Podcast Summary
Journalist Ben Deco's background shapes his narco journalism career: British journalist Ben Deco's experiences in England, Spain, and Mexico influenced his interest in and reporting on the drug trade, providing a unique perspective on the topic
Journalist Ben Deco's unique background and experiences have shaped his career, particularly his foray into narco journalism. Growing up in England, Deco's name often caused confusion for others, but it was nothing compared to the strange names he encountered in Mexico. Deco's romanticized ideas about Latin America led him to move to Mexico in 2000, where he found work at an English language newspaper. Mexico City proved to be a wild and chaotic place, but Deco was already accustomed to the stress of the city having spent a year in Spain beforehand. Deco's exposure to drugs in the UK, including the tragic experiences of friends and family members, made him particularly interested in the drug trade when he arrived in Mexico. He was initially surprised to encounter crack use in Mexico and, upon getting a job at a local newspaper, began reporting on the drug trade. Deco's background and personal experiences have given him a unique perspective on the drug trade in Mexico and have informed his journalistic work.
Corruption in Mexico's criminal underworld: Corruption extended to law enforcement and government officials, making it difficult to distinguish between good and bad actors, and posed significant risks for journalists covering the beat.
Corruption in Mexico's criminal underworld is pervasive and dangerous, even extending to law enforcement and government officials. This was exemplified by a confession from a police officer, nicknamed "Tyson," who was a high-ranking member of a drug cartel and trained young people to commit violent acts. This level of corruption made it difficult to distinguish between good and bad actors, even among those in positions of power. Journalists, including the speaker, who covered this beat faced significant risks, as shown by the assassination of a Chamber of Commerce head who had been interviewed and later became the city's chief of police. This was just one of many examples of the chaos and danger that marked the beginning of the drug war in Mexico around 2004.
Mexico's Drug War: A Violent and Entrenched Crisis: The drug war in Mexico is a complex crisis with deep roots, causing immense human suffering and requiring urgent action to address the root causes and reduce the influence of criminal organizations.
The drug war in Mexico is a complex and violent crisis that has escalated to unprecedented levels. The speaker, a journalist who covered the story extensively, describes how the situation is so entrenched that there seems to be no escape for the people living there. The cartels have infiltrated every level of society, including the police and politicians. One particularly harrowing story involves a mother in Monterey whose oldest son was taken by the cartel and never returned after she paid the ransom. The speaker expresses frustration that despite the violence being right next door to America, there is little effort to address the root causes, such as making drugs legal to reduce the influence of criminal organizations. The cartels produce and traffic various drugs, including cocaine, heroin, marijuana, and now fentanyl, which has been a recent addition to their arsenal. The situation has been ongoing for over a century, with Cinoloa being the birthplace of Mexican drug trafficking. The speaker emphasizes the human cost of the crisis, with families torn apart and lives destroyed. The situation calls for urgent action to mitigate the influence of illegal drugs and address the complex root causes.
A century-old drug trafficking issue between Mexico and the US: Recognize the financial gains from drug sales in the US, implement drug policy reform and increase social work to prevent youth involvement in cartels.
The issue of drug trafficking from Mexico to the United States, which began over a century ago with Chinese Mexicans trading opium between the two countries, has led to a significant amount of money flowing into criminal organizations, contributing to the creation of powerful cartels. These cartels have since expanded their operations beyond drugs, involving themselves in other illegal activities such as oil theft and human trafficking. The first proposed solution is drug policy reform, recognizing the vast financial resources these organizations gain from illegal drug sales in the US. A second solution is increasing social work in neighborhoods affected by drug trafficking, aiming to prevent young people from joining these criminal organizations due to circumstances like abandonment or desperation. Understanding the personal stories of those involved can provide insight into the root causes and potential solutions to this ongoing issue.
Understanding the complexities of hired killers' backgrounds: Journalists and social workers reach out to at-risk youth to prevent them from becoming hired killers, recognizing the blurred line between victim and victimizer.
The world of hired killers is complex and often involves individuals who have experienced trauma and victimization themselves. One interviewee, who killed a family at a young age due to abuse and a false promise of money, described the chilling detail of how they took their victims one by one, leaving them twitching even after their deaths. Interviewing these individuals is a delicate process, requiring careful protection of their identities due to the dangerous nature of their work and potential reprisals. Despite the risks, journalists and social workers continue to reach out to these individuals at a young age to prevent them from being recruited into organized crime. The line between victim and victimizer is blurred, highlighting the importance of early intervention and support for at-risk youth.
