pretty cool. I think I could do this. And, um, and, and it's not very smart to start a practice from scratch. Uh, it's much better to buy an existing business, at least from our standpoint.

Speaker 3: (05:45)
I don't know how it is with you guys, but Oh, sure. Cash cashflows. Absolutely. And there was nobody even interested in selling and in fact that, you know, have met a few orthodontist in town and some of them wouldn't even meet with me. And they were, you know, dude, we don't want another competitor here. And others made it very clear that I would be broke if I moved to town. And I just said, you know, maybe broke, but I might be happy. So, so, um, yeah, we decided to open our doors just right across the street from where I currently am. I'm 22 years ago. Wow. And, uh, it's been, it's been an amazing ride. Uh, never, never in my highest expectations, dreams or goals. Did I ever think that that practicing orthodontics was going to be like, it was the way it is for me.

Speaker 1: (06:32)
W w what do you mean by that? As far as like what did you think in terms of,

Speaker 3: (06:36)
you know, I had a, I had a vision of what financially, you know, was going to be enough and sufficient for my needs and I didn't have those high needs and I don't, I still don't tell you the truth. And, um, so, you know, from that standpoint, I was like, you know, if I, if I make this number and I can pay my bills and pay my student loans, uh, and I can take a vacation a couple times a year, that's, that's perfect. What more could you want? And, um, you know, it's far exceeded data, the cause, even just the size of the practice and the, yeah.

Speaker 1: (07:11)
Well, and for those who don't live in this area, what we call the treasure Valley, which is Boise and all of the pretty much surrounding, uh, cities and towns, um, you'd be hard pressed to if, if looking for an orthodontist not come across dr Gaiman, his, his, uh, his practice is probably be number one practice here in the area in terms of brand recognition, in terms of he just everywhere. You can't go anywhere and not see, uh, and he maintains a stellar reputation. Um, that's something he works really hard for. I've known, you know, like I said, I knew of dr Gaiman and Gaiman Orthodox long before we met. Uh, we go to church together now and, uh, so he's kind of a in that realm, kind of a local celebrity in that sense. And we kind of selfishly wanted him here on the podcast for that reason.

Speaker 1: (07:59)
I'll, you know, truth be told, we told him, you know, you're, you're kind of a legend in that sense. But, um, so, so in terms of orthodontics, you know, for, for those watching, what would you say are some things that might, uh, surprise people in terms of things you see that orthodontics helps with? Cause I think most people from a superficial level get it that yet orthodontics is much, you straighten your teeth, you know, kind of like they think of chiropractic in the sense that chiropractic is for your back, you know, which it's true, but obviously there's a lot more to it than that. And I'm, I'm confident that with orthodontics it's the same. So what would you say, uh, number one are some of the things that might surprise them? Number two, the other kind of followup question to that is, what are some things that you love seeing and treating and helping people with? Like things that just make you love being an orthodontist?

Speaker 3: (08:47)
You know, I guess I'm, one of the first surprising things that was a surprise to me is when I first became interested in how long it even to become an orthodontist. Um, you know, I went to school for four years of undergrad, four years of dental school, and then basically three years of orthodontic training. Yeah. That's a ton of ton of school. Yeah. It was a long time. I did a 20, 22nd grade, something like that, graduated from 22nd grade. So it took a long time to do what I wanted to do. It's not a super simple just, Oh, we just throw on some braces and teeth straightened out and that's how it happens. And it's just so easy. And so, so orthodontics just doesn't, it doesn't just happen and you don't go to an overnight school or a weekend school and become an orthodontist first of all.

Speaker 3: (09:31)
So that might be a surprise that it's, it's a little more, there's, there's, it's a little more rigorous. The training efficient amount of training. Yeah. As far as the orthodontics itself, you know, when people think of orthodontics, they think two years and it's going to be painful and really expensive. That's what people think of orthodontics. And you know, I, I think, um, we recently looked back, I did a look back on our, our past 100 patients that we had completed and we realized that we had averaged 16 months as our average treatment time, which is very short, much shorter than the national average. Um, those patients averaged less than a, it was, uh, 12 to 13 visits on average, so they weren't coming to our office all the time. And then from a discomfort standpoint, I think orthodontics, we use lighter forces, we use more continuous forces, um, with the new new materials and techniques that's made it a little more comfortable.

Speaker 3: (10:27)
Do braces are braces uncomfortable? Absolutely. They are a little bit uncomfortable at first five days I tell you, you're going to be eaten, you know, so Nana soup, soup, mashed potatoes and bananas and yogurt. Nope. Mail and applesauce. Yeah. So there's still some soreness but, but, but I think the shortness of treatment is surprising. And, and, um, you know, our adults in particular who have this concern about straightening their teeth. Um, there's cases that we often do that are six or six or eight months of orthodontics and they get this amazing result and they're like, Oh my gosh, if I would've known this, I'd have done it. You know, I have a question now. Straightening teeth is one thing, but does, are, you know, when you're getting your teeth moved around, does it help with TMJ type issues? Sure. So orthodontics is, you know, it's way more than just, you know, straight teeth.

Speaker 3: (11:15)
It's, it's so much more. And that's, that's, I guess one of the other things that this leads to is that we're not just talking about making beautiful smiles, you know, if the teeth function properly, sometimes people with TMJ or temporomandibular joint disorder, you know, everybody kind of has had popping and clicking or pain in their joint. Uh, it's, that's a, that's a phenomenon that's found in over 50% of the population. We can alleviate that in, eh, a certain percentage of those cases, not all of them. Um, along with that, when we make teeth fit together better, they function better. Um, the difference between someone that functions with a proper bite and the way they chew and eat and break up their food and digest is incredible compared to somebody who's teeth. Don't you see it affecting people with headaches at all? So there's no migraines and TMJ kind of go together. Right. Um, a lot of times those trigger factors are, are related to the joint, uh, directly, so. Absolutely.

Speaker 1: (12:12)
And I'm curious too, do you notice anything in terms of improvement with sleep after somebody has had a, you know, a course of care?

Speaker 3: (12:19)
So I, I'm a little hesitant to discuss what we can and can't do with [inaudible] because they're making no claims here. It's just my concern is that there's a lot of, um, Hocus Pocus and, and snake oil being sold out there. And I don't, that's, that's not my thing, but yeah. But here's the deal. So sleep disordered breathing affects a huge percentage of the population. Uh, you know, 40% of the population could benefit from a CPAP. I mean, if we put everybody on a sleep study, 40% would actually have some level of sleep diff disorder. Uh, or yeah, sleep disorder breathing and it's related to airway. Um, and uh, airway is, it's, it's um, multifactorial taught. One of the factors is the, of course the size and volume of the airway. And we do things all the time like rapid palatal expanders where we actually increase the size of the pallet, which also increases the nasal, the volume, decreases the airflow resistance.

Speaker 3: (13:21)
And we, I have routinely seen young kids, you know, six, seven and eight that we put these in these expanders convert from bringing a mouth breather with their mouth hanging open to being a nose breather. And as soon as you convert from being a mouth breather to a nose breather, your tongue repositions in a different place and therefore it reshapes the palette. And I can literally say that, you know, once we fix a, uh, pallet property in the tongue, goes to the right position, uh, stabilizes the bite. It changes the way they breathe and it actually changes their facial growth.

Speaker 1: (13:54)
He changed, he changed their life, I mean, the trajectory of their life. How, how, how satisfying and fulfilling must that feel to you to see that like right in front of you. Like literally, like you've basically put them in a fork in the road and you've completely changed. I mean, and I think maybe that's a good segue too in terms of this, you know, cause cause here we're talking about all these like cool mechanical and or biomechanical things, but we can't dismiss the impact that changing, uh, you know, the, the, the alignment of, of people's teeth and changing their smile can have, uh, psychologically on, on people, teens and adults alike. Um, in terms of their, you know, development in terms of socially that, that and that impact that has. So, so maybe share with those listening or watching maybe some of the experiences and, or your perspective on that in terms of teens and development socially, you know, uh, the impact of, of straight teeth and smile psychologically. Yeah. Anything like

Speaker 3: (14:52)
that. So we have a tagline, you know, that you just kind of pulled, uh, but it's, um, better smiles, brighter futures. And that's so true in so many ways. Absolutely. We were talking earlier and there have been study after study that have said, you know, what's the number one thing you notice when you meet a new person? What's the number one person you know, or number one thing you've noticed stands out. Yeah, that stands out. And the smile is always in the top two things. They're the way their teeth look and you know, whether you like it or hate it. In our society, we judge people by the way they look and, and you know, maybe that's all it is. We judge books by their covers. Unfortunately superficial, but, but you can't fight it. It's what it is. And, uh, therefore I, I absolutely, if you can make someone look better, they're judged differently.

Speaker 3: (15:43)
They're, there's been studies of what, uh, you know, second grade, third grade teachers, how they judge their students and who's the brightest? Just you give them a whole pile of pictures and say, okay, here's, here's 20 pictures of your future students. Tell me what you think of each of these. And kids with crazy looking teeth, goofy looking teeth, uh, they end up being judged as this kid's going to be dumb. This kid's not as bright Gary. And so they get put in this box of they're not as bright. I mean, it's not just not, they're not as cute. They're not as bright. And they've done studies that I'm aware of where they'll, they'll, they'll tell the teachers ahead of time where they'll mix students up and they'll put them in and they'll let P P, you know, they'll deliberately save kids that underperform on tests.

Speaker 3: (16:24)
Absolutely. They'll flip it and they'll say, this kid Johnny, he's exceptionally brilliant. Watch what happens. And then it completely changes his. So the influence or the bias that a teacher has can have such a huge implication, uh, in, in terms of that. So that's, yeah, that's kinda crazy. Here's another crazy study. You can put a baby in front of pictures and you run by pictures of, uh, of, of different people, people's faces in front of a baby, an infant and a baby. We'll spend more time looking at attractive faces and you put an unattractive face. And it doesn't hold their attention. They literally look away. And so it's so, it's ingrained in us. So it's not just society, it's not just the media, it's not just movies and entertainment. It's, it's ingrained in us. We like to look at pleasing and attractive and symmetrical things and that's what we're trying to do.

Speaker 3: (17:10)
Right. The cool thing about, you know, way back in the day, having braces was like for a kid was a terrifying thought because matter was head gear on some cases and had head gear as a kid. There was some crazy and now with, with Invisalign and different, the different products that are out there now, it's amazing. Yeah, no, the, the, the days of, you know, the Willy Wonka, the crazy stuff on his teeth, those are gone. Our braces are so much smaller. We'd, you know, we, we'd offer, for example, we offer clear braces, transparent braces, that no additional charge that you can be five feet away and you wouldn't even know the person was wearing them. And then of course, about 20 20% of our patients are choosing Invisalign clear liners, especially our adults that are really into that. Another thing that you said that's different from long time ago, that you know, this, the stigma of orthodontics being too expensive and not being able to afford it.

Speaker 3: (18:01)
Uh, you know, back in the night I talked to a professor that when I was back in school and he said, he would told me a story that I'll, I just sticks in my head and he said, you know, I started a orthodontics in 1972 he said, as isn't me, by the way, I'm not that old in 1972 and braces or the same cost as a Volkswagen bug. Wow. So, you know, and he's like, you know, Volkswagen bugs weren't the most expensive car, but they weren't the cheapest car. There were the same costs of Volkswagen bug. And he said, today, comparatively, braces are cheap. Prices used to be only for the rich back in [inaudible].

Speaker 1: (18:34)
Sure. Well, I think if you get nothing else from that comparison or that, that kind of, uh, you know, point of reference is that braces have not increased in terms of inflation or whatever. Yeah. While while everything else has, has continued to grow in terms of expense and everything, um, you know, talking about this kind of evolution of things, how things have changed in one on one of the things that you'd have to be blind not to see. That's a real common trend that we're seeing a lot these days is more and more companies out there are attempting to cut out of the picture expertise, uh, and, and braces. I think to a certain extent have kind of taken a lot of the brunt of this in the sense that most people who are listening or watching this have probably seen ads for various new companies that are letting you know that you no longer need an orthodontist. That you can diagnose yourself or that you can do some sort of an impression. You bite on this thing, send it in, and then their company will basically create the care plan for you and send you the tray full of everything you need or whatever. What's your, what's your kind of take on that? Because I know my opinion on that obviously.

Speaker 3: (19:42)
Well, I, you know, this may sound self-serving, but I'm going to, by the time I'm done, hopefully people understand where I come from and the place that I come from. And that is that, you know, I, I mentioned earlier that I spent, uh, you know, 22 years of schooling and specifically I did three years of specializing in orthodontics to do what I do. That doesn't happen overnight. Right? And you don't replace that with a, you know, a do it yourself kit. And so you know, that that's, it's really scary to me because there's a lot of things that can go wrong in orthodontics. Only thing that can go right in orthodontics is the teeth get straighter and everything else can go wrong. I mean, it's scary. And so to think that someone is handed a, you know, a piece of plastic that they stick in their mouth to make a sort of impression of their teeth and then supposedly, supposedly there's going to be a professional that puts the teeth in the right place and then the aligners are created and then they're mailed the person's house and they stick them in and you hope it works

Speaker 1: (20:43)
well. There's something to be said for seeing the person face to face versus just an impression of my teeth. I think there's, yeah,

Speaker 3: (20:49)
there's so many more pieces to a clinical exam than the YouTube. And here's another thing that they're not even, they weren't even required to take an X Ray, so you couldn't look at the health of the bone or the gums. And there have definitely been some, some negative side effects that are appearing. And just last month, a state of California banned this DIY orthodontics, um, from happening in that state without a certain level of records that are required from every other person doing orthodontics, which, why would they be? Why would they be, have to follow a different set of rules. But, uh, their attorneys are very aggressive, very aggressive defending them. Here's a, here's an interesting thing that people should know that are considering DIY orthodontics. When you sign with one of these companies though the larger of the companies, you actually have to sign a nondisclosure agreement, an NDA that says that you will not disclose the contents of what you're signing. And in your signing you also sign away your rights to Sue that company. So not only are you giving up your, your patient rights that every single healthcare provider has to, you know, provides for their patients. But you also signed nondisclosure that you won't tell anybody that you signed away your rights when you started.

Speaker 1: (22:07)
So, so it's a great business model.

Speaker 3: (22:11)
The aggressiveness of this company when somebody goes out to negative, you know, negatively review them is they, they send out legal letters on a daily basis.

Speaker 1: (22:21)
Wow. Well, so I mean that's kinda crazy because to put that in perspective so that people can kind of understand that would be like if you were to come to me as a patient at align integrated medical and we had you sign a form that says if we hurt you for some reason, which we don't hurt people by the way, but if for some reason something went wrong where we did something malpractice, right? Because we all have malpractice insurance, right? That you have no recourse and, and that and that. And also on top of that one more layer of prediction. You can't tell anybody that you signed this. Like that's crazy. That's crazy. That is crazy. Don't believe this. Yeah. Guarantee 100% yeah, that's crazy. So I mean, at the end of the day, I think the old adage rings very true in this, that you get what you pay for.

Speaker 1: (23:07)
You know, at the end of the day I've said this and I get, I acknowledged full well that we're kind of on the same level in terms of our bias in the sense that the years that we spend in our training means something to not only us, but that should mean something else to the public. Look, I acknowledge readily and I'm confident you're on the same page with me too, that in this day and age we live in the information agent. So information is readily accessible to everyone and so we should be prepared as professionals to be able to answer tough questions. I saw a YouTube, I could do braces, right? Right. I watched you two but, but at the same token, but at the same token, acknowledge and appreciate and value legitimate expertise that is out there because there's something to be said for that. Be going to a trusted expert because you're not just paying for the result, although you certainly are paying for the result. What you're also paying for is the confidence along the way of knowing that you have an expert to lean on, you know, along the way. And, and, and really, truly there's, there's great peace of mind and my guess is in your 22 years of practice, you've probably fielded numerous phone calls from concerned parents along the way in terms of this just happened with little Johnny's braces. Uh, what should we do? You know, and it's, and for an expert, it's a real simple question. [inaudible]

Speaker 3: (24:23)
well, answer, you can handle it, things can go wrong and things do go wrong, right? I'd love to tell you that every single one, I price it patients go smoothly, exactly how I planned, but guess what? I at least know how to address the problems and fix them and solve them and get them right. I had a years ago when I first graduated high school, I worked in the construction field if all I was going to college and I remember talking to one of the journeymen that I was learning from and he said something to me that has stuck with me my whole life. He says, the only difference between a journeyman and an apprentice is a journeyman knows how to fix any mistakes. And I'm like, and that kind of what you're saying is stuff happens, you know, and knowing how to, to, you know, fix that and make it at the end result. The correct result is it means everything.

