Trust Me: Cults, Extreme Belief, and Manipulation

Journalist Jennings Brown returns, this time with a guest who goes by Justice, to talk about a new internet cult leader named Liana Shanti and her social media presence, which targets women with wellness cleanses, women's empowerment, wild conspiracy theories, and grandiose claims about her supernatural powers. They discuss Shanti's followers' pattern of changing their names, accusing family members of abuse without evidence, and suddenly taking their children out of state. Plus, a house in Florida called Destiny Manor where a group of her followers have moved, how Justice's own loved one fell down the rabbit hole, and how survivors are banding together to stop Shanti.

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Accomplished Olympic runner and The Longest Race author Kara Goucher shares how she and her partner were invited to join the prestigious Nike Oregon Project and coach Alberto Salazar, how Alberto's methods seemed effective at first but became more controlling and inappropriate over time, what led her to become a whistleblower, and the stark contrast she eventually saw with a healthy coaching relationship.

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No one is perfect. Not even Lola and Meagan. Today the ladies delve into the extreme belief of perfectionism, its connection to purity culture, Lola and Meagan's firsthand experience with OCD and religious trauma, how to address your inner cult leader, the intersectionality with cancel culture, and the importance of staying connected to those with extreme beliefs.

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Time to level up. MLM expert and author of Ponzinomics, the Untold Story of Multi-Level Marketing, Robert Fitzpatrick, discusses the history of MLMs including why they took off in the 80s, their connection to the American Dream and economic inequality, the biggest scams he's seen over the years, how MLMs disconnect people from their identities, and what we can do about it if its happening to someone we love.

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Learn more about Robert's work at https://www.pyramidschemealert.org/ 

Support victim survivors and prevent further abuse at https://voicesforthetruth.org/

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In the second half of their conversation with Kingston Clan survivor Priscilla Tucker, Lola and Meagan learn more about the leader of the group, why being sent to a bad kid camp turned out to be a positive experience for Priscilla, and how she worked for billion-dollar fraudster Jacob Kingston, ultimately helping the FBI take him down. Plus, how Priscilla ended up finally getting out of the group, thanks to the show Escaping Polygamy (and Lola's mom!).

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Priscilla Tucker, friend of the show and survivor of Mormon-offshoot polygamist group the Kingstons, talks about the origins of the group and how it differs from other polygamist sects, why so many members become doctors and lawyers, and her upbringing, including how she began working for pennies from the age of 8. They also discuss the leader of the group, its history of incest and underage marriages, and her brief underage engagement to her first cousin.

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Have you been scammed? Lola and Meagan have... and one of them was even part of one. What the Hack podcast host Adam Levin joins Trust Me to chat about phishing, romance scams that target the elderly, social engineering, who the scammers ARE, and tips on how to protect your identity online.

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In part two of Lola & Meagan's interview with Bride of Christ Church survivor Zacch Comfort, they discuss how leader Thomas Clyde Smith Jr's control tactics got more extreme once the group moved to the Oregon commune, including separating children from their families, requiring people to hit each other in church, and cycling children into his home for sexual abuse - as well as how the group ultimately fell apart, and what Zacch's life is like now working in a psychiatric hospital.

Plus, for Lola's cultiest thing of the week, she and her friend Liz Y2K discuss discovering a man they both dated has been arrested for serial rape, and how the police are seeking additional victims to come forward.

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If you have information on Ben Belser, contact:

LAPD's Operations West Bureau, Special Assault Section

213-473-0447

or 877-LAPD-247

Or for anonymous tips:

LA Crime Stoppers

1-800-222-TIPS

LAcrimestoppers.org

If you have experienced sexual assault and you need support, visit https://www.rainn.org/ or call 800-656-HOPE

Survivor of The Bride of Christ Church and creator of the Boiled Frogs podcast, Zacch Comfort, shares how convicted child molester Thomas Clyde Smith, Jr went from seeing visions in a psych ward to starting his own church, asserting control and arranging marriages while the group was in Las Vegas, the eventual move of the cult to a commune in Oregon, how Zacch's parents came to join the cult, and how infamous criminal Lawrence Singleton nearly came to live in the cult.