Living with Extreme Violence: A Complex Reality: Understanding the complex causes of extreme violence in certain areas requires empathy and a deep dive into historical and societal factors.
The world of violence and crime, particularly in certain areas of Latin America and the United States, is more complex than it may seem on the surface. People who live in these environments have normalized extreme levels of violence, which can be compared historically to periods of high violence in medieval Europe. The causes of this escalating violence are multifaceted, with factors including government corruption, drug cartels, and military crackdowns. Through spending significant time with people in these areas, it becomes clear that this is their reality, and understanding it requires empathy and a willingness to delve deeper into the complexities of human experience.
Mexico's war on drugs: Extreme violence and power struggles: Despite efforts for peace and a unified national guard, Mexico's war on drugs continues with over 33,000 deaths in 2020, equivalent to nearly 100,000 in the US.
Mexico's war on drugs has resulted in extreme violence, including beheadings and mass graves, which have become a terrifying normality for many Mexicans. This violence has been fueled by political control shifts and power struggles between various drug cartels. The response to this violence has included citizen protest movements, calls for peace and reconciliation, and the creation of a national guard to unify state police forces. Despite these efforts, the violence continues, with over 33,000 deaths in Mexico last year, equivalent to nearly 100,000 in the United States. The current president, Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador, is pursuing a two-pronged approach of promoting peace and reconciliation and creating a unified national guard to combat the cartels. However, it remains to be seen how effective these measures will be in reducing the violence and bringing stability to Mexico.
Culture of corruption in Mexican police force: Corruption in Mexican police force is rampant due to financial incentives from cartels, resulting in a deep-rooted culture of corruption and violence.
Corruption in the Mexican police force runs deep, with some officers joining the force with the intent to engage in corrupt activities due to the financial incentives offered by criminal organizations like cartels. This issue is compounded by the fact that the amount of money offered by the cartels is often far greater than what the government would provide to legitimate police officers. This mentality, rooted in survival and financial gain, has led to a culture of corruption that has escalated over the years. Despite the challenges and horrific tragedies associated with reporting on this issue, journalists like the speaker continue to cover it due to its relevance and importance. Mexico City, while not as violent as some parts of the country, still faces a significant amount of violence and corruption. The speaker expresses a deep sense of pain and a desire to protect children from the violence and suffering that is prevalent in Mexico. However, the allure of journalism and the importance of shedding light on these issues keeps the speaker and others in the profession engaged.
Dangerous Encounters in Drug-Related Journalism: Journalism in drug-violent regions can put reporters in harm's way, with threats, intimidation, and even murder posing significant risks.
The world of journalism, particularly in regions with high levels of drug-related violence, can be incredibly dangerous. The speaker, a freelance journalist, shared personal experiences of colleagues who have been targeted and even murdered in Mexico. In one instance, the speaker found himself among supposed self-defense groups, but realized they were actually drug cartel members. He was nearly identified as a DEA agent and threatened with violence. These encounters serve as a stark reminder of the risks journalists face in their pursuit of truth and information.
Mexico's Drug War: Cycle of Violence and Fragmentation: The Mexican drug war's cycle of violence leads to fragmentation and an increase in smaller, more violent gangs, requiring travelers to be cautious with valuable items.
The war on drugs in Mexico, particularly against cartels, has led to a cycle of violence and fragmentation. When key figures are taken out, power vacuums are created, leading to infighting and the rise of younger, more violent leaders. This results in the fragmentation of territories and an increase in the number of smaller gangs. Travelers need to be cautious, as these groups may target expensive equipment like laptops and cameras. The attitude towards the drug war and U.S.-Mexico relations is complex in Mexico, with a strong anti-Trump sentiment due to his derogatory comments towards Mexicans. However, there are always contrarians who may hold different views. The ongoing violence and the political climate create a complex and volatile situation in Mexico.
Mexico-US Border Control and Immigration Policies: A Contentious Issue: Historical and economic ties between Mexico and the US have complicated border control and immigration policies, with smugglers profiting from increased security measures and Trump's proposed wall facing resistance. While the financial impact on Mexico has been less severe than initially feared, drug entry through legal ports remains a challenge.