Speaker 1: (25:07)
Yeah. Well, dr gamma, we appreciate your time here, dr Gaiman. You're amazing. We, uh, we love what you do here for our community and, uh, we're, uh, we're excited to continue obviously a long great relationship with you. Uh, in fact, I think one of my daughters is going to be starting braces with you in the not too, uh, not too distant future here. Um, for those who are watching, who do live here in the treasure Valley and have questions about orthodontics, about braces, about all things in that realm, how can they get ahold of you? What would be the easiest way?

Speaker 3: (25:37)
You know, we're, um, you can find a [inaudible] by calling our office. Uh, that's easiest to way, way eight, eight nine eight zero, zero, zero, zero.

Speaker 1: (25:46)
And we'll make sure we put all the links here. Um, you guys are on Facebook, you're on Instagram,

Speaker 3: (25:50)
we're on Instagram. Um, you can text that number, you can call that number. Um, you know, uh, visit our website. You can schedule your appointment online now. Um, we've just made it really easy, accessible, and, um, you know, affordable treatment

Speaker 1: (26:06)
and quick snapshot. What can people expect when they come into your office? First visit, what would, what will basically take place? Let's say that I'm apprehensive. I'm like, I'm kind of scared of what, you know, venturing and I bring my kid in or myself in and we sit down. What happened?

Speaker 3: (26:19)
Perfect. So our, our first exam is free. We charge nothing for it. So, um, we take out as many barriers as we can. Um, we spend about 40 minutes basically talking to you about what specifically you would like to see happen, what your concerns are. We take an X Ray so we can analyze the, the roots and bone structure. And then we just talk about here, here's your options. And, uh, oftentimes one of the things that's, that's new

Speaker 1: (26:44)
to us is that, uh, a lot of patients come in wanting to do something. We, we get them started that same day. If they're ready for treatment and they want to go, we don't make them schedule a second visit and have to go back and take off more time off of work. We try to make things as convenient as possible and we're just lowered the barrier of entry for orthodontics. So that's huge. Awesome. It makes it, yeah, makes it easy. And I think any more these days, cost is only half the equation in terms of convenience. Convenience is huge too. We noticed that too. That's why those DIY companies are so appealing. It seems so great. I can do it for my own home. Please visit an orthodontist if not me. Visited North. Well, my dad raised me. My parents were both very wonderfully pragmatic people. And one of the most common sayings that my dad kind of tried to pound into me as a kid early on is if it sounds too good to be true, it more often than not usually is, you know, and I've learned that the hard way in my own life to find that my dad's wisdom was, was uh, you know, he, he, he was correct.

Speaker 1: (27:47)
You know, most of the time. And that's the case. And so again, the appeal, you know, uh, my friend, uh, who used to run the Allstate agency next door to us, um, he had a saying that said that the appeal or the, or the good fee, it was something to the effect of, uh, the appeal of a cheap insurance policy fades quickly when you, when you, when your first claim is made or whatever like that, you know, that, you know, that whole idea that, you know, you know, people that think that they got a great deal, that that fades really, really quick. And we, we've said all along, uh, you know, the most expensive option is the one that doesn't work at the end of the day because it's just wasted money. That's a great, I like that. Do you see a significant portion of people, I mean, not to continue to hammer on the our way, but you see a significant portion of people who have tried that option and now it's like, okay, I gotta get this taken care of.

Speaker 1: (28:38)
I have, and I've corrected more than more than a handful. And they're always embarrassed and you know, Hey, we've all made some bad choices and we've always looked for a good, we, all of us have looked for a good deal and ended up if I, now that's not human nature. So I think there's a good point to kind of, I think that's a really good point to end on even too with dr Gaiman, is that if you're in that boat and you might feel a little sheepish, especially after listening to this episode of the podcast, like he's not gonna make you feel stupid. You know, we don't, we don't send you through a repentance process or anything like that. Right. We just make it right. I don't want to beat up anybody. I just want them to be happy with their smile. Yeah. That's really what we're all about. That's awesome. And what was the, what was the saying again? Your guys' motto or saying better smiles. Brighter futures. Better smiles. Brighter futures. That's awesome. Maybe that should be this true. It's a good note to end on. Yeah. Well, dr Gavin, we know you're a busy guy and so we really appreciate you taking time out of your schedule to be here with us, uh, on this podcast. So thanks. Thanks a ton and uh, yeah, appreciate you being here with us. Thanks for having me guys every day. Absolutely.

Speaker 4: (29:42)
Absolutely. All right guys, we'll talk to you later on the next episode. Have a good one.

Speaker 2: (29:46)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Shoe Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here, Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 35 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode we're going to be talking about a new secret to detoxing your brain. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:13)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:32)
So, Hey everybody, on today's episode we're going to be talking about a new secret, quote unquote, to detoxing your brain. The fact of the matter is, what's new about, this isn't what it is, but there's actually new research on what it does on what it does, right? Uh, and so we don't, we're, the last thing in the world we want is for this to be click baity or feel like it's clickbait. But the truth is, is that there's a new study and there's new research that's, that's coming out that showing something pretty powerful. Um, there was an article on us news, uh, that said deep sleep may rinse days, toxins from the brain. Uh, and so, uh, there was research done at Boston university, uh, Dr. Laura Lewis. And, uh, what they basically said was, uh, researchers found that during deep sleep, slow wave activity of nerve cells appears to make room for cerebral spinal fluid to rhythmically move in and out of the brain.

Speaker 1: (01:29)
A process believed to rinse out metabolic waste products and that crazy. That's awesome. That's cool. You know, so, so basically yet again, another piece of evidence supporting sleeps therapeutic benefits on our overall health and wellbeing. Uh, this time specifically showing what it could do powerfully for our brain. Um, and so, you know, I don't know about you, but for me it was probably in the first five years of practice where I started to really, uh, see firsthand in a clinical experience, clinical setting, just how powerful and how overlooked sleep is in the overall healing process. You know, we as as chiropractors, we see a lot of neck and back pain cases. Um, and I started to see what I, what I refer to as the ugly triad where I would find kind of three things very, uh, intimately connected together for bad on it. And it was pain.

Speaker 1: (02:32)
It was typically neck pain, back pain, shoulder pain, other similar types of pain, bad, bad pain, uh, sleep problems and mental health problems, anxiety, depression, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Those, those three things kind of go hand in hand and almost in this very negative, vicious circle, vicious cycle, circle, triangle, whatever you want to call it. But, but the idea of never downplaying the therapeutic benefits of that's, and that's easier said than done a lot of times for people who are in pain because oftentimes pain can prevent them from getting the rest that their body needs. But, um, figuring out strategies to help assist people to get rest can be such sleep in and of itself. If people can achieve deep therapeutic sleep, can play such a powerful role in just the body's ability to be able to heal and recover. And here the researchers is showing us, this is exactly the case when it comes to brain health as well.

Speaker 1: (03:31)
I'd kind of make sure the brain pulsating in your head when you said that, you know, it allows the fluid to kind of rind things out. Right. And, and I suppose it probably does with the beat of your heart or what have you, but yeah, the, the relaxing, um, rhythms of the deep sleep just kind of helped just flush everything out. And there's a lot of studies on deep REM sleep and, and how it, um, helps with memory. It helps with, uh, you know, better energy. It helps with recovery from right. You know, all types of sicknesses or stresses on your body. So, sure. Obviously just helps make it, helps you, um, uh, respond better to all the stresses of life, you know? So, in fact, if you think about it, if you don't get restful sleep, you know, and it's like generally if you're tired, you're going to be grumpy or you're going to have a shorter fuse, you're gonna fly off the handle.

Speaker 1: (04:25)
You know, it's like if you yell at your kids, it's usually because I've noticed like if I get snippy with my kids, um, it's usually cause I'm real tired. I just don't have the, uh, the energy to, to put up with it saws, you know, I snap out and, right. And so it's like, man, it again, it's one of those things that it makes sense that that would do it, but now they actually have science that shows it. Yeah. Well, and that mechanism is just kinda crazy. Um, they, they talk about one of the, um, harmful waste products that they talked about is beta amyloid. And that's a, that's a big topic because when we talk about things like dementia, that's a common kind of byproduct or a buildup that they see. Alzheimer's. The plaque. Yeah, exactly. The plaquing that occurs. And it's interesting because, uh, this is like brand new.

Speaker 1: (05:15)
This is published today, uh, November 1st in, uh, issue of sciences where they published it. And it's interesting because she, the, the, uh, Laura Lewis goes on to say that, that, uh, these findings do not prove that deep sleep helps ward off dementia or other diseases. Um, and I understand in terms of they want to be cautious about the implications, claims of claims that they're made. But at the same token, it's like, you know what, here's the deal. Sleep, good, good rest and good high sleep hygiene and getting that peop breast certainly not going to make it any worse. You know. So I, I think the, the, I think logical thing to say is, is that this should be included as part of an overall strategy for brain health. Well, they've done studies and they've done loads of studies where they deprive people of sleep. Oh yeah.

Speaker 1: (06:09)
And it makes people insane. Well, not only that, but they also look at, they've done sleep deprivation studies where they show dramatic increases in inflammatory markers throughout the body. Uh, they, they've done studies where they show that, uh, your body increases something known as substance P, which is a pain, um, ma mediator. It increases your body's, or it may, basically what it does is it lowers your body's pain threshold so you're more sensitive to pain. Um, and so it's just, just understand, you know, that, that uh, we don't need to tip toe around this intervention here. We can be really pretty, quite clear, uh, and pretty definitive to say that that sleep can help your body in just about any way that anything you're struggling with sleep can certainly help with. We've done earlier episodes where we talk specifically about sleep. If you haven't listened to it, do you know, sleep is, it can be a trick for, um, plenty of individuals who suffer from sleep deprivation because of work schedules because of sure.

Speaker 1: (07:12)
Insomnia or other issues. There are ways to help reprogram your sleep patterns. Yes. And so learn how to do so if you're struggling with it and you know things, there's things like sleep apnea, you name it. There's, there's reasons why our sleep can be interrupted. And if, you know, you do have issues with it, um, work on getting that figured out because it's going to, it really will impact your longterm health. Have you seen, have you had personal experiences dealing with patients where, uh, you've seen, uh, you know, indirect or direct benefits from chiropractic adjustments, helping them improve their sleep? Sleeping better. Yeah. Cause you decrease pain. Right. But, but even, even other than that, I mean, obviously that's a, that's a very logical one to write, but, um, just in terms of that logic tells me that improving one's mechanical function is going to improve the body's ability to be able to get into a deeper state of relaxation and therefore help in terms of sleep.

Speaker 1: (08:10)
Yeah. Whatever the mechanism, mechanism, mechanism is, sorry. That's M and a, whether it be from, you know, just neurologically relaxing your body or decreasing pain, whatever it is. Yeah. Definitely makes a difference. Yeah. So, uh, so yeah, powerful new, a new study. Um, and, and the way that it goes about it is pretty, you know, so many studies like this to me just really remind us what, what a powerful thing our bodies are and are capable of, you know, that they are truly designed when we allow them to do the things that they're normally meant to do. If we get out of our own way, um, they can do some pretty powerful things that, that they're normally just programmed to be able to do. And stuff like this is always powerful too because it just shows us and reminds us that we're learning new stuff all the time, that we don't have everything figured out.

Speaker 1: (08:59)
Sure. There's still so much that we don't know, um, about something as fundamental as sleep. Um, and so just look at this in terms of your own life. Um, you know, if you're looking for ways to kind of quote unquote detox your brain, you know, um, if you feel like you're overworked, overstressed, uh, maybe you feel like you need to take a little bit of a break from social media and where other, um, you know, things that are just kind of firing at you at all at all times. Maybe look at sleep is a very, you know, useful and effective therapeutic tool for doing that for. And now the research again supports that, you know, that, that it can, you know, the, the, the, the, the headline of the article said that it, it can rinse quote unquote the days toxins from the brain. So, uh, don't underestimate the power of a good nights sleep. Don't, uh, it's a powerful, powerful tool. Uh, it's the way our body was normally designed to be able to rest and restore. Um, so utilize that. It's available to all of us. Um, so we can use that as a, as a tool for helping us with our health. So, uh, thanks for listening and hope this has been useful and we look forward to sharing more with you guys on the next episode. Talk to you later.

Speaker 2: (10:15)
Thanks for listening to the health front of middles podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you knew other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here, Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 34 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're talking about the question is your doctor a jerk? So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:13)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:33)
So, Hey everybody, on today's episode we're talking about the question is your doctor a jerk? A and there's actually some pretty profound evidence now that suggests, uh, that this is, this could be the difference between you improving in your health or not very. Um, yeah. And, and, uh, you know, it's interesting. I first started, uh, well, I've always intuitively felt like bedside manner has been this often downplayed element that I've always felt is far more crucial in the overall equation of, of health and healing and helping patients. Um, then people are willing to admit, uh, and, and reason being is because I think far too often we want to think and believe that skill and expertise and the actual things that are being done are the secret. Uh, and, and not to dismiss or downplay or say, but those things don't matter. Those are important.

Speaker 1: (01:30)
Yeah, they are. Absolutely. Um, but I think the reality of it is his bedside manner and the way the doctor conducts himself interacting with the patient, the way he communicates, or she, he or she, I'm saying he here, but he or she, um, makes just as much of a difference. It is just as important as skill, as clinical competence, as the actual interventions that are being done. I've always felt that way. I've always just intuitively believed that to be the case. And I think most people, when you present this to them, I would say would, would, would feel similarly. Sure. And I saw a book that has recently come out and I, I have it. I haven't read all of it yet. I started it. Um, it's called compassion omics. And it's talking about this very thing. But there was an article that was recently published, uh, that said it.

Speaker 1: (02:18)
The, the, the article is entitled the power of bedside manner on pain. And it said, new research shows how a doctor's beliefs and attitudes affect patient outcomes. And so they talk about this idea of not just bedside manner in terms of does the doctor communicate well and as he kind and is he compassionate and does he, uh, you know, effectively communicate. But does the doctor exude confidence and competence in terms of their attitudes towards, uh, the patient with regard to what it is that they're doing? You know, and, and that should make perfect sense because those sorts of seemingly subtle or maybe at times not so subtle things can have a tremendous impact on the patients, uh, expectations. Uh, and the patient's attitudes and beliefs and our own personal attitudes and beliefs dramatically impact our own health outcomes. I mean, this has been proven time and time again in research that's been done.

Speaker 1: (03:18)
Um, most people have heard of the placebo effect. Um, and I would say that maybe people haven't heard of the other side of that coin. The darker side that what we call the no seat CBO, the no CBOE right. Placebo effect is this idea that people have heard of, that your mind can shape and alter your physiology. Um, you know, for good meaning, you know, if you've heard of research where they take and compare they, they blind things or they use placebo controls, uh, to determine what's the mechanism of action behind a patient getting better results. Was it that the intervention actually really did something or was it that the patient's own mind believed it and therefore it was so, um, because placebos are very, very real powerful. It is powerful. But on the flip side, no CBO is, is, is powerful as well. And it's basically the opposite.

