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    EP.100 - JEFFREY DAHMER, DARK HORROR THEORIES, & EVIL MOTHER STORY (Ft. ALL GUESTS)

    enOctober 16, 2022
    What selection does Kroger offer for mealtime inspiration?
    What new features has Bumble introduced for dating?
    What topics did The Tuckers Show discuss in their 100th episode?
    Why is authenticity important in food experiences?
    How can music help in establishing connections on a date?

    • Kroger's mealtime offerings and Bumble's dating featuresKroger provides a vast range of affordable meal options, while Bumble introduces new features to improve compatibility and safety in dating.

      Kroger offers an extensive selection of over 30,000 delicious options for mealtime inspiration, along with everyday low prices and various savings opportunities. Meanwhile, Bumble introduces new features to enhance compatibility, initiate conversations, and ensure safer dating experiences. The hosts of The Tuckers Show celebrated their 100th episode with a nostalgic look back at their favorite guests, including controversial figures and popular personalities. They expressed surprise at the podcast's success, as they were initially hesitant about sharing their content with a wider audience.

    • Forming meaningful relationships through podcastingPodcasting can bring people closer together, providing a platform for authentic conversations and fostering new connections.

      Creating a platform for open communication and expression, like a podcast, can lead to the formation of meaningful relationships and connections that may not have existed otherwise. This was evident in the conversation between two friends, as they reflected on their journey from high school to adulthood and the role their podcast played in bringing them closer together. They acknowledged that without their creative outlet, they may not have had the reason or opportunity to link up with each other and other friends as frequently as they did. The podcast served as a platform for authentic conversations, featuring guests who were mostly their friends from school. It also provided motivation for those aspiring to start their own podcasts, showing that it's possible to build a successful platform without relying on big cosigns or external validation. The friends' determination and authenticity in creating their content from their own bedrooms ultimately paid off, leading to a unique and special bond that continues to grow.

    • Unexpected community growth from a promotional podcastStarting a podcast with the goal of promotion can lead to building a strong community. Creating a positive and supportive environment is crucial for growth and development.

      Starting a podcast with the intention of promoting things can unexpectedly lead to building a strong community. The speakers in this discussion started the podcast as a means to promote things, but they didn't anticipate it becoming a community where people felt a sense of belonging and connection. They shared experiences of fans reacting positively to seeing them together in person or helping those in need within the community. The speakers emphasized the importance of creating a positive and supportive environment, which has contributed to the growth and development of the individuals involved. The podcast has become more than just a platform for promotion; it's a place where people can come together and share love and support.

    • Competition as a catalyst for growthSeeing competition as a form of flattery and motivation to outshine can lead to growth and improvement.

      Competition and imitation can be seen as catalysts for growth and improvement, rather than threats. The guests on the podcast discussed their experiences with others copying their work, and while it was initially disheartening, they came to view it as a sign that they were doing something right and an opportunity to outshine their competition. They saw it as a form of flattery and a motivation to work harder and push boundaries. As one guest put it, "if there's competition, I wanna destroy every single competition in front of you." However, it's important to remember that while competition can be beneficial, it's not always enjoyable or easy to deal with. It's important to find a mindset that allows you to use the competition as fuel for growth, rather than letting it consume you.

    • The comfort zone can hinder personal growthAvoid complacency and strive for new experiences to grow and make meaningful connections. Create memorable first dates by putting in effort and being authentic.

      Being comfortable can hinder personal growth and development. The speaker shares an analogy of spending too much time in bed, which can lead to inactivity and even physical pain. Similarly, being unproductive and complacent in life can prevent us from progressing and achieving our goals. Another topic discussed was first date ideas. The speaker shared his personal experience of taking his partner to the store to buy flowers and then to an all-you-can-eat restaurant. He emphasized the importance of making a good first impression and showing effort. However, he also acknowledged that everyone is different, and what works for one person may not work for another. The speaker also touched on the topic of dinner dates, acknowledging that they can be intimidating and require a significant time commitment. He suggested alternative first date ideas that are more active and fun, such as going to an amusement park or trying a new activity together. The goal is to create a memorable experience that shows your personality and interests. Overall, the key takeaway is to avoid complacency and strive for growth and new experiences, whether it's on a first date or in life in general. By putting in effort and being authentic, we can make meaningful connections and create lasting memories.

