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    #97 - David Hua and Vincent Ning

    en-usOctober 11, 2018

    Podcast Summary

    • Exploring the Diverse World of Cannabis ProductsThe cannabis industry provides a wide range of products with unique aromas and effects due to their distinct terpene profiles. Beginners should start with a low-dose edible, while potency is determined by THC percentages on labels, not the strength of the smell.

      The cannabis industry, like wine, offers a diverse range of products with distinct aromas and effects. David Huwa, CEO of Meadow, brought various cannabis products for a discussion on Y Combinator's podcast. He explained how different strains have unique terpene profiles, which influence the aroma and the effects. Vincent Ning, CEO of Navas, a cannabis services group, shared that they help distribute some of these products for brands that don't have the resources for self-distribution. During the discussion, they opened and smelled various products, including edibles, flowers, body rub, oils, and pre-rolls. The aromas ranged from sweet blueberries to cheesy musk to citrusy lemon. The strain names often indicate the dominant aroma, with indicas having a body high and sativas having a head high. The strength of the smell does not necessarily indicate potency, as THC percentages are now listed on labels. Live resin, a concentrate with 65% THC, is much stronger than regular flowers. For beginners, a five-milligram edible is recommended. Overall, the cannabis industry offers a rich and diverse consumer experience, with various products catering to different preferences and experiences.

    • Catering to new consumers with low-dose, gourmet cannabis productsNew consumers prefer controlled, personalized cannabis experiences through low-dose, gourmet products like edibles and concentrates, leading to a shift in market demand

      The cannabis market is evolving to cater to a new consumer base that prefers low-dose, gourmet products for microdosing. Consumers are now able to understand the exact milligrams and profiles of what they're consuming, leading to a more controlled and personalized experience. While traditional items like flour and pre-rolls still have high demand, edibles are becoming increasingly popular for new consumers due to their ease of consumption and granular dosing. The concentrate market, particularly through vapes, is also growing rapidly, offering consumers different strains and feelings with discreet and quick onset.

    • Baby Boomers Discovering Cannabis for Health BenefitsBaby boomers are turning to CBD, a non-psychoactive compound from cannabis, for health benefits. Hemp-derived CBD is legal and widely available, offering medicinal properties and reducing pain without a high.

      The cannabis industry is evolving, with a growing number of baby boomers discovering its potential health benefits. Many are turning to CBD, a non-psychoactive compound derived from cannabis, to replace prescription drugs and improve their overall wellness. CBD, which stands for Cannabidiol, can be derived from both marijuana and hemp, with hemp-derived CBD being legal and widely available. Unlike THC, the psychoactive compound in cannabis, CBD does not produce a high. Instead, it offers medicinal properties, reducing pain and providing a calming effect. The entourage effect, which occurs when different cannabinoids work together, enhances the benefits of CBD. While CBD from hemp is available at retailers like Costco, marijuana-derived CBD can be purchased at dispensaries. The industry is moving beyond strain-based products and focusing on the therapeutic benefits of various cannabinoids, including THCV, THCA, CBN, and CBG.

    • Cannabis Industry's Focus on Ratio-Based and Effect-Driven Products, Terpenes, and Extraction MethodsThe cannabis industry is shifting towards producing ratio-based and effect-driven products, with an increasing interest in terpenes. Extraction methods, such as solvent-less and solvent-based, significantly impact the strains and ratios of CBD and THC.

      The cannabis industry is evolving, with a focus on ratio-based and effect-driven products, as well as an emerging interest in terpenes. Extraction methods, such as solvent-less and solvent-based, play a significant role in deriving different strains and ratios of CBD and THC. Meadow and Vincent are companies that have chosen to not manufacture products themselves but instead focus on software and distribution, respectively, due to the capital-intensive nature and regulatory complexities of manufacturing. The industry's growth and evolution present opportunities and challenges for entrepreneurs and investors alike.