Speaker 1: (04:06)
That if you think and believe and feel that, that there is going to be a negative outcome, that you're going to get sick, that you're gonna do better, that your pain is gonna be worse, then it happens just as much. You know? And I think sometimes people often, um, dis not dismiss placebo but, but look down on it like it's this bad thing. I think it's a great thing. I was fully tastic especially, yeah, sometimes you just have to get things right in your own man, in your own mind to be able to move onto a healthier place. And absolutely for a lot of people, whether it be with getting to a healthy weight or getting over sicknesses or you name it, I mean there's, your mind is 100% essential for you to Rick up to fully recover from anything. Right. But you know, there's something, as you were talking about, you know, that your doctor being, um, you know, confident in and uh, and a good communicator and kind and, and don't want one of the, the, the one little caveat I would say from a, having worked with a lot of patients, don't be a doctor that or, or, or don't be upset if your doctor tells you something that's a little bit hard.

Speaker 1: (05:14)
But because sometimes, um, we, uh, patients and I, and I say we as in myself included, we will kind of, um, we will try to poopoo the, the maybe the severity of certain things that we are or are not doing, whether we take care of something that's really important or not. If a doctor tells you, listen, you are grossly overweight and you and, and it can be done in a nice way, tactful tactfully. But if someone tells you something and it's hurtful to you, I don't believe all doctors, some doctors do have poor bedside manner. Absolutely. I don't believe all doctors who may have to I and that's hard for to tell someone, listen you're really unhealthy. Yeah. You really need to like for us to be able to help you even though it's for us. Maybe your back or your leg or your hip.

Speaker 1: (06:08)
Yeah. Like we have to help you get to a healthier weight. You can't, you can't discredit or call that doc or that doctor sucks cause he's, he said I was fat. Yeah. Or he said I was lazy or whatever. You know, if someone tells you something, that is it. I mean, it's not easy for us to have to say that to people, right? Honestly. Well, any, and again, I think the key here that you're talking about is not what's being said, but how it's being cyst. That's the difference. And the reality of it is, is that we have to be self aware enough as individuals to accept the fact that human nature is such that we always want to put softening filters on everything that's coming through because none of us want to admit that we're lazy, that we're fat, that we're, you know, unhealthy that were, you know, all these we don't want, we don't necessarily enjoy hearing those sorts of things.

Speaker 1: (06:58)
And so sometimes, uh, removing those filters can be a painful, can be a little bit of a painful process. But again, what that does is that reiterates and reinforces, I think even further this whole power of how the doctor interacts with the patient, they can make all the difference in the world. Because I think there is a way that you can, you can kind of, um, tread that line very, very carefully and delicately, but yet very effectively by delivering that kind of information in a, in a very, um, honest, transparent, competent and but care but caring way to the patient to the, to the degree that they know that it's not coming from, um, you know, a place of judgment. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, and I think that to be perfectly honest, our experience in this, that that is established at the beginning of the relationship, you know, that before you even entertain or start getting those questions, I think that's the key.

Speaker 1: (07:57)
You know, it's really interesting. Um, they've done studies, I remember an article about this and I can't remember off the top of my head. I know it came from one of our malpractice insurance carriers where they write monthly articles about various scenarios and stuff of, you know, take home lessons on how to obviously mitigate risk in terms of your patient encounters. But one of the things that they talked about was a factor that that dramatically increased the likelihood of whether or not a doctor was going to get sued or not. And it was something as fundamental and simple as did the patient feel like the doctor was listening to them if they felt like the doctor wasn't listening to them, that they won't, that they weren't being heard, the likelihood of a doctor's malpractice suits went up dramatically. Wow. Dramatically. And it's something as simple as does the patient feel like they're being heard, but that they're being validated in the things that they're dealing with.

Speaker 1: (08:51)
And that happens at the beginning of that relationship. That's something that, that, that, that starts from the get go. Um, and so the, the whole take home I think in, in all of this is that, um, it's, it's a two way street really. Uh, number one, uh, if your doctor is a jerk, fire your doctor. You don't have to, you know what I mean? Feel like you have to stick with somebody if you don't feel like. Um, and, and I think that's surprising to me to be honest with you is I feel like sometimes I've heard over the years of patients where they tell me these stories and it just makes my jaw drop sometimes. I'm like, the doctor said, what do you, and I've had personal experiences. My wife and I, uh, you know, with, with, uh, through the years, uh, my wife having dealt with infertility years ago, um, she dealt with a handful of doctors who were less than compassionate, um, very just very poor bedside manner.

Speaker 1: (09:46)
One in particular I remember, um, was a jerk. He was just an outright jerk. And guess what? We didn't go back and see him, you know, my wife found another doctor. So don't feel like you have to continue down that road just because, you know. Um, but, but on the flip side of that, also maybe doing a little bit of self reflection as to whether or not you have the self awareness and the ability to, um, you know, consider whether or not there is truth in things that are reported back to you that may, um, cause some potential initial discomfort of hearing, you know, that you may not want to hear, you know, if the doctor tells you more or less, you know, uh, in hopefully a better filtered way, but that you're fat, you know, if he, if he says you're fat, are you going to listen to that or is there, is there truth to that?

Speaker 1: (10:36)
And what are you gonna do about it, you know, or, or other various things. And so I guess that's that whole point, you know. Um, but just understand, uh, the, the, the punchline in all of this is the research is supporting something I think that we intuitively should feel is right. You know, that the way that the doctor or healthcare professional in general, um, communicates with the patients is gonna make all the difference in the world in terms of their outcomes. Uh, and this is especially true when it comes to pain. Um, pain is such an interesting, um, very fascinating, uh, aspect of, of health, you know, and, and so much of that realm of pain because so much of it is so subjective and so, so unique to each individual. Um, this whole idea of, of the doctor's bedside manner, we'll just say in general, um, can have such a profound impact for good or for bad, you know.

Speaker 1: (11:38)
So anyways, uh, any other thoughts you have about it? No. No, not really. Okay. Alright. Be a cool doctor. Be a [inaudible] patient. Yeah. And get better. Yeah. Be good to each other. B, you know, we'll end this with bill and Ted's excellent adventure, you know, be, be excellent to each other. Right. So, anyways, uh, I hope this has been interesting for you and hopefully this has been helpful. And if you know others that could benefit, uh, a subscribed to the podcast, let us know a comment, ask questions, let us know if you'd like to hear anything specific that you'd like to us to tackle in terms of a topic a and then share this with others that you think could benefit from it. And, uh, we're excited to share more with you on the next episode. Have a good one guys.

Speaker 2: (12:23)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop. And in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 33 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be talking about new research and guidelines that suggest doing this to survive cancer and even in some cases prevented in the first place. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:19)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:38)
So, Hey everybody, hope you guys are having a great day. Uh, we wanted to share some new research with you guys. That's pretty, pretty powerful, awesome. But yet very simple. You know, um, there, there has been a body of, uh, research groups, uh, the American college of sports medicine. Um, I think it was also the American cancer society and 15 other, uh, international organizations who all gathered and were looking at the research in terms of, um, you know, cancer and specifically the question that they were looking at is does cancer, uh, and does exercise play a role in helping with cancer? And overwhelmingly they looked at the research and back in, uh, 10 years ago, basically there was, I think kind of, there wasn't consensus on this subject, but they've since kind of looked at it and they said resoundingly, uh, the answer that they say is very clear.

Speaker 1: (01:33)
They say that exercise definitely helps in terms of cancer survival rates, but exercise also helps in terms of helping you prevent it, uh, altogether in the first place. And, um, this might sound at first glance, like overly simplistic, but I think the implications here are, are really powerful because of the fact that exercise is something that doesn't cost you anything. Typically you don't, you don't have to have a gym membership. You can get out and walk and move and do whatever. But also exercise is such a, um, powerful tool for health. And wellbeing. You know, in this article they basically went on to say, um, that, uh, they said that, uh, exercise helps with, uh, the anxiety and depression that often accompanies cancer. Yup. But that it also helps with, uh, fatigue that can often accompany cancer and oftentimes a lot of the various cancer treatments, uh, radiation and chemotherapy, which can, I can't even begin to imagine, uh, the challenge and the strain that that puts on you, but yet, uh, exercise, um, I think oftentimes can be thought of as something that is fatiguing in and of itself.

Speaker 1: (02:51)
Exactly. Um, but the reality of it is, is just the opposite. It can be very renewing and help, uh, increase energy. Right. And you had kind of about this, you know, in terms of that initial startup of, of exercise. Yeah. I, in fact, I remember taking many, many years ago, um, my first year in college, I signed up for a swimming class, which was literally an hour of just doing laps. And I'll tell you what, the first few days, like fact, the first week I was, I was wasted. I mean, I was so depleted. I hadn't been exercising before that really. And, and I mean I was so tired and depleted for the first week, but then the following week I'm, in fact I was getting ready to drop the class cause I'm like, dude, this is killing me. I can't hardly function after. And then all of a sudden my, my energy just went through the roof, you know?

Speaker 1: (03:39)
And since then in life, I've had many opportunities or experiences with that same phenomenon where you, here you are just doing incredibly intense workouts, sometimes twice a day. And, um, and having more energy than I had when I wasn't working out at all. And it, and it kind of flies in the face of maybe logic as far as [inaudible] seem counterintuitive. Exactly. If you're drained, if you're expending more energy than you ever have, you would think that tank would be drained. But our body has this amazing ability to adapt and to, um, and really just kind of create more energy centers in our body to be able to provide the energy needed and right. And so, you know, at the end of the day here, um, the beautiful thing about this, when you look at the guidelines and everything, I'm sure they give some pretty detailed specifics and whatnot, but the last line of this article, um, that you can read in New York times, uh, the, uh, the recommendation from, from this doctor.

Speaker 1: (04:35)
Um, she basically just said, I recommend that my patients just get up and move, just do something. Something is going to be better than nothing. And so it's one of those areas where, you know, um, there's a fairly broad or wide range of things that you can do. Um, and you're not gonna get it wrong, you know. Um, the recommendation I would have is, is don't go from zero to Mach 10 overnight. You know, because sometimes that can be counterintuitive, not just from a standpoint of risk of injury. Let's just assume you're fine. You're not going to get injured there even though you certainly can. But the problem that I think is all to more common is that when, what that does is the next day or day after two days or three days after, it creates so much soreness and you can actually function. Yeah. It'll, it'll kind of beat you up a little bit and then all of a sudden you're kind of back to square one and you're, and that doesn't really help in terms of overall motivation.

Speaker 1: (05:29)
You know, it's, it's a, you, you kind of punish yourself a little bit too much. And I understand where that comes from for a lot of people. Sometimes you get this surge of like motivation and you're just, you know, this, you almost like this emotionally euphoric state where you're just like, I'm gonna conquer. I'm not doing anything. You know, I'm going to climb a mountain. Then you go out and you just overdo it. And it's just one of those things where it's like, yeah, that's not a, that is a counterintuitive strategy. That's not a terribly sustainable longterm, you know. Um, I read, uh, you know, the advice given by Darren Hardy in the book, the compound effect, which we recommend all the time. In fact, we've probably talked about that on multiple episodes, but his recommendation to a friend of his who was wanting to get started in running is he said, run to the point where you just are winded and then stop and walk the rest of the way.

Speaker 1: (06:18)
And then he said, and then run a little bit further the next day and then run a little bit further the next day and just add to it day by day by day. Just take it one day at a time. And, and, and sooner than you think. You'll see that, that over time you begin to grow and develop and improve your, your resilience and your resistance and your endurance. Um, and, and it's one of those things where it's like this doesn't require you to have some sort of a full time dedicated strength and conditioning coach showing you the way and helping you to develop some really highly scientific process or plan. Although I don't discourage that. If you've got the means and the resources to do that, by all means, that's awesome. Do that. But for people who are, are watching or listening to this podcast who are like, man, I want to get started with exercise, take that approach, take it that just kind of improving one day at a time, just by a percentage point, you know, a percentage at a time just kind of slowly but surely that long game.

Speaker 1: (07:18)
Yeah, it is just just making sure. And, and what that does is that really helps establish a habit, you know, and honestly more than that, like I have trained on two different occasions to run a half marathon, something that I, I hated running prior to. I still don't much care for it, but you know, like six weeks before I'm just grinding out, running, getting prepared for this, this really brutal half marathon. And um, and then afterward I'm like, Oh, I did it. And I totally just dropped the ball. And it was a year and a half later where I was like, I'm going to do that same race again. Yeah. And I did the same thing. You know, I put all this energy in and I, and I am 100% certain that, I mean if I were to just run a half a mile every day versus 50 miles trying to prepare for this one event.

Speaker 1: (08:08)
Right. You know what I mean? It's like a half a mile a day for over longevity is going to have way greater impact than running a hundred miles in eight weeks. Right. You know, I think, I think it's a lot of the same type of mentality and discipline that you hear in terms of advice on investing for retirement. Sure. You know, like, and they've, you know, they've shown these examples of somebody who starts investing for retirement at age 30, let's just say, and it's just doing small amounts, but consistently over years, you know, over the years versus somebody who puts in tons of money, you know, by age 50 or 60 a, you know, and, and even though they're making way higher payments that because of that compounding time, you know, and I would say that it's the same, you know, mentality that we want to approach in terms of our health that, that you can, you can yield compounding interest, so to speak, in terms of your health, if nothing more than just really solidifying sure.

Speaker 1: (09:08)
Those habits, you know, over time those habits become deeper and deeper and deeper ingrained into your system. Um, that, that it really does pay bigger dividends because it becomes that much easier for you to stick with. So, so powerful. So, uh, in terms of, you know, the, the, the point of all this, you know, this research is powerful because it's, it's simple and it reinforces something that I think most people intuitively can think and believe. And that is that exercise has such a profound therapeutic role in helping our lives even with something as profound and, and seemingly ominous as cancer. You know, that it helps not only survival of cancer but also in terms of overall prevention of, of developing cancer. So, um, hopefully this has been powerful food for thought for you guys in terms of your own health. Um, get out and exercise, get moving, keep it simple, stay consistent with it and uh, share this with others. If you know others that can benefit. Um, this is a powerful new study. Again, New York times, check it out yourself and uh, yeah, we look forward to sharing more with you guys on the next episode. Have a good one.

Speaker 2: (10:19)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop. And in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least. If you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 32 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be discussing the question are the diseases from the dark ages making a comeback stick around. And we're going to tell you,

Speaker 2: (00:14)
you're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:34)
So, Hey everybody on today's episode we wanted to share something kinda crazy with you. We came across an article, um, that gave us a lot of food for thought. I guess this is a way to say it. Um, there was an article published not too long ago in the Atlantic, um, and it was entitled medieval diseases are infecting California homeless. And the article basically just goes on to say that they're seeing a, a, a startling rise in a lot of previously rare diseases that you typically didn't see or hear about or that were technically are on virtually erratic camera in America. Yeah, exactly. Um, that they said, you know, were quote unquote medieval diseases, uh, typhus, tuberculosis, um, and a lot of other kind of similar diseases. And the conclusion of it is really quite simple. What they're saying is that with the rise in the homeless population, there has been a dramatic shift, um, in the negative in terms of, uh, public health and hygiene and sanitation.

Speaker 1: (01:40)
Um, they're talking about, you know, just the, these people that are living in these camps are just living in squalor, um, you know, drug needles everywhere, uh, fecal matter everywhere. Um, just, just this, the San, it's, it's become just a dramatic, uh, problem for in terms of, uh, sanitation. Oh, you bet. You know, um, and I think that, I seem to recall several articles and online posts not long ago, a couple over the past few years. And I think there's like some sort of an app or a map that shows like all the different places where a human feces are found in San Francisco where there's just, there's just literally crap everywhere. They have teams of people that that's their job is to go, so you can, you can Mark where something's at and they're supposed to come back through and clean it up. That's crazy. Yeah. Insane. Absolutely crazy.

Speaker 1: (02:28)
You know? And, and so, and so the, the, the implications that we want to kind of discuss today about this is how does this really apply to us personally in terms of our overall health and in terms of the narrative that sometimes we hear. Um, and really what we're going to kind of hopefully dispel is the common misnomer regarding the germ theory of disease. Right? So let's kind of unpack that and kind of talk about the, the germ theory, you know? Yeah. So the germ theory is, you know, you have a germ that gets introduced to a host who to one of us. And if we get introduced to the germ, we're going to get said sickness. So if it's a flu germ, we're going to get the flu. If it's typhus, we're going to get typhus, what have you. So basically, germs caused disease, germs caused the germs caused disease.