The relationship between Mexico and the United States regarding border control and immigration policies, particularly during the Trump administration, has been a contentious issue. Mexicans have generally been against Trump's policies, including the proposed wall, due to historical and economic ties between the two countries. Smugglers have profited immensely from the increasing security measures, with costs for illegal entry reaching $5,000, and cartels making a significant percentage of that money. Trump's initial threats to make Mexico pay for the wall were met with concern and resistance, but the actual impact on Mexico has been less severe than initially feared. However, the issue of drugs entering the US through legal ports of entry remains a significant challenge.
Hidden Drugs in Shipping Containers: Corruption, sophisticated methods, and high demand fuel the global drug trade. Root causes and policy reform are potential solutions.
The global drug trade is a complex issue with deep-rooted causes and sophisticated methods of operation. One historical method involves hiding drugs in shipping containers, which often go undetected through ports due to limited search capabilities. Some drug traffickers even allow themselves to be caught, allowing more drugs to pass through undetected. Corruption among border patrol and customs officials also plays a role in facilitating the drug trade. The demand for drugs in the US is driven by various factors, including dissatisfaction with work and personal struggles. Drug policy reform and addressing the root causes of drug use, such as childhood abuse and mental health issues, are potential solutions. The allure of illegal substances also contributes to their popularity. The legalization of marijuana in some places has shown a decrease in interest in illegal drug tourism. Ultimately, a multi-faceted approach is necessary to address the complex issue of the global drug trade.
Systemic racism, poverty, and lack of opportunities cause drug issues, violence, and social unrest: Addressing drug issues, violence, and social unrest requires a universal effort to prioritize the healing and uplifting of overlooked communities, rather than just focusing on campaigns and foreign aid.
The root causes of drug-related issues, violence, and social unrest in Latin America and inner-city communities in the United States can be traced back to years of systemic racism, poverty, and lack of opportunities. These communities are often overlooked and underfunded, leading to a cycle of despair and hopelessness that can drive individuals to sell drugs or commit violent acts. The moral transformation from selling drugs to committing murder is a complex process, often driven by deep-seated pain, anger, and a desire for revenge. To address these issues, there needs to be a universal effort from all citizens and politicians to prioritize the healing and uplifting of these communities, rather than just focusing on campaigning and foreign aid. Social workers and community leaders like Sandra in Ciudad Juarez are making a difference, but more resources and support are needed to make a lasting impact.
Gangs target individuals without strong family bonds: Lack of family support can lead to recruitment by gangs and contribute to crime, while community investments and effective law enforcement can help reduce crime rates.
The lack of loving families and supportive environments can contribute to the cycle of violence and crime, particularly in areas with high gang activity. This was highlighted in the discussion about the recruitment tactics of gangs like the Barrio Azteca, where leaders look for individuals with anger and hate, often found in those without strong family bonds. Conversely, efforts to improve communities, such as building beautiful structures in impoverished neighborhoods or investing in social work, can have a significant impact on reducing crime rates, as seen in the example of Medellin, Colombia. Additionally, having effective law enforcement and the ability to defend oneself can also contribute to safer communities.
Mexico's unique challenges in creating effective law enforcement: Mexico faces high levels of violence and crime, requiring a police force with unique resources and determination to protect its people. The US also needs to address its own issues with police brutality and systemic racism.
While there are issues with law enforcement in both Mexico and the United States, the difference in crime rates and overall safety is significant. Mexico faces unique challenges in creating a police force with the will and resources to effectively protect its people from violent crimes like kidnapping. The job of a police officer is inherently difficult and often comes with trauma and the threat of violence. It's important to acknowledge the complexities of law enforcement and the impact of crime on communities. In Mexico, the high levels of violence and crime can lead to a sense of hopelessness and acceptance, whereas in the United States, there is often a greater expectation for individual success and a sense of personal failure when faced with poverty or crime. However, it's important to remember that the United States also has its own issues with police brutality and systemic racism. Ultimately, both countries need to address the root causes of crime and work towards creating effective, equitable law enforcement systems.