    • Effective communication and understanding are crucial for a successful first dateListen to each other, consider preferences, share decision-making power, and enjoy each other's company for a successful first date

      Effective communication and understanding are key components in planning a successful first date. The conversation reveals that the ability to listen to one another, consider each other's preferences, and be comfortable with playful banter are essential. The importance of knowing the person a little before making plans cannot be overstated. While the traditional notion of the man taking the initiative may still hold, the decision-making power can be shared between partners. Ultimately, the success of a first date depends on both parties feeling comfortable and enjoying each other's company.

    • Enjoying a walk with the right companySharing common interests like music can improve connections during activities, making for enjoyable experiences.

      The right company can make any activity more enjoyable, even something as simple as going on a walk. However, if the person you're with isn't a good match, it can lead to awkward silence and discomfort. Finding common interests, such as music, can help generate conversation and create a better connection. A unique date idea like a music date, where both parties share their favorite songs, can be an effective way to test the compatibility and vibe between two people. Music is a universal language that can bring people closer together and create lasting memories.

    • Openness and honesty in music relationshipsBeing open to new experiences and having honest communication about musical preferences can lead to deeper connections and broadening musical horizons in relationships

      Openness and honesty are crucial elements in building compatibility and connection in relationships. This can be applied to various aspects of shared interests, including music. While some people believe that having the same musical tastes is essential, others argue that being open to new experiences and having an honest communication about preferences can lead to deeper connections. The ability to appreciate and respect each other's differences can lead to discovering new favorites and broadening one's musical horizons. Ultimately, the key is to approach relationships with an open mind and a willingness to understand and accept the unique qualities of each other.

    • Beliefs about the afterlife shape our perception of itBeliefs in an afterlife, whether it's heaven or hell, can motivate good actions and deter bad ones, but the criteria for entering it is uncertain and influenced by religious or cultural beliefs.

      Our beliefs about the afterlife shape our perception of it. According to the speaker, if we truly believe in an afterlife, whether it's heaven or hell, we may experience it in our minds as we die. This belief can serve as a motivation to live a good life and avoid evil actions out of fear of the consequences in the afterlife. The speaker also acknowledges that the afterlife is something we cannot comprehend, and our beliefs about it may vary widely. The idea that there is a hell can serve as a deterrent to doing wrong, as nobody wants to go there. However, the criteria for entering the afterlife, if it exists, is uncertain and may be based on various religious or cultural beliefs. Ultimately, the speaker suggests that the afterlife may reveal our true selves, and our beliefs about it can influence our actions in this life.

    • God's teachings are moral guidelines, not judgmentsGod's love is based on intentions and actions, not just rules, and treating others with respect is key to living a good life

      The Bible's teachings, including the law against homosexuality, should not be viewed as a judgment on individuals or their inherent worth. Instead, they reflect moral guidelines for living a good life. The speaker believes that God is based on love and that our intentions and actions, not just adherence to rules, matter most. The speaker also acknowledges the complexity of human nature and the challenge of discerning true intentions. The discussion touched on the Jeffrey Dahmer case, highlighting the importance of not judging based on appearances and the potential for evil to hide in plain sight. Ultimately, the speaker suggests that living with good intentions and treating others with love and respect is the best way to live and potentially find redemption, even if one's intentions are not always clear to others.

    • Real Crime Documentaries: Blurring Fiction and RealityDocumentaries based on real serial killer interviews can be disturbing, emphasizing the importance of personal limits and maturity when engaging with such content.

