Can you be commanding without doing command and control? Can you have authority without being authoritarian? What is the best way to avoid the traps of hubris and power? Brigadier Nick Jans OAM (retired) shares his wisdom and insight from a lifetime of leadership and learning in the military. He debunks some of the myths that exist around military leadership and culture, namely that there is a difference between being authoritative and authoritarian. Military leaders have an embedded culture where you ‘earn your spurs’ and win authority, not seize it. 

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Why you should listen:

• The real mettle of leadership is what you do in easy times: win trust and compliance through building relationships
• How to avoid the trap of “believing in your own legend”
• What the military builds into its leadership systems to cut abuses of power and hubris that the business world can adopt

We explore:

• The distinctions between leading in complicated, complex and critical situations and how the military, political and civilian leaders do it
• The parallel chain of command that makes it easy to give feedback to superiors, and why all businesses should embrace this process
• The best piece of advice Nick ever received: “Shut up and listen”

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SHOWNOTES: www.zoerouth.com/podcast/nickjans

Books Mentioned:

The Chiefs — This was mentioned BEFORE we started recording and is one of Nick Jans’s publications.

The Power Paradox by Dacher Keltner

An afterword from Nick Jans:

Leadership includes 'easy-times' processes to prepare the ground for challenges that emerge in 'tough-times'. One of the impediments to Australia's appropriate response to the virus at the moment is low-grade, but not insignificant, social irresponsibility – ignoring warnings about social distance, etc. This is in contrast to the attitudes that prevail in some of our northern neighbours, e.g., South Korea, Japan and Singapore, in which social responsibility is deeply embedded as a cultural value. In Australia, successive governments should have been promoting such values to prepare us for the tough times that lie ahead (e.g., the fallout from the degradation of our climate and environment). They might have done so under the rubric of 'good old Australian community solidarity' or similar, rather than promoting the excessive individualism that is at the heart of many of the problems being currently experienced in the U.S.

An important task for strategic leaders is to build the organisational equivalent of this, i.e., soft-capability factors such as morale, organisational identification, collegiality, team cohesion, followership and the like. Granted, these are all somewhat nebulous and often difficult to measure, but, as military history repeatedly tells us, they are vital for organisational sustainability. Smart organisations know this, and work hard at building their civilian equivalents.

 About the people stuff...

It concerns the acknowledgement that leaders are human beings, and are often likely to get snappy and difficult to get along with when pressured or stressed. I can recall one of the Chiefs of the Army to whom I spoke to for the book who told me that was one of the key points he made to his staff when he assumed the position. 'I can be a snappy bastard at times', he told them, 'so I want to assure you that it will usually have nothing to do with you, and everything to do with me and whatever pressure I happen to be under at that time. Just be tolerant, and I promise I'll usually make it up to you afterwards'. I mentioned this to a couple of his staff people and they assured me that indeed it was the case; but, critically, he would readily switch to more positive behaviour when the moment had passed. It made all the difference to teamwork and their commitment.

About Nick:

Nick has long described himself as a soldier, a scholar and a management consultant, since much of his professional practice has encompassed all three roles. 

He has researched and written on leadership of teams and organisations, strategic leadership and leadership in complex networks. His most recent book is Leadership Secrets of the Australian Army: Learn from the best and inspire your team for great results, 2018 (Allen & Unwin). Awarded the Medal of the Order of Australia for his contribution to community recovery in his hometown of Marysville after the 2009 Black Saturday bushfires.

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Related Episodes:

E81 - 4 Factors for Success as an Executive, A Riveting Chat with Ron Carucci, Co-Author of Rising to Power

E32 - Stephen Scott Johnson Interview - Conscious Transformation of an Organisational Culture

E39 - How to Develop a Collaborative Leadership Style - Interview with Simon Dowling

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About your podcast host, Zoë Routh:

Zoë Routh is one of Australia’s leading experts on people stuff - the stuff that gets in our way of producing results, and the stuff that lights us up. She works with the growers, makers, builders to make people stuff fun and practical.

Zoë is the author of four books: Composure - How centered leaders make the biggest impact,  Moments - Leadership when it matters most, Loyalty - Stop unwanted stuff turnover, boost engagement, and build lifelong advocates, and People Stuff - Beyond Personalities: An advanced handbook for leadership. People Stuff was awarded Book of the Year 2020 by the Smart WFM Australian Business Book Awards.

Zoë is also the producer of The Zoë Routh Leadership Podcast.

www.zoerouth.com