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If the shoe CrossFits... Former employee and enthusiast of CrossFit, Sam Ciavarella, shares about a time when she constructed her whole identity around CrossFit, the feeling of constant pressure to push herself to the limit, the shady story of the original owner, comparing CrossFit to generally competitive athletic endeavors, and why pushing yourself that hard can be physically dangerous. 

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It's the episode you've been dying to hear. Keith Page, funeral celebrant, hospice chaplain, and death doula/midwife, shares what it was like being a pastor of large church and why parts of that experience made him uncomfortable, his fall from grace that led him to turn away from religion, and how he found his calling by helping people deal with death from a secular perspective. Plus, how you can find meaning and define your own values without religion, what Keith's end of life work actually entails (yes, sometimes there's dry ice involved), and the importance of normalizing death in our society. 

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Actor, director, and activist Rosanna Arquette discusses her childhood growing up on a commune that was part of the Subud spiritual movement, her mom's journey from her own abuse to helping other women, the racism she saw in the community outside of the commune, her own personal experience with Harvey Weinstein's harassment, the subsequent changes she felt in her career, speaking out against Weinstein, and being a part of a movement that changed the world.

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Survivor's of Larry Ray's sex cult Felicia and Daniel discuss how they came to meet Larry, how he leveraged his memory and connections to craft an image of authority, how Larry gained control of their lives under the guise of helping them, when the manipulation elevated into sexual abuse and violence, and how they're doing now that Larry is going to jail for the harm he has caused.

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Get your pocket constitution ready. Antonio Perez, a former conspiracy theorist who followed Alex Jones, shares why Jones' over-the-top theories about the New World Order appealed to him, how Antonio's addiction factored into his dopamine-seeking thinking, and why building an internal locus of control can help avert conspiratorial thinking. Plus, how he finally stepped away from the deep state obsession, and the book he's writing on how to help people think for themselves again.

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Cognitive anthropologist Chris Kavanagh and psychologist Matthew Browne, hosts of the podcast Decoding the Gurus, share some of their criteria for what makes a guru, discussing a few of the many personalities they've covered on their podcast: Elon Musk and Jordan Peterson and Joe Rogan, oh my. They discuss the horrors of social media, the importance of trusting experts (but how academic credentialism can lead people astray too), how the biggest internet gurus tend to skew male, and why basically we need more scientists with mass appeal. 

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In part two of their discussion with former Westboro Baptist Church member Lauren Drain, she'll share how she was kicked out of the group and struggled to build a new social circle, the fear mongering that the Church used, and her healing journey including the use of fitness, EMDR, and ayahuasca. PLUS an incredible update on her family's current status!

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Banished author, fitness model, and registered nurse Lauren Drain joins Lola and Meagan to talk about her upbringing in the Westboro Baptist Church. They'll discuss the group's hateful and cruel picketing of public events, how Lauren's family joined after her dad intended to make a mockumentary about the church, how tightly controlled everyday life was, the very normal thing that got her kicked out, and the tragic end days of the founder Fred Phelps.

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Groups!... I did it again. Jay Van Bavel, NYU Associate Professor of Psychology and Neural Science, Director of the Social Identity and Morality Lab, and co-author of The Power Of Us, discusses how our social identities change depending on our environment and context, how the groups we identify with affect our decisions and perception, and the importance of instilling healthy hierarchy in a group to prevent unhealthy leadership. They also discuss how emotionally charged situations can forge shared identities, how cults replace individual identities with group identities, what to do when someone has fallen prey to groupthink, and whether groups are even... good? 

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Metal musician and filmmaker Pablo "Morbid" Vergara, who appeared in the Netflix docuseries "Crime Scene: The Vanishing at the Cecil Hotel," shares what drew him to metal music and its horror-centric imagery, and how his dark persona led to him being accused by strangers of murdering Elisa Lam--despite the fact that he was there a full year before her. He'll discuss the suffering he experienced as a result of the harassment, including a suicide attempt, making art again, and the importance of mental health awareness.

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Don't panic! Writer Aja Romano shares how they became interested in the history of the Satanic Panic in the US, how it ramped up in the 60s and 70s, the societal impact of horror films like The Exorcist, books like Satan Seller and Michelle Remembers, rising fear and trials that arose in the 80s, its impact on the LGBTQ community, and how these kinds of ideas persist today!

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