      The documentary "Mindhunter" based on real serial killer interviews can be disturbing, especially for those directly affected by the crimes. The line between fiction and reality blurs when watching a true crime documentary, leading to a more profound impact on viewers. The speaker expressed discomfort after watching the documentary, particularly due to the recreation of crimes against children. He acknowledged that some people might find these types of shows intriguing, but emphasized the importance of personal limits and maturity when engaging with such content. Additionally, the speaker shared a personal experience of his lights turning off by themselves, which he attributed to a ghost, adding to the overall eerie conversation.

    • Exploring the Unexpected Connections in Paranormal ExperiencesThrough sharing stories of paranormal experiences, we discovered common themes and unearthed intriguing theories, revealing the power of storytelling and the connections formed through shared experiences.

      Our experiences and conversations can sometimes unknowingly interconnect in unexpected ways. In this discussion, we explored various topics ranging from superstitions about sleep paralysis and dream interpretation to shared experiences of exploring abandoned places. One common thread was the presence of nooses and chairs in these experiences, which sparked intriguing theories about their potential significance. The conversation also revealed that some individuals have had more intense encounters with paranormal phenomena than others. Despite the eerie nature of some of the stories, there was a sense of camaraderie and shared fascination with the mysterious and unexplained. Ultimately, the conversation highlighted the power of storytelling and the connections that can be formed through shared experiences and conversations.

    • The toxic behavior of Mia Goth's character in 'Pearl' leaves a lasting impressionMia Goth's compelling performance in 'Pearl' explores the scary possibilities of real life through a toxic and destructive character, leaving a lasting impression and highlighting the psychological depth and disturbing elements of the movie.

      The character in the movie, portrayed by Mia Goth, displays a toxic and destructive behavior towards those she perceives as her enemies, even if they are normal people. Her monologue about cheating on her boyfriend while he's at war was so compelling that it left the speaker feeling empathy for her character. Mia Goth's performance was praised as one of the most incredible acting displays, leaving a lasting impression. The movie, which is not supernatural but rather focuses on the scary possibilities of real life, is considered a must-watch for its psychological depth and disturbing elements. The speaker also mentioned "Run," a recent Netflix movie based on a true story, as another scary and unsettling movie worth watching.

    • Mother's Disturbing Desire to Care for Stolen DaughterReality can be scarier than fiction, as shown in a movie about a mother's manipulation of her daughter. Personal experiences remind us of life's unpredictability, and being aware of potential dangers is crucial.

      The line between reality and fiction can be blurred, and the scariest things we encounter can be rooted in truth. The discussion revolved around a movie where a mother manipulates her daughter into becoming paralyzed so she can take care of her. This disturbing behavior stemmed from her deep desire to be a mother and take care of her child. Later in the movie, it's revealed that the daughter was actually stolen from a hospital as a baby, adding an extra layer of horror. This revelation highlights the reality that such events can occur, making the situation even more terrifying. The speakers also shared personal experiences, including a near-death car accident, which served as a reminder that life can be unpredictable and fragile. The discussion concluded with a reflection on the importance of being aware of the potential dangers that exist in the world, both in reality and in media.

    • Music and significant momentsMusic deeply connects to our lives, shaping us through significant moments and experiences, even during unexpected events

      Our music choices and experiences can be deeply connected to significant moments in our lives, even during unexpected situations like near-death experiences. The memory of a song playing during a traumatic event can leave a lasting impact. Additionally, people may feel compelled to act out of character to impress others, even if it results in embarrassment or discomfort. The speaker shared a story about singing an out-of-character song for a crush during a family vacation, despite feeling uncomfortable doing so. Overall, these experiences shape who we are and remind us of the power of music and human connection.

    • Pressure to conform in social situationsStay true to your values and be comfortable in your own skin, even when faced with pressure to conform.

      First impressions can be important, even if they're not authentic to who we truly are. The speaker shared an experience where he was invited to church by his girlfriend and felt pressured to put on a "nice" facade for her family. He recalled an even more embarrassing moment from his childhood when he and a friend performed a dance routine at a talent show that didn't go as planned. Despite the cringeworthy experience, his father was proud of him for staying true to himself and not giving in to peer pressure. The story highlights the importance of staying true to our values and being comfortable in our own skin, even when faced with pressure to conform.