Speaker 1: (03:19)
And the funny thing about it is that the fact that we're even questioning this is like almost like heresy, you know, scientific heresy because in the worlds, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Because it's one of those things where people are ridiculed that would even dare question, like that's, that's established scientific fact that germs cause disease. But there's, there's a, there's a subtle, you know, kind of semantics behind it, but, but definitely semantics that matter. So the, the question that's posed, you know, is, is if the germ theory, if that as is holds true, then that would basically mean, or say that anytime that germ is present, anyone or everyone that is exposed to it will get sick. Is that the case? That's, uh, again, if you look at the, the [inaudible] theory, the whole theory of the germ theory, yeah. But is that really the case though? Absolutely not.

Speaker 1: (04:13)
Yeah, absolutely not. And that's kind of one of the things that, uh, you and I were chatting about is, you know, if, if that was the case, everyone exposed to a virus would get sick. And, you know, frequently we see, ya know, everyone in the house except mom or dad or one person doesn't get sick or, you know, for instance, we come in contact with patients almost on a daily basis that ha and sometimes multiple times a day with people that have colds or coughs or flus or whatever. And, and we don't get sick. Right. So, well, and, and, and again, this kind of ties back to a previous episode that we had talked about with um, cold and flu quote unquote season, right? That it's not like all of a sudden they, they mass produce in the winter time and that it, it changes or fluctuates.

Speaker 1: (05:00)
The only thing that changes are, are environmental factors. You know, that, that during the spring and summer and even fall months, we get much more sun exposure. Uh, we're more active. We're more less inclined or, or typically less, uh, dietarily speaking, eating less in terms of carbohydrate intake. You know, holiday time, we're eating a lot more. Um, you know, we're eating a less healthy diet. Um, we're less active, we're more sedentary, typically speaking, you know, and it's flammatory more. Yeah. And so, and so, so that's the thing that changes. And so the, the point of this article that's really powerful that hopefully people can see here is that it really sheds greater light on the real factors at play when it comes to health and, or disease. Um, that your environment is what makes the difference, you know, whether that be your surrounding environment or even the internal environment, you know, the environment of the host itself, right.

Speaker 1: (06:04)
That, and I think this should be welcome news for people because it, it should, it should sound and feel right, not just because it sounds fluffy and nice. You know that you can take control of your health. I know that sounds right, but because it's the truth, it's the absolute truth that, um, that we have a far greater degree of control over the outcome of our health and wellbeing then then oftentimes we're made to believe, you know what I mean? That, that, that, that's the thing I think to me that's kind of frustrating is that if truly the, the germ theory is as is that simple and straightforward, it's, it's almost like this, um, you know, like lottery and you just, you know, you drew the wrong card. Yeah, yeah. I hope, you know, I, you know, and you're, you're just kind of almost like living in fear and, and when, when you start to see the real picture of it that no environmental factors are something you can have a major control over, you know?

Speaker 1: (07:04)
Well, and we had a episode sometime ago or we talked, we were, there was the medical doctor that had said, you can't boost your immune system. Absolutely know with vitamins or adjustments or whatever, you know, and he went through a whole whole list of things that don't boost your immune system. And yet, you know, that that kinda S it throws this, this throws up into the face of that. Like, no, that's totally untrue. Because the, the things you put into your body, the things that you surround your body with, the way you take care of yourself, your cleanliness, all of those things absolutely make a difference in your susceptibility to disease and or illness. And the problem with him that that particular doctor was that he was, he was kind of playing with semantics and sheriff, he was basically implying that when you say boosts your immune system, what you're really talking about is you're, you're, you're toying with auto immune problems where your immune system all of a sudden gets super hyped up and revved up and then all of a sudden you're dealing with autoimmune problems.

Speaker 1: (08:04)
Well, it's not, we're talking about, obviously we're talking about things in balance. There are ways to strengthen and enhance your body's resilience to illness and disease. That's just fact. That's you. That's you. And that's logical fact to it by sense. Right? It makes perfect sense that, you know, the way one lives, their life will ultimately either enhance the likelihood of them being healthier, more resilient in general and less likely to contract illness or disease and the way that one lives or doesn't live their life on the other hand can dramatically alter in the negative. Right. I mean, and again, this, this article here proves it. It's like if, if, if these diseases were really, truly the ultimate cause, then we would see a rise everywhere, not just in these specific populations. What is it that's different or unique or special about the homeless camps in California?

Speaker 1: (09:04)
I think it's obvious. People can see it. It's plain. It's, it's the fact that hygiene and sanitation are not there. They have really, really poor, uh, I mean they're, they're, they're congregated together. And I would even make the case to, not to sound harsh or anything, but I don't think human beings were meant to live. So jam packed together. They weren't, you know what I mean? People lets people need space, you know, that's an important thing. And so, um, when we're, when we're in these really, really crowded population that especially like that where they're just separated by tents. I don't know if you've ever been down to a log row Los Angeles? Well, yeah, even like Burnside when we were, uh, you, you served in our chiropractic schooling, both of us, uh, served at a free community clinic, downtown Portland and that area, I mean, that is, those were some really, really troubled areas, really dirty, uh, very, very poor hygiene.

Speaker 1: (10:00)
And again, please don't misunderstand what we're saying here. This isn't meant to, to make any sort of judgments or accusations or statements. I feel my heart goes out to people who are in tough circumstances and tough situations. Um, but I think it, again, it just clearly goes to show that environmental factors play a massive role in this overall kind of health equation that we're talking about here. And if we just accept the germ theory as is that, that it's again, then I think that's a very disempowering, um, standpoint or view to take on that because then all of a sudden it's just like you have very little to no control over it and you just cross your fingers and you just kind of, and that's the other thing too, is that where do we draw the line in terms of, do we just then wear hazmat suits everywhere every day?

Speaker 1: (10:50)
You know, is that, is that what it becomes? You know, all of a sudden it's like, no, that's not the right way. We want to live our lives. You know, obviously we want to, uh, you know, we want to use common sense, you know? Yes. Wash your hands. Um, yes. Uh, eat a good diet. You know, this, this ties into several episodes that we've talked about. You know, we'd go back to kind of those five fundamentals of health, you know, but, uh, but I thought this was just a really, really powerful and yet at the same time, kind of startling article, you know, that we, we got to really look at, um, you know, these environmental factors, they just can't be ignored and this can be extrapolated so much further than just this isolated situation. But rather in terms of just, um, overall public health policy, understanding, you know, what it is, what are the factors that really, truly drive, uh, either health or disease.

Speaker 1: (11:43)
Right? So, yeah. So anyways, hope this has been, uh, interesting for you guys. Hope this has kind of been eyeopening and maybe even a slight paradigm shift per people in terms of the way that they look at health and disease. You know, um, that you have far more control over these things in your life than, than maybe you perhaps were led to believe or thought. Um, and so, uh, if you know others that can benefit from this information, share it with them. And, uh, we look forward to sharing more with you guys. On the next episode. Have a good one.

Speaker 2: (12:15)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

On this episode of the Health Fundamentals Podcast, we share a shocking new study that links this common habit to early death.  To watch the video of the episode you can watch it here.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and Dr. Buddy Allen. And this is episode 31 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be talking about a groundbreaking new study that links this to early death. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:14)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:33)
So, Hey everybody on today's episode, we've got something really interesting to share with you. There was a groundbreaking new study that was just released that I think, uh, helps dispel a really pretty common myth. Um, that's pretty pervasive amongst, um, clever, uh, food marketers, I guess is what we'll say. Um, this is basically what the new study said. It said, it doesn't matter and this is coming from, this was a, uh, an article we saw on Washington post. It doesn't matter if it's sugary or diet. New study links all soda to an early death. Um, there was a study, um, that was published in the journal of the American medical association, internal medicine. They said that participants who drank two or more glasses of soft drinks per day had a higher risk of mortality than those who consumed less than one glass per month. And it didn't matter if it was diet soda or regular a soda, the risk was the same.

Speaker 1: (01:39)
So that kind of has a lot of implications because the first one being we all have, um, one we've been lied to and, or misled by marketers, you know, diet versus, you know, non dye. And there's other studies that's, that say diet, uh, because of the sweeteners. There's a lot of different things that can happen from artificial sweeteners. Um, it also shows that people who drink diet soda has actually gained more weight because they crave other things. Right? So, I mean, but even beyond that, I think even far, far deeper reaching is our infinite capacity to justify, um, habits that we know are not great. Right. You know, because I think even people who drink diet soda know that, you know what, it's not the best of habits. Right. And, um, it really, I think we, but, but, but that's the, what you just said there, that they think it's not the best of habits, but they think it's a better yes.

Speaker 1: (02:37)
Than drinking regular soda. And that's just not the case at all. It's not, it's like, look, you're, you're better drinking water. Yeah. You know, or even for that matter, I mean, any, for those who don't like water, let's say there are a lot of other options to flavor your water with various electrolyte powders and things like that, that are far better you then, um, than diet soda for heaven's sake. You can even, if you want put, put a handful of Stevia drop, not handful, but a few Stevia drops flavored Stevia drops is going to be far better for you than diet soda. Sure. But obviously water is going to be your best face. You bet. Obviously. So, um, so anyways, this study was one of the largest of its kind. Um, they tracked over 450, 1000, 450, 1,743 men and women, uh, from 10 countries in Europe.

Speaker 1: (03:31)
Um, and so, um, didn't matter. Uh, basically they said for sweetened soft drinks, one or more glasses a day were associated with deaths from digestive diseases, including diseases of the liver, appendix, pancreas and intestines. And that makes perfect sense. I mean, you're, you're putting a tremendous amount of stress and strain on those organs. Uh, obviously pancreas, you know, if you're, if you're consuming, um, re regular soda, I mean, you're putting it, uh, I mean it's like almost like you're putting a straight IV of sugar into your body's system. And so what's going to have to happen is your pancreas is going to have to produce a significant amount of, uh, insulin and other, uh, various, uh, hormones to be able to assist in. This is kind of scary. Adolescent Italy for two years and a long time ago, mind you and I, and maybe there's soda consumption has gone up a lot, but they didn't drink a fraction of the soda that we drink here in the state.

Speaker 1: (04:32)
Right? They don't have big gas stations where you can buy 30 to 44 ounce fountain drinks at all. I mean, you couldn't buy a two liter or, or you know, cans or bottles, but they don't consume soda like we do here in America. No, even close to the same amount. Right. So I mean, you think about this, the numbers that they're, that they're already showing from Europe, that's kind of a little bit even more scary for those numbers or what those numbers would look like here for us know. Absolutely. You know, and, and without, um, you know, without making it sound too, I think some times the implications that are drawn from these things can make, it almost seem like we're pointing the finger at some sort of a vast conspiracy. But the fact of the matter is there's a tremendous amount of money in the, in the sugar.

Speaker 1: (05:20)
We'll just say the sugar industry, you know, I know there've been several documentaries that have been made, uh, talking about this, you know, that for years researchers have known that it's not fat that's the big demon that they wanted it to be, but rather it's sugar, you know, the carbohydrate intake has been the, in fact you said you, you watched a documentary not too long ago Halloween, uh, type one diabetes. And that was his conclusion that he had done research. Uh, the, the background on that documentary. Tell us about the background about that individual. Like, so my wife, um, was diagnosed with type one diabetes just two years ago. And so she, this, you know, trying to figure out this whole new way of living. You know, she's done a lot of research and digging and she found an old Jew, and I'm sorry, I don't remember his name, but there's a, an old doctor, um, who, uh, it's kind of funny.

Speaker 1: (06:09)
His, he was diagnosed when he was 12 with type one diabetes. And so as he grew older and there was so many things that they were doing wrong that he, it just, it wasn't working. He intuitively felt like gatherer was better approaches. He was a, an engineer, um, you know, through schooling and stuff. And he started figuring things like when the first glucose monitors came out and he actually rigged one up to be it as a huge device that he rigged up and took with him so he could check his blood like regularly throughout the day with you based upon what he was eating. And he had tons of wonderful, um, data to share with the [inaudible] American medical association and these different journals. And they all poo-pooed it saying like, Oh no, it's better. It's better that they have, there's no indication that high co, uh, carbohydrates affects diabetes at all.

Speaker 1: (07:00)
Now mind you, this is back in the the fifties and late fifties and sixties when he was first doing this, but that's still not that long ago. You think about it in terms of they had to have, I, I thought they had a much more thorough grasp of human physiology and biochemistry. Well, long story sort is this gentleman ends up going to med school because no one would listen to him because he was not a medical doctor. Um, goes to med schools. So he can now be more informed and informed the, the powers that be. But even to this day, the, um, the diabetic associations, diet recommendations are grossly you just way too much carbohydrates, way too much. And he and his whole story is like, look, you know, he's kind of helping people learn how to eat and manage their blood sugars so they're not destroying themselves cause carbohydrates, uh, you know, shook too many sugars in anyone's system.

Speaker 1: (07:55)
Stays toxic. Yeah. So it just so happens that diabetes, uh, you know, diabetics suffer the greatest, um, affects of it just because they can't eliminate those sugars or processed them as well as others. Right. And, and so, so for those who are watching, who have heard of diabetes before and have heard of insulin in the pancreas in that real quick, that, that relationship, but may not be too familiar with how it all works. Basically when your body has sugar, your body uses that as a fuel source and your cells will use that, um, cellular intracellularly as a fuel source. But the way that they receive that, or at least most cells in our body receive that is through insulin. Insulin is what shuttles that sugar into the cells so that the cells can utilize that as fuel, as energy. But if there's an excess of it, then what they'll do, what the body will do is it'll store it in the liver.

Speaker 1: (08:53)
Um, it'll, it'll kind of package it together as a big kind of compound known as glycogen. Um, and then beyond that, when we've kind of reached that, then it'll store it in fat cells, it'll, it'll convert it and you get excess fat. Um, but then beyond that, uh, the body will then begin to eliminate it, uh, through various channels. Obviously urinating, screening it through all those different things. But beyond that, when they, there gets a point in time where it's like the body can only do so much, and then all of a sudden we're talking about, uh, toxicity and all of those different things. So anyhow, um, so in terms of the implications of, of this, these two stones, these two are the, these, this study diet, sugary soda punchline is pretty straight forward. You know, how we fuel ourselves makes a big difference on our health.

Speaker 1: (09:46)
That's pretty obvious, you know, and so one simple way that we can dramatically increase the longevity of our lives and the overall function and, and the way we feel, the way we function, uh, is eliminating sugar. You know, and one of the fastest and easiest ways is to eliminate the soda eliminate, um, either way diet or, or other doesn't, it doesn't matter. No, absolutely. So, uh, that can be one of the most simple, straightforward ways that you could make a dramatic improvement in your health is just to eliminate that altogether. That's just a healthy habit. Yeah, absolutely. That's a healthier habit to, um, just learn to not drink your calories even if they're fake. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So, um, hopefully this has been eyeopening for you guys. Uh, if you've been meaning to quit the habit of drinking soda, diet or otherwise, uh, let this be perhaps, maybe a wake up call and or yet again another subtle or not so subtle reminder to stop that. So, um, anyways, hopefully this has been valuable. If you know others that could benefit, make sure you share it with them. Make sure you subscribe to this podcast and if you've got questions or comments, let us know and we look forward to sharing more with you on the next episode. We'll talk to you later.

Speaker 2: (10:58)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least. If you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and dr buddy Allen. And this is episode 30 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be sharing with you how to Bulletproof your immune system. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:12)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. buddy Allen. And this show is about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:31)
So, Hey everybody, hope you're having an awesome day on today's episode. We've got something really cool we want to share with you guys. And that is how to Bulletproof your immune system. Uh, what do we mean by Bulletproof? Your immune system? Bulletproof means just make yourself as resilient as absolutely possible to diseases, to colds, to the flu, to any really distress, even yell to the things that beat you down in life. Yeah. Um, how can we make you Bulletproof to those issues? Yeah. If you listen to our previous episode, we dove pretty deep in terms of, uh, flu, cold and flu season. What is, what typically, uh, refer to as this time of year is that kind of time of year. We kind of make the argument that it's not really cold and flu season as much as it is the fact that certain, uh, things change in terms of our lifestyle this time of year that make us far more susceptible to, uh, illness, you know, uh, we get less sunlight, uh, where we're more sedentary this time of year.