    • Navigating Licensing and Fundraising Challenges in the Cannabis IndustrySecuring funding for cannabis businesses is difficult due to industry stigma and regulatory complexities, requiring education and persistence from investors

      Starting a business in the cannabis industry comes with significant challenges, particularly in the areas of licensing and fundraising. The process of obtaining a license can be costly and time-consuming, and many institutions have restrictions on investing in vice industries. Meadow, a cannabis technology company, faced these challenges head-on when they went through Y Combinator in 2014. The company's founders saw a need for a system that allowed dispensaries to be compliant with new regulations and provide a consumer-friendly experience. They raised $2.5 million, with half coming from larger institutions and the other half from smaller, forward-thinking angel investors. The fundraising process was lengthy, as potential investors had to first become educated about the cannabis industry and its regulatory landscape before making an investment decision.

    • Investment opportunities in California's cannabis industryCalifornia's cannabis industry offers significant growth potential due to its rich history, economic impact, and lack of dominant brands, but thorough due diligence is necessary due to complex regulations and fragmentation.

      The cannabis industry in California, with its rich history and significant economic impact, presents a unique opportunity for investors. Despite the industry's rapid growth and fragmentation, there is still a lack of dominant brands or companies. This fragmentation, along with the complex regulations and licensing requirements, necessitates thorough due diligence from investors. California's position as a leading agricultural and cultural hub in the United States further adds to its appeal. However, as the industry evolves and matures, it remains a challenge to maintain the unique aspects of the cannabis culture while turning it over to a more regulated market.

    • Navigating the complex regulatory environment in California's cannabis marketCalifornia's fragmented regulatory landscape and local permitting issues create hurdles for businesses, while lack of federal banking laws further complicates matters. In contrast, Canada sees a surge of investment from large companies looking to enter the US market through consolidation.

      The legalization of cannabis in large markets like California and Canada presents significant opportunities for growth, but also comes with unique challenges. In California, the fragmented regulatory landscape and local permitting issues create hurdles for businesses looking to operate legally. The lack of federal banking laws further complicates matters. In contrast, Canada, which recently federally legalized cannabis, is seeing a surge of investment from large, publicly traded companies looking to establish a presence in the US market. This consolidation trend is expected to continue as these companies buy up licensed businesses in states like California. Overall, while the legal cannabis market holds great promise, navigating the complex regulatory environment and securing adequate capital remains a significant challenge.

    • Cannabis Industry Hubs in CaliforniaCalifornia's cannabis industry involves complex regulations and taxes, with hubs handling compliance testing, tax collection, and remittance to the government, while high taxes increase final product costs.

      The cannabis industry in California involves a complex supply chain with various regulations and taxes. Transactions are mostly in cash, and delivery operators collect and bring it back to dispensaries. The industry is moving towards allowing delivery operators to deliver anywhere in the state, similar to an ice cream truck model, but this is in contention with local control. Companies like the one discussed here act as hubs in the supply chain, handling compliance testing, tax collection, and remittance to the government. The cultivation and excise taxes add significantly to the final product cost, making prices high, with most of the upside going to the government.

    • Medical Patients Turning to Illicit Market for Affordable CannabisHigh prices of legal cannabis are pushing medical patients towards the illicit market, impacting government revenue and leaving behind vulnerable communities.

      The high prices of legal cannabis products are driving many medical patients to the illicit market due to price sensitivity and the need for higher dosages. The merging of the medical and adult-use markets and the cost of obtaining a medical card have also contributed to this trend. While there are brand loyal consumers, many are open to trying new products based on bud tender recommendations, and brands often engage in marketing efforts to promote their products to dispensaries. This has resulted in a loss of revenue for the government and potentially leaving behind the most disenfranchised members of the community.

    • Cannabis Industry's Regulatory Changes and Market InstabilityDespite challenges from regulatory changes and market instability, the cannabis industry offers opportunities for those who can navigate regulations, secure partnerships, and secure capital.