Material wealth doesn't ensure happiness, gun control needed: Despite US having high income, happiness levels are low due to material wealth focus and gun issues. Gun control measures needed to reduce violence.
Material wealth and possessions do not guarantee happiness, and in fact, can lead to increased stress levels. This is evident in the United States where a large percentage of the population makes more than the average global income, yet overall happiness levels are lower than in countries like Mexico. Another concerning issue is the large number of guns flowing from the United States into Mexico, contributing to violence and crime. This is facilitated by private gun sales and loopholes that allow individuals to bypass background checks. The ease of access to guns in some areas of the US, coupled with a culture of fear and a desire for self-protection, creates a dangerous situation. Ultimately, it's important to question the role material possessions play in our lives and consider alternative sources of happiness and fulfillment. Additionally, addressing the issue of gun trafficking and improving gun control measures could help reduce violence and improve overall safety.
Addressing Gun Violence: Balancing Rights and Regulations: The speaker advocates for a balanced approach to gun control, addressing both the human factors behind gun violence and illegal gun trafficking, and implementing practical regulations like closing the gun show loophole and regulating high-powered weapons.
While individuals have the right to own guns, there are concerns about the ease with which criminals obtain them through loopholes like the gun show loophole. The speaker believes that addressing the root causes of violence and crime, rather than focusing solely on gun control, is essential. However, they also acknowledge the need for reasonable regulations, such as closing the gun show loophole and regulating high-powered weapons like 50 caliber guns. The speaker advocates for a balanced approach to gun control, one that respects the Second Amendment while also addressing the issue of illegal gun trafficking. They also mention the use of 50 cows by cartels as a concern and ask if there is room for regulation in that area. Overall, the speaker emphasizes the importance of addressing the human factors behind gun violence and illegal gun trafficking, while also recognizing the need for practical regulations to prevent criminals from obtaining weapons.
Regulation Disparity between Guns and Other Dangerous Items: Unlike cars, guns lack a searchable database for ownership, making it hard to trace crime guns and raising concerns for safety. A traceable gun database could improve regulation and public safety.
While the United States has regulations in place for gun ownership, there are significant differences between how guns and other potentially dangerous items, like cars, are regulated. Unlike cars, where a license plate can be traced to identify ownership, guns do not have a searchable database. This makes it difficult to trace the origin of a gun involved in a crime. The speaker expresses a personal belief that a traceable database for guns would be beneficial, drawing an analogy to the licensing and testing required for driving a car. The speaker also shares their experiences with gun ownership and the lack of required safety training or knowledge checks, which they find concerning. Overall, the conversation highlights the disparity in regulation between guns and other potentially dangerous items, and the potential benefits of more comprehensive gun regulations.
Considering Factors Before Using a Gun for Self-Defense: Guns require training and careful consideration for effective self-defense. They come with risks and should be used based on specific circumstances and individual capabilities.
While self-defense tools like guns can be effective in certain situations, their use depends on various factors such as training, understanding of the situation, and personal preparedness. Guns, like martial arts, require effort and thought to be used effectively. While they can protect individuals and their families from harm, they also come with risks, such as accidental discharge or misuse. Ultimately, the decision to use a gun for self-defense should be based on a careful consideration of the specific circumstances and individual capabilities. It's essential to remember that self-defense is not a binary issue, and that there are many ways to protect oneself beyond just owning a gun.
Normalization of Danger in War Journalism: Journalists and cameramen risk their lives daily to capture war events, prioritizing shots over safety, with evolving guerrilla warfare techniques adding to the danger. Intimate footage offers unique insights, but access is limited and safety is never guaranteed.
War zones and the violence that comes with them have become normalized for some journalists and cameramen, who risk their lives daily to capture events for the rest of the world. This normalization is evident in the way these individuals approach their work, often prioritizing the shot over their own safety. The discussion also highlighted the evolution of guerrilla warfare techniques, such as the suicidal form used by ISIS in Marawi, Philippines, which involves close-quarters fighting and hiding in basements to fire through walls. Despite the danger, some journalists manage to capture intimate footage of these conflicts, offering unique insights into the chaos of war. However, access to these areas is often limited, and even being located far from the main battle area doesn't guarantee safety.
New form of conflict: Crime wars: Crime wars are a new form of conflict, characterized by intense violence, high casualties, and driven by internal insurgencies and organized crime groups. They are spreading globally and causing refugee migrations.