Speaker 1: (01:34)
Dietarily speaking, you know, starting right about Halloween time. We're eating a lot more refined sugars and carbohydrates and just junk. Um, you know, uh, we're typically not as active. Sure. I'm kinda talked about that sedentary, but, uh, you know, just kind of a lot of these different factors that, uh, tend to lower our body's immune response. They tend to have a negative impact on our bodies. Uh, overall resiliency and its ability to be able to take care of itself. So, uh, if you guys have followed the podcast for any length of time, we try and make things as, as straightforward as possible because any more these days, it's not a matter of, uh, you know, a lack of information that I think causes people to, uh, stray or to kind of miss the Mark in terms of making good decisions for their health. But the, the challenge I think is how to make the best, or how to, how to, how to Wade through the massive information as to what's gonna be, uh, the best information, what's going to be useful, um, what's not useful, what's a distraction, what's, you know, just information that we need to be able to kind of Wade through defined, kinda refer to it as the in and out menu or cheesecake factory menu.

Speaker 1: (03:01)
Right, exactly. No, it's like there's so many things on the cheesecake factory where it's, it's like Allah, you don't even know what to choose because well, maybe it's too much. Yeah. Whereas when it's simplified, it's real easy to say, Hm, that makes sense to me. Yeah. That's what I want today. Absolutely. And so that's what we're going to do for you guys today in terms of, uh, bolstering your immune system, really doing the essential things that will help you, uh, the most dramatically increase your odds of, uh, either avoiding altogether, uh, illnesses that come around this time of year and, or helping you, uh, mitigate and reduce the impact of the symptoms associated if you do wind up getting a cold or flu or some other, a nasty bug or, or anything like that. So, um, if again, if you followed what we've taught for any period of time, we talk about this lens of five fundamentals of health, and we talk about five fundamentals of health, again, for terms of just providing clarity, making it really clear and easy to understand for people.

Speaker 1: (04:02)
So fundamental number one, we talk about this idea, uh, that health comes from the insight, uh, and not the opposite. And you had mentioned, you know, that people's instinct is to do what this time of year be extremely reactive. You by the minute that we start, we get a sniffle. Yeah. Or we're around someone that had a cold and we're like, we're, we're dropping the airborne and we're pumping the vitamin C and taken our multivitamin and, and uh, you know, the, the, the truth is that we have to be building up all the time. It just has to be a steady, like a regular part of our life, not just a, Ooh, you know, cause this, that's kind of how we've been conditioned though is absolutely sick. And you're like, Oh, I need medication. I have a headache. Ooh, I need something to make the pain go away, Ryan.

Speaker 1: (04:48)
And most of what we're talking about with avoiding colds or even future more severe issues is about making smart, simple choices now, creating healthy routines, doing, doing the things you know, that, that consistency is what we want. And that's, and that's the number two exactly. Led set in listening. And since this simplicity and consistency. So what does that mean in terms of practicality for you? Right. So, number one, you know, health comes from the insight that might seem like, okay, that's good in theory, but how do I actually take that and implement that into day to day action? Well, that kinda takes us to number two. And that is this whole idea of simplicity and consistency. And what I would simply say in terms of very pragmatic approaches that you can take for you individually and for your family. It's just to do a, almost like create your own personal and family battle plan for cold and flu season.

Speaker 1: (05:40)
And basically write down a simple checklist of things that you can do daily that you know, will have a positive impact on your body's immune system. You know, those daily putting in those daily, uh, you know, um, deposits, you know, in of your health. So things like, you know, are you hydrating adequately? Most people don't do this. And I think most don't do it because they just, it's an oversight. Yeah. It's cold outside. Cold outside. Yeah. Thirsty. Yeah, absolutely. So, so proper hydration, making sure you're getting adequate hydration throughout the day. Um, you know, there are numerous different, um, flavorings that you can get that are actually really good that, that don't really interfere or aren't loaded with crappy sugar and things like that that you can do that make drinking a little bit easier for some people. Um, I actually just got this new electrolyte, um, powder that I put that tastes great.

Speaker 1: (06:34)
It's an orange mango flavored, uh, tastes really good. I know you have several that you use that are good for hydration, you know, so, but if people who are just like, ah, I don't like the, you know, I don't like drinking all that water by itself. There's that variety of different ways that you can make it a lot more fun and enjoyable. Lemon. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Fresh calling. Yeah. I'm saying there's no number way. So hydration is a good way. Making sure that you're reminding you, you, yourself and your family washing your hands regularly, making sure you're getting adequate vitamin D intake. We talked in our last episode about that, you know, making sure if you're not somewhere that is allowing you to be able to get adequate sun exposure. Uh, doing a good vitamin D supplement. Uh, there's some really good liquid vitamin D supplements out there that allow you get really high doses of vitamin D very easy in a dropper too.

Speaker 1: (07:22)
Yeah, absolutely. So, uh, vitamin D, making sure dietarily you know, that you've got that on your checklist as well. Um, making sure that you're getting adequate rest, making sure that you're getting adequate exercise. Um, so, so those are just a few of the simple things, you know, in terms of when we talk about that second fundamental simplicity and consistency. The third is making sure our bodies are functioning both correctly, mechanically and chemically. And I would say most people when we talk about biochemically, that's when they think of a, your immune response. That's where most people think, uh, and that's true. You should think in that respect. But believe it or not, your physical frame is gonna have an impact for, for good or for bad on, uh, your body's immune response. Right? So let's talk a little bit about that. Let's, how could a nagging neck, shoulder, or back issue or knee issue or whatever have an impact on, uh, your immune response?

Speaker 1: (08:19)
You know, I once heard, um, it was, uh, Kelly's Dorette I believe. Um, he had talked about our, our frame meaning our axial skeleton. Our spine. Yeah. He says that's the chassis of your body. Yeah. And he said, um, he was, he kinda just said, listen, it's like your car. If your chassis is bent or, or messed up your, your car is gonna drive crooked. It's gonna wear weird on every, I mean it's, everything is going to be effected by that. So he said, you know, he basically says your chassis or your spine needs to be functioning and, and moving correctly. And then, you know, the, you know, your extremities, your arms and your legs and everything else. When things hurt, we don't want to do, we don't want to move, right. Our, our movements get, um, altered. Right. And so, and what happens when, if we alter movement or limited movement or if there's too much movement and the joints start breaking down, they start falling apart.

Speaker 1: (09:14)
So I me it in and that's exactly right. You know, in terms of it's going to make people less motivated, less inclined, less inclined to stay active to do those things. They're going to want to just kind of sleep in and kind of nurse those wounds and things. But then on top of that too is that, uh, you know, if you're dealing with a nagging back issue or a shoulder issue or whatever, that's just one more stressor, uh, a physical stressor on your body and that will take its toll. Um, you know, think about it in terms of like we talked about, you know, in turn when we talked about the simplicity and consistency, we talk about putting in deposits. You know, it's, it's this whole idea. You could, you could simplify it by looking at it in terms of like the scale that you're trying to balance withdrawals versus deposits.

Speaker 1: (09:58)
You know, this time of year there tends to be more withdrawals than deposits. Um, because again, you think about it this time of year, we are more sedentary. We're eating things that probably we wouldn't eat the rest of the year. Uh, we're not getting the sunlight that we need. We're probably not getting the rest that we need. So all these different things, these are all w, you know, just small little withdrawals. But collectively over time what happens is it puts us out of a state of proper balance in terms of our body's resiliency. Um, and so what we're trying to say here is that if you're dealing with injuries, those are gonna, uh, create some, some withdrawals on the body. And we don't want to do that. You know, that's, we want to kind of create that rebalancing, so to speak, by, by making those necessary deposits. And so part of that is taking care of our frame, making sure, uh, that you're getting adjusted regularly, making sure that you're, uh, taking care of any sort of, uh, muscle imbalances, you know, getting, getting massage, making sure that, uh, you know, you're, again, staying moving, you're, you're, you're staying mobile and, and making sure those, those areas are addressed.

Speaker 1: (11:01)
So mechanical. And then in terms of chemically, you know, making sure we are aware of what's happening in our body chemically. You know, I think one of the most simple things, one of the most basic and fundamental things, making sure we're not throwing our body's biochemistry out of total whack by giving it these absurd and ridiculous, uh, spikes and crashes when it comes to blood sugar. You know, again, this time of year, it's not uncommon for people to pound down, you know, a handful or more of candy of, of cakes, of cookies, of sugar, sugary treats, um, all sorts of those things. And so it's, it's, it's that time of year, you know, where it's real easy for people to just indulge. And that's one way chemically in our body that we can throw things out of whack. And again, just add one more element of stress on the body.

Speaker 1: (11:52)
You know, that the body, when it's, when it's having to process a lot of that sugar and, uh, having to, uh, shoot out, uh, you know, a tremendous amount of insulin to help stabilize our body's overall blood sugar. Um, that can be a problem, right? So, so making sure, so, so again, number one, health comes from the inside. Number two, simplicity and consistency. Number three, making sure we're functioning both correctly, mechanically and chemically. Number four, making sure we are mentally, emotionally and spiritually in tune. And when people hear that, I think some people might immediately dismiss it. It sounds like new age, you know, [inaudible] something. But the reality of it is what we're trying to basically say here is that mentally, emotionally, and or spiritually, these components can and will have a huge impact on our physical health and wellbeing. Right? Uh, there's a great book, uh, that just came out, um, by an author that both Dr. Allen and myself really love his, his work.

Speaker 1: (12:55)
Uh, Ryan holiday. Uh, some of his other books he wrote that are great are, uh, the obstacle is the way, um, I love another bunch of his books, but obstacle is a ways is a great book is, but he just came out with a brand new one called stillness is the key. Uh, and we're not done with it, but we, we recently took a road trip together, um, and we listened to a chunk of it and it's just what he shares in that book is amazing. So what you heard and what you learned just from the little that we kind of listened to. What were your take? What were some of your takeaways? What w well, with respect to, um, just your, uh, mental and emotional, um, health and or happiness as he talks a lot about just quieting the noise, being able to, to, to, um, silence a lot of the stuff that you hear around you and kind of just simplify things.

Speaker 1: (13:47)
Again, it's a really about simplifying your right, your life and not letting the noise. Cause you know what I mean? We are bombarded by stressors, whether it be from social media, from work, from family, from, um, personal, um, things that we're struggling with and, and, and the problem being is when we're overwhelmed, it's hard to process anything correctly, you know? So if we are struggling making poor decisions because we're so overwhelmed with different stressors going on in our life, it also makes it harder to eat right. It makes it harder for us if we do get hit with a virus for, believe it or not, our mental health absolutely plays a massive part in our ability to fight off infections, diseases, and other issues that are kind of always working against us or right. You know, that potentially can work against us. Right. Well, and I would even say go so far as to say that the problem isn't just that it's an overwhelming amount of information in terms of just overall volume.

Speaker 1: (14:47)
Right. Which is true. It certainly is that we're, we're overwhelmed by just information in general, but to compound that and make it even worse, is that a significant or an inordinate amount of that information happens to just be negative? Yeah. You know, when you look at the news these days, when you turn on the news, uh, what's the percentage of information that just is outright negative? I would say the majority of the information is always some new thing to worry about or be concerned about or be afraid about. And not to dive into any sort of conspiracy, anything like that. But you think about it just from a marketing standpoint, it would make sense that they would lead with those sorts of stories because it creates a greater level of consumption if you're in a state of fear and or, uh, that fear is creating certain levels of uncertainty.

Speaker 1: (15:41)
And how do I fix that uncertainty? Well, I need to find out more information as to, yeah, exactly know what the, what the punchline is here. And they're going to be sharing more with me about, you know, updates as to this story. If I just keep tuning in, I'll never forget, you know, I think who can, who can forget for those of us who are old enough to remember, uh, when nine 11 occurred, I mean, all you, all I wanted to do during that time, I remember I had to go into work and I remember everybody was just freaking out. And the one thing they w that we all wanted to do was to just watch the news the whole day, to just see what was going on, to stay in the loop. And that's not to say that you shouldn't be informed. That's not to say that at all.

Speaker 1: (16:21)
What I'm just saying is that, uh, you know, negativity, negative information can be very almost addictive sometimes and it can create these very negative spirals. And so what happens is, uh, you know, that that negativity can kind of feed and grow if we don't keep it in check. And so in terms of the information that we receive, you know, going on an information diet can be a very Earnin information. Detox even can be a really powerful thing that you can do in your life. So what would be some ways that you would recommend practically for people to go about doing that? You know what, one of my favorite recommendations was from the four hour work week. Um, I read that years ago and he says he was, uh, the, uh, Tim Ferriss, right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, he had mentioned that, uh, he says, I don't ever look at the news.

Speaker 1: (17:10)
He says, I have people that I trust, people that I believe are well-informed and I will just sit and chat and talk and see what their, see what's going on. I'll ask them, Hey, what's going on in the world? And if they don't say anything worthwhile, he says, I don't waste my time looking for it. So I'm like, you know, having, having people that you, that are level headed, that are, you know, that you can trust that maybe are well-informed. I actually think that's wonderful. You know, I mean, just people that you can trust to kind of give you the straight scoop and, and then, yeah, if you need to do more research, you certainly can. But honestly, most of the stuff that we, that we're, you know, confronted with on a day to day basis is completely useless information anyhow. Yeah. Well, and I would say too, you know, we talked about at the beginning of this episode, this whole idea of making your kind of battle plan or a checklist of things, I would include intentionally in that battle plan, open space.

Speaker 1: (18:01)
Yeah. You know, space for you to have quiet time to be able to think, to be able to turn off the noise. If you're the type of person where you hear that and that resonates with you. Yeah, that's what I'm going to do. I'm going to just basically cut that out. More power to you. For some people, some people may want to watch the news just to stay informed or for to feel like they're getting the information that they need and that's fine. But what I would simply do is create on very, very limited time. I wouldn't do any before bed. I wouldn't do anything in the, in the middle of the mall. You know, first thing in the morning, I would find some time in the day where you limit it for, you know, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, where you, you know what, we're going to get the essentials.

Speaker 1: (18:37)
We're going to go through here and we're going to look at the information that's available, see what's going on, see what's happening. Um, and again, I would highly recommend that you look at trusted resources. Um, which is challenging these days. It is challenging, you know, to get unbiased information, but just to try your best to really look at collectively everything that's, that's going on. Um, but again, in limited doses, don't get in the habit of learning this thing. You hit it on the head in 10 minutes, 15 minutes tops. You can, you can hear every single, um, news story that's of any relevance around the world. Yeah. Very easily. And if it's not something that really is important for you, just move on. Yeah, absolutely. Um, so, so in terms of that then, uh, you know, w w again in, in the grand scheme, we're talking about these five fundamentals of health to really help you boost your immune system.

Speaker 1: (19:27)
You know, we, so we've talked about this idea of health coming from the inside, simplicity and consistency, making that daily kind of battle plan to help you and, or your family. What are the things that you're going to do to proactively help bolster your immune system? Making sure that things are functioning both mechanically and chemically. Uh, you know, then talking about making sure mentally, emotionally, and spiritually, we're feeding ourselves, uh, with good information and making sure that we're not getting overwhelmed or overstressed. Making sure we're creating sufficient quiet time to either meditate or to journal or to, um, just give yourself time to kind of decompress. And then last but not least is making sure we are fueling ourselves properly. Right? Um, our bodies need to be fueled and so oftentimes we don't think of eating as fueling. We just think of it as this indulgence or this pleasurable experience or this torturous experience.