      The cannabis industry is experiencing significant regulatory changes and market instability, leading to brand volatility and a shortage of supply. The implementation of strict regulations, such as phase two testing, has resulted in the elimination of certain brands from the market, causing a rush for new brands to emerge. The supply chain is still developing, making it challenging for new businesses to thrive without a license or established partnerships. The industry is expected to continue evolving with more states passing favorable regulations towards cannabis, but federal legalization is predicted to still be a few years away. The cost of compliance, security, and licensing, as well as the shortage of capital, make it difficult for small businesses to expand. Canadian companies are investing in the industry, but this has led to a brutal M&A climate. In five years, California is expected to remove the one-acre cap on grows, allowing for unlimited size grows. Overall, the cannabis industry is facing numerous challenges but also presents significant opportunities for those who can navigate the regulatory landscape and secure necessary partnerships and capital.

    • Navigating Challenges in the Rapidly Evolving Cannabis IndustrySmall farmers can thrive by communicating value through sustainable practices and consumer connection. The industry's future includes M&A, global exports, and involvement from big players. Advocacy groups and media must evolve messaging to reach a broader audience and reduce stigma.

      The cannabis industry is rapidly evolving, with legalization expanding in the US and international markets. Small farmers may face challenges due to increased competition from larger, capitalized companies and international players. However, communicating value through sustainable growing practices and consumer connection can help them thrive. The industry's future may include more M&A activity, global exports, and involvement from big players like alcohol, pharma, and tobacco. Advocacy groups and media, such as High Times and Cheech & Chong, are crucial in raising awareness and pushing for legalization, but their messaging must evolve to reach a broader audience and reduce stigma. Overall, the cannabis industry's growth requires collaboration, innovation, and a focus on quality and consumer connection.

    • The stigma surrounding cannabis and psychedelics is changingInfluential figures are advocating for cannabis and psychedelics, medical use is driving legalization, and their potential benefits are becoming more recognized

      The stigma surrounding cannabis and psychedelics is changing, with influential figures like Elon Musk, Gwyneth Paltrow, and Whoopi Goldberg stepping forward to represent these substances. However, the media and advertising channels continue to pose challenges for businesses in the industry. The medical use of these substances, particularly in the case of PTSD and psychological trauma, is driving the legalization movement. Psychedelics offer a deeper level of self-awareness and interaction with the environment, while cannabis provides a valuable outlet for relaxation and relief in our hyper-connected, stressful world. Exonerations for cannabis-related offenses are a significant development in the legal landscape, particularly in California. Overall, the conversation around cannabis and psychedelics is evolving, and their potential benefits are becoming more widely recognized.

    • Cities and states are promoting social equity and decriminalization in the cannabis industrySupport small, artisan growers and understand the importance of the story behind their products to help promote social equity in the cannabis industry

      The cannabis industry is undergoing a significant shift towards social equity and decriminalization. Cities and states are expunging old cannabis convictions and creating programs to help individuals from disenfranchised communities enter the industry. For instance, businesses can contribute to rent for social equity partners, expediting licensing processes. However, more funding and resources are needed to help these businesses succeed. Consumers play a role in supporting this movement by buying products from small, artisan growers and recognizing the importance of the story behind the product. The cannabis industry is unique in that it requires a deeper understanding of the people and processes behind the products, beyond just the knowledge of what's in the cannabis and its effects. Both in the cannabis industry and in startups, understanding the market, securing funding, and building a team are crucial, but the specific challenges and opportunities vary.

    • Starting a business involves initial non-scalable efforts and community buildingFocus on creating something people want, be patient, and build a community to thrive in business.

      Building a successful business involves doing things that don't scale initially, learning from the industry and competition, and building a strong community. The speakers shared their experience of starting a cannabis business, where they had to deliver products across California themselves before regulation. This helped them understand the industry and meet people. They emphasized the importance of focusing on making something people want, being patient, and not worrying about competition. Additionally, they highlighted the value of building a community within the industry to move forward and support each other. They recommended Y Combinator for entrepreneurs seeking advice and a community to help them build their businesses. Overall, the advice given was to stay focused, learn from experiences, and build a strong network to thrive in the business world.

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    Why do banks have holidays? Should we redesign the banking system? Is there a future for crypto?

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    Molly White Episode
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