The world is experiencing a new form of conflict, which doesn't fit neatly into the categories of crime or war. This hybrid conflict, as described by experts like Robert Bunker and John Sullivan, is particularly prevalent in countries like Mexico, El Salvador, Guatemala, and Honduras. These "crime wars" involve intense violence and high casualties, and are often driven by internal insurgencies and organized crime groups. The situation is spreading to other parts of the world, including Somalia and Libya, and is a major cause of refugee migrations. The caravan of Central Americans that made headlines in 2018 was a response to the danger of mass kidnappings, and the desperation of people living in countries like Honduras, which are in a state of crisis. This new form of conflict is challenging traditional definitions and requires a new way of understanding.
Border Chaos: Migrants, Military, and Cartels: During a chaotic border situation, migrants sought refuge and crossed barriers despite tear gas, while military intervention was not a viable solution due to sovereignty concerns. Covering the story involved encounters with cartels, rugged terrain, and unexpected encounters with El Chapo.
The situation at the border between Mexico and the United States was chaotic during a specific event, with migrants attempting to cross the border despite tear gas and other obstacles. The motivations for migration varied greatly, from those seeking refuge from targeted violence to those with no clear plan. The idea of U.S. military intervention was not a viable solution due to Mexican sovereignty concerns. The experiences of covering this story involved encounters with dangerous cartels, rugged terrain, and unexpected encounters with the elusive drug lord, El Chapo. Despite the apparent contradiction of being involved in a violent criminal enterprise while practicing evangelical Christianity, the cousin presented himself as a peaceful cattle rancher. The overall scene was a complex mix of danger, uncertainty, and unexpected encounters.
El Chapo's New York Trial: A Spectacle with Ethical Dilemmas: El Chapo's trial in New York was a high-profile event with numerous witnesses, including alleged gangsters, testifying against him. Ethical dilemmas arose regarding the use of these witnesses and the limits of what could be discussed in court.
The trial of El Chapo in New York was a spectacle, with the U.S. government bringing in numerous witnesses, some of whom were alleged gangsters, to testify against him. The defense attempted to argue that there was government corruption and a conspiracy involving the Mexican government and cartels, but this was not allowed in court. El Chapo, who is originally from Mexico and was accused of being a major drug lord, was indicted in multiple places, and the trial in New York was seen as a way to put on a bigger show. Despite his vast wealth, El Chapo and other drug lords often remain localized in their environments, controlling their territories and becoming powerful figures within them. The trial raised ethical questions about the use of witnesses and the limits of what could be discussed in court.
The pursuit of power and wealth can lead to dangerous situations: The quest for power and wealth can lead to corruption, violence, and even death, and it's important to maintain ethical behavior.
The desire for power and wealth can lead individuals into dangerous and morally questionable situations, as seen in the case of Mexican drug traffickers and even prominent figures like ex-governors and celebrities. The allure of making more money and the psychological factors that come into play can cause people to lose perspective and become consumed by their pursuits. The consequences of these actions can be severe, including corruption, violence, and even death. It's important to remember that the quest for wealth and power should not come at the expense of morality and ethical behavior. The story of Sean Penn and Kate de Castillo's encounter with a drug lord serves as a reminder of the risks and complexities involved in such situations.
Journalist Sean Penn's interview with El Chapo despite his capture: Despite El Chapo's capture, journalist Sean Penn conducted a video interview with him for Rolling Stone, emphasizing the challenges of maintaining connections with criminals and dealing with law enforcement.
The meeting between journalist Sean Penn and drug lord El Chapo was a risky endeavor, with questions surrounding the role of law enforcement and the potential for follow-up interviews being affected by El Chapo's capture. Penn wrote about the experience for Rolling Stone, but El Chapo was unable to give an in-person interview due to heightened security following his capture in early 2016. Instead, El Chapo answered questions via video interview, which was published alongside Penn's article. The timing of the story's release and the impact of El Chapo's capture on the interview process are subjects of debate. The author of the discussion, who has written extensively about drug cartels, emphasized the challenges of maintaining connections with criminals while also dealing with law enforcement. The author's works include "El Narco," "Gangster Warlords," and an upcoming book about gun trafficking.