Speaker 1: (20:23)
It's one of the other, right? It's, it's uh, and uh, and so unfortunately, uh, when we don't view it in terms of this proper light of, of fueling ourselves properly, uh, we missed the Mark either way. Right? Either overindulgence or just punishment. I think you hit it on the head there because fuel, our fueling can be something that is the necessary support we need for the building blocks to stay healthy. It can also be a negative stressor. FCR, if we are overindulging, if we are spiking our blood sugar with the ups and the downs of, of just crappy food. Yeah. I don't remember who said the quote, but it said our food can either be the strongest and most wonderful medicine or the slowest form of poison in our lives. And it's true, right? What we eat can be either or. It can either be medicine or it can be poison.

Speaker 1: (21:14)
You know, Hippocrates said, let thy food be thy medicine and they met us and be thy food. Um, and it's so true. So this time of year, you know, what would you recommend in general guidelines in terms of fueling yourself properly? Um, make a plan. First of all, cause if you don't plan what you're going to be eating and what you're going to be doing, it makes it really easy to say, Oh, I'll grab this or, or, Ooh, Hey, please. Yeah, the path of least resistance. Exactly. Too easy. So if you don't make a plan, you're gonna, it's going to be really easy for you to slip and fall. Absolutely. Um, in terms of general guidelines for fueling yourself, you know, general guidelines you're gonna want, make sure I actually always tell people that's good. It's a good idea to try to have a, you know, just a safe, a safe ratio of a, a one to one ratio of protein and carbs obviously up your, it's always good to focus on vegetables.

Speaker 1: (22:08)
I'm a little bit of fruit. Yup. And then just be smart with the sweets and the candies. You know, it's not, I'm not saying like you should enjoy your food, but to healthy fats this time of year can be really helpful. Avocado is a great way to go. Um, various nuts can be a great source of healthy fat, lean protein, uh, fish. It's going to be a great way to go. All these things can play a role and can really, really help. Um, but yeah, and, and, and then again too, the other thing is this time of year it's going to be really easy for us to overeat. Um, and so just making sure that the proportion or the, the portion sizes are not out of control. I literally use smaller plates and smaller bowls. Yeah. You know, they have, we have the big massive dinner plates and there's that other plate that's kind of like about a nine inch plate.

Speaker 1: (22:56)
If you kind of stick with the nine inch plate, your, you know, studies show that if you, the smaller the bowl or the smaller the plate, you eat less. Yeah, yeah. Pretty simple. And the opposite is true as well. Yes. Yeah, exactly. If we're going to a platter, you're going to fill it. Yeah, absolutely. So those are what we call our five fundamentals of health and within that framework that that should be a sufficient way for you to really help Bulletproof and bolster your immune system. And I think you kind of started it off really well, dr Alan when you talked about this whole idea that if we look at this time of year from the lens of, okay, the minute that I start feeling symptoms is when I'm going to start popping the emergency or the airborne or the, you know, home remedy of your choice.

Speaker 1: (23:41)
And that's not to say that that's necessarily inherently a bad thing. Um, you know, most of us are conditioned to do this to some degree or another, but what's more effective than that is to proactively plan ahead, um, and really do things to make those daily deposits to help strengthen our immune system overall. Right? So we talked about making sure that we recognize that health comes from the inside, not from the outside. That our approach is one of simplicity and consistency that we need to make sure our bodies are functioning correctly and mechanically and chemically, making sure that we are mentally, emotionally and spiritually in tune, making sure we manage that stress. And then last but not least, fueling ourselves properly. Those are five ways, uh, collectively and individually that we can take steps necessary to help strengthen our bodies resilience to any assaults that come this time of year or any other time of year. But especially this time of year as people are hearing more and more about cold and flu season. Uh, these are just some simple yet pretty practical ways to go about strengthening your body's immune response. So any other thoughts you have to share? Nope. Okay. Hopefully this has been valuable for you guys. Uh, take this implemented into your life and, uh, strengthen your immune system. Let's get you a Bulletproof. Uh, so you can enjoy all the fun things that happen this time of year. So, uh, we'll talk to you guys on an upcoming episode.

Speaker 2: (25:04)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop. And in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Dr. Chad Woolner here and dr buddy Allen. And this is episode 29 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode we're going to be talking about the question should you get the flu vaccine? So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:13)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm dr Chad Woolner and I'm dr buddy Allen. And this show was about giving you the simple but powerful and cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:33)
So, Hey everybody, hope you guys are having an awesome day today. We have a really interesting, uh, and very, uh, heated or I guess controversial topic that, uh, is fully loaded with all sorts of different arguments, both for and against. We're talking about the flu vaccine and whether or not people should get the flu vaccine. So where do we even begin when it comes to the flu vaccine? I mean, I guess people in general, when we talk about vaccines, uh, immediately what you find are very visceral reactions, very visceral reactions in two polar different camps you've got on one side, uh, the very staunch pro vaccine camp, uh, where no matter what you say or no matter what you do, vaccines are the way to go. Vaccines can do no wrong, you have to get vaccinated. And then on the other end of the camp, you've got the complete opposite, what people would consider the anti-vaxxer camp where it's you can't get you, you don't get vaccines.

Speaker 1: (01:37)
Uh, there's nothing good that can ever come from vaccines. Vaccines are full of toxins and all sorts of other things. Um, and I, I certainly have an opinion on this, on this matter. I know you do as well. Um, but I think the overarching kind of theme that we want to present here, uh, if for no other reason than we want people to listen to this episode with an open mind. And I feel like if you, if you present anything one way or any of the other, you have so many people because like you said, that visceral reaction that they will be immediately dismissive. Oh, you bet. Of the things that you share without actually listening critically. And I think that's one of the great tragedies, um, or things that is tremendously lacking, uh, in today's day and age is an inability to engage in thoughtful discussion, discussion and, and in debate that engage us critical thinking.

Speaker 1: (02:38)
You know, um, there was a professor, not a professor who was, he was, uh, he was a priest that spoke at BYU. Oh yeah. Years ago. And, or not, not years ago, I think it was just like a year ago. And he said something really interesting. He said, um, in today's day and age, he said, it's not that we need to less, we need to disagree better is what he said. And I think that was so wise and so profound when it comes to the vaccine debate. That's what we'll call it. And obviously we'll, we'll hone in and talk specifically about the flu vaccine. But I think it's one of those things that we're talking about here that can be applied. It's not that we need to disagree less about these things. We need to disagree better. We need to look at the information. We need to not allow our own inherent biases to cloud a judgment because one way or another, um, we're talking about pretty significant implications when it comes to the choices that we make.

Speaker 1: (03:39)
You bet. And so, uh, for good or for bad, you know, and so, um, in terms of the flu vaccine, you know, the, the interesting thing that I would say, and perhaps this is, uh, where we can start, let me pull this up over here. Um, it seems to me, and you tell me your, your opinion, dr Ellen, but it seems that there is an ever-growing, um, push to vaccinate. And especially, especially with the flu vaccine, it's becoming more and more of a, um, standard, um, kind of approach to this time of year. You know, it's, and, and it's interesting because we, we refer to this time of year as what, as the flu season. Right? And the reality of it is, is when you just look at common sense would tell you there's, there's nothing different about our immune systems this time of year. Our immune systems work the same.

Speaker 1: (04:40)
Barring the fact that we have potential additional stress that's placed on our bodies this time of year for a variety of factors. Number one, come holiday seasons, we tend to not eat as well. That's a huge part. We can't, we can't dismiss that. Number two, what else changes this time of year? Short days, short days, so less sunlight. Uh, depending upon where you live, um, far more cloud coverage, which again decreases, uh, colder temperatures. So even if there is sunlight, most people are indoors or covered up or covered. Yeah, exactly. Or covered up. Yeah, exactly. So you're not getting the amount of sun exposure that you would get. Um, the fact that you're, you're more, uh, congregated indoors means you're more susceptible to other people's germs. Um, you know, so, so I mean really what you're talking about is almost like this perfect storm as to why, you know, uh, and some people might think that what we're talking about here is just semantics, but I think it, it matters in the sense that semantics, right, right, right.

Speaker 1: (05:48)
Exactly. And so, so at the end of the day we have to look at why does it seem like, or why is it that there is a greater prevalence of, of cold and flu viruses that are, that are being spread this time of year. And I think those are some very easy to see reasons as to perhaps why there is an increased prevalence of these, these sorts of things. The flu, the flu virus doesn't just wake up because it hits October, November, December, January. It's like it's dormant during the summer and it only comes alive in the winter. Right. It's always floating out there. Right, exactly. And, and so, so that, that's kind of an interesting thing. I think if we look at it in terms of in plain sight, environmental factors are the things that we do or don't do. Make a difference into it as to our body's capability of taking care of itself that, you know, in terms of our immune response.

Speaker 1: (06:44)
And so, uh, we'll, we'll talk about this kind of moving forward in just a minute here, but, um, there is significant research showing our levels of vitamin D play a huge role in our body's overall immune response, number one, but then number two, more specifically our body's immune response with regard to, uh, the flu, our body's ability to fight off or to prevent, um, contracting the flu virus. And so, um, vitamin D is very closely linked as we know, to sunlight exposure. Um, and obviously dietary factors as well, you know, and so, um, so in, in terms of the flu vaccine, um, you know, when it comes to that decision, um, we realize again that this can be a very emotionally charged, kind of very sensitive issue, whether or not to vaccinate or to vaccinate. Um, and, and primarily because typically the emotions come from the fact that we're dealing with not just our own personal health, but the health of loved ones, especially children.

Speaker 1: (07:54)
Right. In terms of our, in terms of the health of our children, I don't think any parent out there any reasonable good parent out there, uh, wants their children to, I think most reasonable people want their kids to be happy and healthy. Right? Uh, and so it's no wonder that we want to make these decisions, uh, and we want to be right about these decisions. We do not want to be wrong about these decisions. The problem that we see when it comes to the flu vaccine is that it seems like people, far too many people or most people are making decisions based off of incomplete information. Absolutely. Whether it's deliberate or not deliberate, people need to understand that there is a bigger picture here that they need to be seeing prior to the decisions that are made as to whether or not they choose to, to vaccinate when it comes to the flu vaccine.

Speaker 1: (08:49)
You know, when you talk about this, I've been kind of thinking because there are, there's such a polar polar extremes on both ends of pro or, or anti vaccination in general. It's almost like people have dug their heels in so deep because they don't want to lose. It's like a, it's like a competition. If I, if I say that, Oh, Oh, I guess it's okay. If you don't, then I'm conceding that are, I'm losing. You don't want to lose any grant. It's not, it's not a losing art. You know what I mean? It's like I either I have to win. And so if people dig their heels in and they don't wanna they don't want to believe that, well, maybe there is a different way or a different, uh, possibility, you know? Right. One way or the other. Right. Exactly. So when we look at [inaudible] and one of the great ironies that we see today is that never before have we ever had more information accessible at our fingertips.

Speaker 1: (09:44)
And yet it is, seems to be increasingly difficult to be able to sift through all of that information to find confusing, to find trustworthy sources, to be able to give us fair, balanced, accurate information. Uh, perhaps one of the best and most, most reputable sources when it comes to scientific information. And, or conclusive, you know, kind of answers as to, should I do this, should I not do this? Is this safe, is this effective? Is this ineffective? Uh, is this a, is this a group called the Cochrane review? And basically the, I didn't know, uh, their, their history or anything, but they're actually a, um, a nonprofit from, uh, it says Cochrane is a British charity formed to organize medical research findings so as to facilitate evidence-based choices about health interventions faced by health professionals, patients and policy makers. So their whole point is they look at as a group, they look at all of the evidence and then they, they, they analyze the evidence, they kind of systemize what it says, and then they synthesize all of this evidence to basically make conclusive statements as to whether or not the evidence shows something is effective or ineffective or, or, or whatnot.

Speaker 1: (11:04)
And, you know, suffice it to say, if you were to look at the Cochrane reviews regarding their stance on flu vaccinations, it's pretty loud and clear that, that they say the evidence is pretty weak. Um, they say that if there is any effectiveness from the flu vaccinations, it's very, very low. Um, and, and when you look at straight from even like the CDC and what they say about the flu vaccine, most of the experts agree that the effectiveness of the flu vaccination is typically 40 to 60% in terms of the likelihood of it helping you. And so when I hear that, when I hear 40 to 60%, I think flipping the coin yup. Is what I think. And part of the challenge is that assuming that you've got a, the the correct, uh, strain dialed in, we'll talk about that in a second. It's 40 to 60% effective assuming that there's a match.

Speaker 1: (12:03)
The problem is that there are a variety of different flu strains that come about each year and they constantly are changing and mutating and whatnot. And so, um, [inaudible] you look at their own, look at their own guidelines and what they'll tell you straight up is that this is our best guest this year based off of the, you know, epidemiological studies that we've done forecasting, et cetera, et cetera. I don't know the whole process as to how they do that, but their, their whole point is, is that educated guesses, educated. Yeah, absolutely. Um, there are basically, when you look at it, there's roughly, I think about 144 different potential strains based off of different combinations and, uh, different types. Um, there, there are three kind of general types, a, B and C, a a is the most common, but then even within that, there are roughly about 144 different combinations of different strains.

Speaker 1: (12:55)
And so they say typically that the flu vaccine, uh, covers four, I think four of those different strains. And so you're talking about 3%, roughly 3%, uh, of the possible, the possible strains that, that you're going to be vaccinating against or for, um, yeah, Mexico city, you know, to, to help protect you. And, and the interesting thing that I find is that in light of that, in light of the fact that it's so few, your odds are, you know, not great. They still highly it. And, and I hear comparisons, I see this amongst experts where they make these analogies or comparisons, like it's getting a vaccine and flu vaccination is like wearing your seatbelt, where it's like, that's such a poor comparison, you know, cause because studies have shown loud and clear in terms of seatbelt safety. So that's a really weak analogy, a very poor comparison there.

Speaker 1: (13:52)
Um, so, so in terms of, you know, you're, you're kind of shooting or throwing a dart at a dartboard and hoping that it hits number one, but then also in terms of the effectiveness there, they're roughly saying 40 to 60% effective. So that's kind of one side of it. We're talking about. Does it even work? You know, and again, the evidence says if it works, it's not great. It's not, it's not an, you know, and, and, and the problem number one that we see is that by the powers that be, uh, they paint this picture as though it's, it's a done deal. You know, this is the way to protect yourself against the flu. And, and you don't hear a whole lot in terms of them saying, you know, that, that it's not terribly effective. Um, well they even, so my wife is a nurse and as you know, being a nurse, she's required to get the flu shot each year and um, for, you know, just cause that's policy.

Speaker 3: (14:52)
However, it's one of those things that, um, uh, even when even in years past, in fact I want, it was a year or maybe two ago where they said, well, we kind of, we know we kind of missed the Mark on the, the, the strain this year, but we still recommend everybody get the vaccine. Yeah. So even when they know they've pretty much missed it, they still, you know, it's the, the powers that be just say, you know, yeah, you should still get it. So, but Y you know that, that's kinda the big w what for if we know w and I guess this kinda comes down to, we were talking, this whole topic came up, cause I read had read something on social media and it was there, there were, there were flaws in the argument for pro, you know, this was a health professional.

Speaker 3: (15:38)
And the whole article was, you know, what, flu shots do not cause the flu. And she kinda went on to say different things. And then she also stated, she says, and this was, I thought it was interesting. She says, you know, uh, you know, avocados are a healthy, healthy fruit, right? Right. And she says, however, in fact, if, I don't think anyone would argue with you that avocados are very healthy, but if I eat an avocado, she said, I get, I swell, I get, you know, I have a terrible reaction to it. So she says, but that doesn't mean avocados are unhealthy. And then that's, and then she moves onto something else. My, but, but wait, that undermines her entire, exactly. My whole, my whole thing that stood out to me was, it's true, they are incredibly healthy, but there are lots of really healthy things that people, people are deathly allergic to.

Speaker 3: (16:26)
Right. So peanuts, almonds, all kinds of different things there. Fish. Yeah. You know, and it's like they can be incredibly healthy and yet for some people they can be, they can have deathly allergic reactions. It can be terrible. And so part of what, you know, that's kind of what spurred our, our thoughts on even doing this podcast was, you know, what there is that we, we, uh, so many people just jump on the, Oh, well it's flu season, I guess I need my flu shots. What, you get the flu? And they're, they're doing that based upon an incomplete information. Yes. So be able to make an educated choice one way or the other. Yeah. And, and, and, and that's the, I guess that's the point that we're trying to get across here in all of this, is we're not trying to say don't get a flu vaccination. Uh, at the end of the day, that's your choice. If somebody wants to. And I just think the place where I'm coming from is if you make that choice based off of the best available evidence and you know, uh, the benefits versus the risks, uh, the potential benefits versus potential risks. And you do that in light of that more power to you. Great. But the problem is, is that most people I would argue are doing it, like you said, based off of incomplete, uh, and oftentimes inaccurate information. Um, this is straight from the Cochrane review. It said,

Speaker 1: (17:50)
uh, uh, N this is regarding, uh, vaccinating children and the elderly, um, which are the two greatest at risk and or the immunocompromised, you know, population. So when it comes to flu, a large scale, a systematic review of 51 studies published in the Cochrane database of syste systematic reviews in 2006 found no evidence that the flu vaccine is any more effective than a placebo in children under two. The studies involved 260,000 children age six to 23 months, uh, in, uh, 2008. Another Cochran review, again concluded little evidence is available that the flu vaccine is effective for children under the age of two. Even more. Disturbingly, the author stated it was surprising to find only one study of in vaccinated show, uh, vaccine in vacs, uh, or excuse me, inactivated vaccine in children under two years given current recommendations to vaccinate healthy children from six months old in the USA and Canada if immunization in children is to be recommended as a public health policy, large scale studies assessing important outcomes and directly comparing vaccine types are urgently required.

Speaker 1: (19:05)
And so that's concerning because what they're basically just saying they're in the Cochrane review is that we do not have the level of information and data available to make the conclusive statements that are so frequently made in the, from the, from the pro-vaccine camp. They make it sound as though, Oh, this is, this is just conclusive when it's not, it's anything but conclusive, you know, and, and I can appreciate, I really could appreciate if they came from a place of basically saying, look, based off of the best available evidence, we believe this is the best approach. But I don't think that's the statements that are being made. It is this, it is this uh, statement of like they treat, they treat it like gravity. Like it's just this given scientific law where it's not that at all. They treat it like there are no possible negative side effects that can come from it.

Speaker 1: (20:02)
Yeah. And we'll get to that in just a second. Yeah. So in terms of the uh, elderly, so we talked about children in 2010. Cochrane concluded that the available evidence is of poor quality and provides no guidance regarding the safety, efficacy or effectiveness of influence of vaccines for people aged 65 years or older. Uh, Cochran also reviewed whether or not vaccinating healthcare workers can help protect the elderly patients with whom they work. In conclusion, the authors stated that there is no evidence that vaccinating healthcare workers prevents influenza in elderly residents in longterm care facilities. So again, these are the, these are not fringe like blogs that were written by some random guy in his mom's basement to Cochrane review is the gold standard in terms of assessing and looking at scientific evidence here. And so please understand, like again, we're not, we're not trying to sound fringe or, or, or, um, you know, one side here, we're trying to present this in the most meaningful and sincere way we possibly can to help people understand, uh, again, what you choose, what you decide that is completely up to you.

Speaker 1: (21:15)
Um, we simply want to provide the, the evidence, we want to provide the information so that people can make informed decisions. And like you said, like in terms of the risks, these are not without risk as much as people want to present this, uh, this idea that, um, and, and, and, and I can also appreciate and understand to not vaccinate comes with inherent risks too. I get that. I understand that. To not vaccinate against the flu, I means you could, you could potentially get the flu. Absolutely. But, but again, in terms of weighing and determining risks versus benefits, um, Y you have that, you have that, uh, article there, one of the risks associated with the flu vaccine. And albeit I understand it's a low risk but risk nonetheless. Okay. Low risk does not mean no risk. Okay. Low risks just means that, that the likelihood is low. But nonetheless, they don't tell most people this, that they're one of several other potential complications or risks. Uh, one alone that is just frightening to me because I'm familiar with this cause I've known of people who have developed it, uh, is something referred to as Gian Baret syndrome. Um, you can look it up. It's spelled G, U. I. L. L. a, N. I. A. N. I. N. a. Dion Borei, B. A. R, R, E with like a apostrophe. Well, if you, if you type in that, it'll pop right up in the search and John Baret syndrome. Um, and, and as a complication associated with the flu vaccine

Speaker 3: (22:53)
is this, where's this from? And what does it say? So the, uh, this is the Mayo clinic right here that's talking about this, and it just says Gian barter. A syndrome is a rare disorder in which your body's immune system attacks your nerves, weakness and tingling in your extremities are usually the first symptoms. These symptoms can quickly spread eventually paralyzing your whole body. Yeah. All right. I mean it's, it can be very literally life threatening, like where you got to get to the hospital, it can happen quickly. And again, it's one of those things and they say it's rare, but they say, eh, you know, as many as 20,000 people a year. Yeah. You know, so it's, I mean, yeah, when you compare it to maybe hundreds of millions, that's not a hit, but that's still 20,000 people. Yeah. All right. It's there. It's a risk. And the risk is that this, this is the most common condition to follow the flu

Speaker 1: (23:46)
vaccination. Right. And that's straight from the journal of the American medical association. You look it up and straight from their own journals. They say that's the most common serious complication associated with flu vaccination. Yep. And so, and there are others as well. We don't need to dive into all of them, but just understand that there is risk that is there. And so to make this decision. Um, again, I think that's my, my thinking in all of this is I always cringe a little bit when I think that people are so, um, quick to do the flu vaccination with, with so little fought, you know, to that. And, and it's again, if you chose to do that in light of the potential benefits versus the potential risks and you knew that, Hey, that that's, that's your choice and you completely have the ability to do that.

Speaker 1: (24:38)
But again, I just think that most people aren't operating from that. And you bring up a really good point because right now there's massive debates when it comes to vaccinations in general. Um, you know, we're talking about, you know, the immunizations kids get for school in this, that the other California just passed laws that require, there is no, you, you cannot opt out of vaccinations. What for beliefs or anything else if you want to go to public school. And I would say for me the biggest concern, and to me it's, it's kind of terrifying as the loss of those liberties to be able to make choices for ourselves. Because again, these vaccines are presented, uh, both the, the flu vaccine and others, they present them as though they are infallible. Yes. That they, that there is nothing that could go wrong when the true reality is like, listen, most people do tolerate them just fine.

Speaker 1: (25:28)
Right. Most people do. Yeah. However, there are plenty of people and, and I would say a lot more than you, you realize that have major issues with like major, some and in some cases, death. Yeah. Right. People do. People do die from vaccinations. I don't care. You know, I mean, they're out there, plenty of them. And, and, and, and I guess that's my, my concern that I see that w w my eyes were first really open to this, not from the kind of what people would consider as the anti-vaccination community or camp. Um, that's not who, who had as much of an influence on kind of my perception and my take on this as much as what I saw from the pro camp. And what I meant by that is that, um, I started to grow increasingly concerned when I saw that, um, the minute you even question, you know, just looking for information, it was, it was, it's such a to act absolutely.

Speaker 1: (26:28)
It has such a dogmatic viewpoint almost to the point of like religious fervor to the way they look at vaccination. Like you do not dare question this. This is like sacred ground. It's blasphemy. And, and to me, that's concerning when I see that level of, of irrationality, um, regarding this, the, so that's what to a large extent has kind of shaped my opinions regarding this. Um, and so, so that's the concern. But I think you hit the nail on the head when you said, you know, at the end of the day, what we have to do is we have to stop and look at it for what it really is. We're not talking about the vaccine argument, be it Fluor other, it's not about vaccines, it's about personal Liberty. And that's the thing that's concerning to me is that the more we as, as a society, as people collectively abdicate our personal rights and outsource those basically to a government entity to make those choices for us.

Speaker 1: (27:26)
Uh, that's concerning. You know, we as individuals need to make the best informed decisions we can for our health and for the health of our families, for our children and for our loved ones. And, um, so, you know, when we talk about, so that's talking about, you know, like, okay, should I or should I not vaccinate against, uh, the flu? We're talking about that in terms of alternatives, there's a very clear alternative and in fact, when you look at the research, it's very solid, uh, in favor of a different approach. And we'll, we'll expand it even further beyond this. But when you look at, uh, vitamin D, you know, we kind of already talked a little bit about that. During this time of year, we get far less sunlight. We're a, our skin is far more covered up. And so vitamin D exposure is definitely limited when you look at [inaudible] and we'll give you a resource here going to vitamin D, council.org.

Speaker 1: (28:22)
If you just type it in, just know spaces, vitamin D, council.org. Uh, and if you look up, um, influenza, they have tons of research here, very good high level research showing loud and clear, increasing your doses of vitamin D is an extremely effective way to help you fight off not only influenza, but also just generally help bolster your immune system during this time of year when you could potentially be slightly compromised as a result of, again, not getting the sunlight that you need. Perhaps dietarily you're not eating as well. Uh, you know, were Halloween is just around the corner, followed by Thanksgiving, followed by Christmas and new year, you know, and so you're definitely not eating a few football games in between. Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely. Football weekends. Um, so let's talk about the research here. Uh, when you look at vitamin D counsel, what they have to say, if you just go to a vitamin D council.org, um, you can look up, uh, influenza and, uh, there's a great article that they put together with a, a bunch of different studies, uh, showing several different things.

Speaker 1: (29:36)
Uh, number one, showing a handful of studies that, uh, vitamin D is helpful in preventing the flu. Vitamin D is helpful for, uh, improving one's response to the flu if they get the flu. Showing that those that had higher levels of vitamin D a were able to fight off the flu easier or have, uh, less, um, intense, uh, symptoms, symptoms associated with it. Um, there was, let's see here, um, helping, let's see here. Preventing the overall flu, um, treating and recovering from the flu. Let me just show, there was, this one was interesting. Uh, an experiment conducted in the United States gave elderly African American women 800 IUs of vitamin D per day for two years, then 2000 IUs per day for the third year. The group, uh, the control group was given a dummy pill. The researchers looked at how many times those women got influenced. So over the three year period and found that the vitamin D group had fewer influenza symptoms compared to the dummy pill group.

Speaker 1: (30:45)
Only one person in the vitamin D group contracted the influence. So while taking 2000 IUs per day compared to 30 cases of influenza or colds, for those taking the dummy pill, that dummy pill group had influenced the symptoms during the winter. While those who got the flu in the vitamin D group had symptoms that were independent of the season. And then they said an experiment evaluated the effects of vitamin D supplementation on influence risk in Japanese school children. The researchers gave the children either 1200 IUs of vitamin D per day for three months during the winter or a dummy pill. They found that more children in the dummy pill group got influenced a than other children in the vitamin D group. Uh, there was a preventative effect of 1200 IUs per day on the children that were getting influenza, uh, a so they concluded, uh, that it can help protect children against the seasonal influence.

Speaker 1: (31:38)
At a, um, there was a study conducted in 2011 looked at vitamin D levels and upper respite and respiratory infections like influenza in a large group of British adults. The researchers found that, um, four nanograms per milliliter, which I'm not sure the, their, their, um, vitamin D levels in the body, there was a 7% lower chance of developing influenza. Uh, there was a seasonal pattern of influenza, which was the same as the seasonal pattern of vitamin D levels. Again, you know, this is, it just goes to show that it seems very common sense that what we're dealing with is not necessarily, like we said from the beginning of flu season, but rather a pattern. Uh, and, and I don't even necessarily think it's linked to vitamin D itself per say, but rather other factors associated with seasonal changes that our bodies, um, immune systems are not as, um, uh, afforded to fight against battling.

Speaker 1: (32:38)
Yeah, absolutely. You know? Um, and so I think in, in all of this, um, we're not just talking about some magic bullet here being vitamin D, but rather I think the overall message is that we need to be more conscientious during this time of year to be doing those things that we know for certain will help our immune system. You said something that, you know, bringing up magic bullets. Yeah. People I believe, look at immunizations, you know, against these things that some magic bullet. I tend to make everything better and yeah, the reality is that we have to, we have to take it upon ourselves to make sure we have a fighting chance about fighting off any kind of sickness, not just influenza. I mean, influenza is one of a million different things that you could contract. Right. Um, and so the reality is we just have to, um, you know, like you said, a good, healthy diet, good sleep, good exercise, do the things that washing your hands hydrating properly, you know.

Speaker 1: (33:39)
Uh, the interesting thing too, we, we being chiropractors, uh, when you look at the research, there's some pretty solid evidence suggesting that chiropractic can help with immune response, can help improve the, the immune response overall. So taking care of, and, and, and I'll even expand that further for people who might roll their eyes at that. Um, I would say taking care of your frame, you know, that, that there is a definite connection to how you take care of your physical frame and the impact that that can have on, uh, immune function. You know, we can take that even further by saying, making sure you're getting adequate exercise in addition to your adequate rest and hydration. So some of these simple things, um, that individually may not have a massive influence, but it's almost like a, it's almost like a scorecard. You know what I mean?

Speaker 1: (34:28)
Like, if you can view this time of year as like a scorecard where you say, okay, here's my daily checkbox of things that I'm going to be doing. I'm gonna make sure that a, during this 24 hour period, I got adequate rest. I got adequate hydration. I got adequate levels of vitamin D, whether that's supplemental or trying to get some sun exposure. Uh, I got adequate nutrition, making sure I, uh, you know, dietarily was doing the things that I needed to fortify my body and my health, um, made sure that I, I got adequate rest in meditation and got adequate. Um, you know, the, the, the things collectively that we know we need to do. I'm washing my hands regularly, you know, all these things. Um, but just making sure that were a little bit more vigilant about it during this time of year. And I think that that will go, um, I think the evidence is clear that that will go a lot further than any vaccination will ever go.

Speaker 1: (35:26)
You know, and again, this isn't to say that for those who make that decision to vaccinate, um, that is completely your decision, you know, and you can totally do that. Uh, I am of the opinion, I just don't see the benefits outweighing the risks and I think we're kind of in the same absolutely. Same camp. Yup. So, uh, and, and I think for those who are, and I think maybe there's a small population of people like your wife who are in the camp where they have to be vaccinated. There is no way around it and yet they don't want to be vaccinated. And I would say using the same wisdom I think will help offset the risks associated with the vaccination by making sure in conjunction with that you're getting adequate rest, adequate hydration, adequate vitamin D, all those same things will play a role in helping your body respond appropriately to a vaccination salient to everything that hits us.

Speaker 1: (36:21)
Because you know, I mean again, there's, there's 10,000 different things that we could become sick. It's a, it's going to be impossible to vaccinate for all sickness. I know there's certainly trying all the time it seems like, but you know, it's like it is impossible to vaccinate for every type of sickness out there. Yeah. And without even getting into the whole debate of efficacy or right risks or anything like that. But you know, the, the best thing you can do is to, you know, help, help your body be as resilient as possible, um, to whatever you get confronted with. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. So bottom line here, uh, should you vaccinate, uh, against the flu? Should you get the flu vaccine? Uh, again, I think the bottom line is knowing the benefits versus the risk, knowing more of the complete story. Um, not just buying into a lot of the propaganda that you hear, uh, that, that, uh, that flu vaccines are a magic bullet.

Speaker 1: (37:16)
Yes. Or that they are without risk. Um, those two things people need to understand. Number one, they're not a magic bullet. Number two, they don't come without risk. Um, but number three, uh, it is a personal decision. You know, when you look at all of the evidence available, um, I would argue that the vast majority of people out there want to make the right decision, especially when it comes to their health and the health of the ones that they love. And so I think sometimes it can be really challenging when you add on top of all of those other inherent challenges, feelings of judgment from others as to the decisions that you make, you know, the criticisms and the judgments. And that's the last thing in the world I think either of us want to do is put on people that extra burden of feeling like there's one more finger pointing on one way or the other.

Speaker 1: (38:02)
Just understand, uh, that the purpose of this episode, specifically of the podcast as well as the overall podcast is to give more tools to people to be able to make better decisions regarding their health. Uh, maybe sifting through a lot of the information that's out there and making things a little bit more clear. Um, so that you can make better decisions for yourself personally and for your own family. So hopefully this has been helpful. Anything else you want to add to this episode? Uh, no. You know, it's just, it really is so very important with all the information we do have available to us to make sure whenever,

Speaker 3: (38:36)
you know, when we'd read into anything, we should always read in with, uh, uh, you know, like what is this, you know what I mean? An open mind. Right, right. Cause if we go into any kind of, um, research looking for one outcome or the other guests, what you'll find, you'll find research to support whichever would last that you want. Classic confirmation bias. That's it. So you need to look at information with an open mind and say, you know, what are the pros? What are the cons, what are the risks, what are the benefits, what you know, like, and, and do they make sense to me? And for one, they may and for another they may not. Yeah. You know, so, but the, the, the scariest thing I think is in our culture, um, there seems to be a lot of the, again, the shaming you like if you don't do it like ever, someone's going to think you're a big jerk or some insensitive a hole for not, you know, cause someone else who can't do it or whatever that is, you know, and it's like, that's not true.

Speaker 3: (39:34)
You know, none of that stuff is true. Those are all tactics. So don't ever feel pressured one way or the other. Yeah, absolutely. Making choices on good information. Yeah, absolutely. Best available information that's out there and there is, there's good information that's out there. Uh, if you're willing to take a few minutes to kind of sift through some of it and think critically like you said. So anyways, hopefully this has been helpful and valuable for you guys, uh, either watching or listening to this and, uh, we're looking forward to sharing a lot more, uh, information with you on the next episode. Talk to you later guys.

Speaker 2: (40:06)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.

Show Notes:

Speaker 1: (00:00)
Hey everybody, what's going on? Doctor Chad Woolner here and Dr. Buddy Allen, and this is episode 28 of the health fundamentals podcast. And on today's episode, we're going to be talking about when healthy eating becomes unhealthy. So let's get started.

Speaker 2: (00:12)
You're listening to the health fundamentals podcast. I'm Dr. Chad Woolner and I'm Dr. Buddy Allen. And this show is about giving you the simple but powerful cutting edge tools you need to change your health and your life. So sit back and enjoy the show as we show you the path to your best life down to a science.

Speaker 1: (00:32)
So, hey everybody, hope you guys are having a great day today. We have a really interesting topic that we want to discuss today. Uh, and that is this idea of when healthy eating becomes unhealthy. That sounds blasphemous. It does, doesn't it? It's kind of crazy to think about. Um, but there, there was an article that was published, uh, at York University and this is what they said. They said, researchers say those who have a history of an eating disorder, obsessive-compulsive traits, dieting, poor body image, and a drive for thinness are more likely to develop a pathological obsession with healthy eating or consuming only healthy food known as Orthorexia Nervosa. Although eating healthy is an important part of a healthy lifestyle. For some people, this preoccupation with healthy eating can become physically and socially impairing. So although important as far as this research is what they have, what they say here, I think for most people who hear that I don't think that's necessarily going to come across as all too shocking or surprising.

Speaker 1: (01:37)
It should make perfect sense. Right? So, so where do we begin with this? Uh, Golly, this is, uh, we see people all the time when it comes to, um, have an issue with, you know, most people, I would say it comes down to weight loss. I, I'd say the biggest thing that most people freak out about or it's their image, you know, it's like, yeah, we put on weight and we're not happy with it. And, and we don't like what we see in the Mirror Mirror. We don't like how we feel, there's just all these different things or we compare ourselves to others. So that's probably where most people have the issue. The problem being is most people don't understand food correctly. Right. All right. They, they underwrite food is like, Ooh, you know, like, what am I gonna eat today that's going to be delicious? Or what am I, I mean, I've done it myself.

Speaker 1: (02:21)
I don't, I don't say this without guilt because I've done it plenty of times where I'm like, Ooh, what sounds amazing. And, um, and you know, and we eat more for pleasure. But, um, I would say the big rub here comes when people start. Um, they started thinking like, well, I'm eating healthy. So I, you know, if one avocado or a half an avocado is good, if I eat three Avocados or a whole bowl of Guacamole, um, that's going to be amazing for me. Right, right. Well, you know, forget all the chips and all this stuff that's coming with it. Well, not, and not even that, but exactly what you just said though. You know, that's one of the things that I've noticed in my personal journey. Uh, you over the past year I would say in terms of improving my health. Um, and, and hopefully you realize that whenever we teach anything we teach on this podcast, we try and practice what we preach.

Speaker 1: (03:10)
We try, we try our best to walk the walk. And part of that walking of the walk is transparency of helping people understand we're in this journey too, like anybody else. Um, but what I was going to say is one of the biggest things, in fact, I had this conversation with my wife this morning is that I think one of the biggest fallacies that we've talked about is that a lot of the various fads and trends in terms of health, in terms of diet is, is throwing calories out the window like they do not matter. And it's very comforting for people to kind of pretend like that doesn't matter. You know? And, and the truth is, is that it's, it should be obvious that, uh, 150 calories from a soda is going to be different than 150 calories from Broccoli. I get it, I get that part of it.

Speaker 1: (03:53)
But nonetheless, like you said, eating for Avocados instead of just one is going to dramatically increase your calwork intake. Can I saw this awesome little picture, uh, like a, um, just a cool little picture that had two comparisons. It says, um, you know, both of these said healthy, healthy snacks and one of them was like, it had some celery and carrots and, um, I don't know, some sort of a, uh, like a chick pea dip of some sort, right. Just something that was the, that looked yummy and, and people eat it all the time. And then someone had, and then the other picture was a bunch of nuts and, and other avocado and nuts and other whatever it was, you know, and it said, you know, one of them was like 150 calories, the first one with the celery and uh, and, and that, and the other one, which again was healthy was like 600 calories.

Speaker 1: (04:43)
Right? And it was just a, as far as quantity, it was, it was a comparable quantity, right? But the caloric intake was very significant. Quantity matters, absolutely as part of this. Right? And so I think that's the, the idea that you're trying to talk about here that we kind of keep coming back to is not deviating to one extreme or the other. You know, the extreme, like you said, of just eating solely for pleasure. But there is a flip side to that. And the flip side of that is the, this unhealthy obsession with quote unquote clean eating, right? Where we demonize food and we give it some sort of like, you know, like the, the, uh, we emotionally charge it unduly, right? Food is food, right? Uh, it's a, it's a tool. Um, and just like any tool, it totally depends on the context and, and, and the, the purpose for which you are using that tool.

Speaker 1: (05:38)
Right. And so we need to kind of have a, a massive paradigm shift in the way that we look at food in that, uh, the thing that we've discussed prior to this episode is that food needs to be, you are viewed as fuel. Absolutely. And, and at the end of the day, it all depends. The context of the conversation is what is the outcome that we're looking for when we use that fuel? And it's, and, and, and immediately, I think most people when they hear it in that context, they're thinking, well, the outcome needs to be improving our health every time. And that may may be in some instances the case, but in some instances the outcome may be pleasure. And that's okay. Every now and again. Sure. That's okay to recognize and acknowledge that, that when we do that, when we say, okay, you know, this evening, uh, we're going to be going out to, um, we're going to be going out to dinner and we're going to be enjoying a night out.

Speaker 1: (06:33)
And so we are going to enjoy the meal and it is going to be delicious and we're going to have dessert and we're going to do that thing. Now doing that every day, breakfast, lunch, and dinner, probably not inappropriate, you know, um, use of that tool of the, of the fuel, um, that we're doing. Right. And again, it's because what is the outcome that we want? If you want pleasure, pleasure, pleasure, all the time, uh, you know, the, the, you can't have too much of a good thing, right? But on the flip side as well, again, on that other side of the coin is that if you're, uh, if you're developing this unhealthy obsession with food can only be healthy and you can only eat clean all the time and it's just so rigid and so restrictive. Um, that's not necessarily a healthy approach either.

Speaker 1: (07:18)
Oh, not at all. In fact, you know, when we, when we look at ourselves, I mean really we need to be looking at ourselves. First of all, we shouldn't care what other people are doing. Obviously we can, we can offer, uh, encouragement or advice or direction. But really we need to, when you said using food as fuel, what are our goals? What are we trying to accomplish? Because going back to the title, when can healthy eating be unhealthy? It's like it's unhealthy. If your goal is you're trying to cut weight and you're eating healthy stuff, but it's not allowing you to lose weight, you know, because fruits are wonderful for us. But if you're trying to cut weight and you are eating a ton of carbs because of the pee, it's peach season or cherries or whatever, you know, all of those are wonderfully healthy and yet they will, they will not allow you to accomplish a goal which messes with your head, which again, it just creates a whole, uh, conflict.

Speaker 1: (08:11)
And you're in your mind and your physiology will. And the thing that I would say to that point too is that if you're wanting to lose weight, but you're not giving yourself any laxity or wiggle room in terms of, uh, the ability to deviate on occasion, uh, I think there's something to be said for being wound too tight in that sense. You know, you had said, I think it was in episode number one of our podcast, the example of the, of the Gal that you were coaching who has had a single bowl of clam chowder after she had lost a hundred pounds, and that single bowl was enough to, to create in her mind this colossal sense of failure. And that's not okay. Nope. You know, because that's taken out of context. That's completely blown out of proportion in terms of what actually happened. That's not reality.

Speaker 1: (09:01)
You know, uh, having a, you know, sometimes they'll, they'll talk about having a cheat meal on occasion. I think there's good sense to that. I think there's good logic behind that, of understanding that once in awhile. But again, I think the idea too that we have to be considerate of and take it really, really step back and look at the reality of it is that, um, one of the things that I, uh, love about that book, uh, the willpower instinct is she talks about this whole idea of moral licensing where if you're really quote unquote good for awhile, I've been eating clean for while. So now I deserve this thing. She said, the problem with that is that at its core it's an identity crisis. And basically what you're telling yourself is that the real you deep down inside is not the healthy you, it's the you that wants to uh, go off of the reservation and off the plan and just indulge and go crazy.

Speaker 1: (09:54)
And so the reality I would say simply again, is starting with a clear sense of identity. And what I mean by identity is the identity you want. Right? And again, we've talked about this before, but, but starting with who do you want to become? And I think that would really allow you to, to frame out the right appropriate steps that you would then take after that. Right. Who Do you want to be and then that would allow you to dictate and it would allow you I think, sufficient wiggle room to deviate every now and again because you would have a clear sense of purpose of knowing that. Okay, I know I, you know, went off the reservation here, but I did that intentionally because we wanted to celebrate or I enjoyed this treat every now and again. And so moving forward though, I still have a clear sense of purpose in terms of who I want to be.

Speaker 1: (10:43)
So therefore, you know, I'm getting back on track and I'm going to continue and I'm not going to let these deviations last weeks and weeks and months and months before I kind of pull back, you know, so, well, yeah. You know, in general it's, we, we really do just have to look at what our goals are, you know, fuel yourself for what your outcome is going to be. Um, people, it's, you know, you look at, we talked about earlier, you and I, a Michael Phelps when he was competing in the Olympics, was eating like 12,000 calories a day. Yeah. All right. And I'm sure not all of that was a health food. You know, I'm sure it was good food, but not all health food. Um, same with, um, uh, there was that program that was called born strong where it followed for strong men, you know, for guys that were competing in the strong men competition and they eat obscene amounts of food, right?

Speaker 1: (11:28)
Because they need that caloric intake to, for their, for their body to recover and for their out, for their, their results. Right. So, you know, it's like if, if we make those mind shifts of like, look my, what are my goals, what am I, you know, cause a lot of people lose, want to lose weight because they think that us or get to a certain number. Cause I think that certain number is gonna make them, um, feel amazing. In fact, there's, there's an amazing little, um, uh, image that you can find online that shows like it showed like four or five, six different women, all that weighed the same weight. All right? And they all had completely different builds on tight, exactly. Different body types. So we'll, you know, they go from Chisel to like not looking super healthy. And so it's like, what is your, you know, we need to know and have a, a true and, and a correct picture of what we're shooting after cause otherwise that's where these, these mental, um, uh, stressors really these disorders that we talked about, this Orthorexia Nervosa, um, you know, these things can be every bit as um, paralyzing as being obese, bright.

Speaker 1: (12:32)
So the, the idea is like, look, we want to live for a reason, you know, live healthy for a reason. Cause you know, this life is better when we can experience it and get out and do the, the wonderful things that are out there for us to experience. Right. So, and that like you had mentioned also part of that awesome experience is experiencing yummy food and different neat, you know, neat concoctions of, of uh, you know, whether there'll be desserts or other meals, you know, so I'm just, you know, having a healthy, a healthy, um, relationship with you know, who you are, who you want to be, what you want to accomplish, and then learning to use fuel or the food as fuel for your outcomes. Yeah, absolutely. And I would say underlying all of that is having a healthy sense of purpose with your life.

Speaker 1: (13:20)
You know, identity and purpose I think go hand in hand. And I think that's where people will find the greatest sense of fulfillment and happiness and meaning in their life is, is through the purpose. Right. And so I think that's the thing is that if you don't attach purpose to the goal, meaning if, if, if your weight loss journey is, is as shallow or as superficial as a number, that's all that's going to be, you know, you, you may achieve that goal. Right. I think it was Tony Robbins who said, you know, there's a science of achievement, but there's an art to fulfillment, right? That achievement without fulfillment is, is virtually a waste, is what happens. And so what will happen a lot of times is people will achieve these goals, whether it be a weight loss goal or a health goal, maybe it's a financial goal, um, you know, uh, or some other accomplishment.

Speaker 1: (14:12)
And, and what happens is a lot of times you'll find people, this is especially true, uh, with Olympic athletes, a lot of times where they're, their entire life purpose is tied to something as superficial. And people might not think it's, hey, think of it as superficial, but it is, if that's the only thing, meaning like that, that one achievement, right? Getting the gold medal in blank, you know? And then what happens a lot of times just people experience a significant and oftentimes debilitating bouts of depression after that because everything that they had up until that point in time of their life was pointed to that one pivotal moment rather than a more expansive life purpose and mission and vision. And right. And so, uh, I think the point of what we're trying to say here is don't get so tied up into something as superficial as the specific number or, or a moment or a blip on the radar, but rather tie your purpose to something more expansive, uh, in terms of who you want to become, what you want to do as a result of becoming that thing.

Speaker 1: (15:16)
Right. Um, and I think ultimately what we find is that our greatest senses of purpose are typically achieved and realized outside of ourselves. Um, and without trying to sound too preachy here, uh, really understanding, I think most people can agree that our relationships are a great source of purpose and fulfillment in our life. Uh, and those relationships can be with our family members, can be with people in our community, people at our work, uh, people who we serve, people at Church, um, any number of different things, but really ultimately finding greater sense of purpose than just a number. Um, because that ultimately doesn't have, I think, sufficient staying power emotionally for us to really propel us forward. Absolutely. So anyways, hopefully this has been a useful and valuable to you guys. Um, and uh, if you know others who could benefit from, uh, maybe this paradigm shift that we've hopefully shared here in terms of the way we view food and our relationship to it.

Speaker 1: (16:14)
Um, this is such an important concept, especially for people who have struggled to lose weight, um, or struggled to keep weight off. Uh, I think this is just yet again, one more piece of the puzzle that if people can kind of, you know, get this piece in trace I think could, could only help further, um, change your life. Honestly, this is one of those mind shifts that can truly just change your, that, that sense of fulfillment and happiness in your life. You know, just cause it's a simple like again, changing your paradigm. Yeah, absolutely. So, all right guys. Well thanks for listening. Be sure to subscribe if you haven't already subscribed and we'll talk to you guys on the next episode.

Speaker 2: (16:52)
Thanks for listening to the health fundamentals podcast. Be sure to subscribe so that you stay in the loop and in the note with all of the cutting edge health information that we share, if you know other people that could benefit from this information, please share it with them as well. Also, be sure to give us a review. These really help us to ultimately help more people. Last but not least, if you have questions that you want answered live on the show, or if you have ideas for topics that you would like us to cover, please shoot us an email and let us know at info@thehealthfundamentals.com.