    • Understanding priorities and attachmentsPeople's priorities and attachments shape experiences and relationships. Persevering through obstacles and respecting each other's desires strengthens bonds.

      People's priorities and attachments can significantly impact their experiences and relationships. In the discussion, there were multiple instances where people's desires, such as watching a soccer game or having food, caused delays or conflicts. However, these moments also showed the depth of their bonds and the importance of sticking together. For instance, the speaker and his friend Jeremy waited for hours for a reservation, despite Jeremy's insistence on watching Arsenal. Similarly, the speaker's friend Gavin was controlled by his mother, Cherin, who kept him in a wheelchair and prevented him from eating. These experiences highlight the power of perseverance and the importance of not giving up on shared experiences, even when faced with obstacles. Additionally, the discussion also touched upon people's attachments to food and their strong desire to satisfy their cravings. Overall, the conversation underscores the significance of understanding and respecting people's priorities and attachments, and the importance of being patient and supportive in the face of challenges.

    • Experiences Shaping Preferences and AversionsExperiences, whether positive or negative, can significantly impact our likes and dislikes, leading to long-term aversions or preferences.

      Experiences, whether pleasant or traumatic, can significantly shape our preferences and aversions. The discussion revolves around various experiences with substances, food, and memories. One person shared an experience of smoking weed for the first time, leading to a traumatic experience and aversion to the substance. Another shared a traumatic experience with ketchup and Lay's chips, resulting in an aversion to both. The conversation also touched upon the irony of artists and podcasters discussing seemingly mundane topics. Overall, the discussion highlights the power of experiences in shaping our preferences and aversions.

    • Childhood experiences shape food preferencesPersonal experiences and upbringing can influence food preferences, leading to aversions or fond memories.

      Personal experiences and upbringing can significantly influence food preferences and hygiene habits. The discussion revolves around a friend's aversion to eating chips from dirty bags and their past experiences with frogs and worms. The group reminisces about their childhood, sharing stories of frog hunting and eating frogs, worms, and even slugs. Some of these experiences were unpleasant, leading to aversion or revulsion towards certain foods. Others, however, were fond memories. The conversation also touches upon the potential risks of consuming certain foods, such as parasites from slugs. Overall, the discussion highlights the diverse and sometimes unusual food experiences that shape our individual preferences and habits.

    • Manipulating Systems as a Young PersonActions have consequences, consider potential repercussions before engaging in mischievous behavior. Communication and understanding between parents and children is crucial, as is the role of teachers and authority figures in shaping behavior.

      People often find ways to manipulate systems, even at a young age. This can range from skipping school calls by blocking numbers, to using siblings' signatures for school slips, or even throwing rocks at dogs and getting away with it. While some of these actions may seem harmless or even clever, they can lead to serious consequences if taken too far. It's important to remember that actions have consequences, and it's crucial to consider the potential repercussions before engaging in mischievous behavior. Additionally, this conversation highlights the importance of communication and understanding between parents and children, as well as the role of teachers and authority figures in shaping behavior and enforcing rules. Overall, the discussion illustrates the complexities and challenges of growing up and navigating the world as a young person.

    • Understanding Individual Sources of Happiness and Complex RelationshipsPeople's happiness sources and relationship dynamics can differ greatly. Effective communication, understanding, and compromise are key to successful relationships.

      People's sources of happiness and the dynamics of relationships can vary greatly. Some individuals may heavily rely on romantic partners for their happiness, while others may find fulfillment in different areas of their lives. The discussion also touched upon the idea that people, regardless of gender, can be complex and may not always express their true feelings openly. Furthermore, the roles and initiations in relationships can also differ between genders, with some individuals being more straightforward in their approach, while others may be more subtle or passive. Ultimately, successful relationships require effective communication, understanding, and compromise.

    • The appeal of a decisive partnerSome people find it attractive when a partner takes charge, but communication, trust, and respect are crucial for a successful relationship.

      While some people may prefer to be in control and make decisions on their own, many individuals, particularly women, may find it attractive when a partner takes the lead. This doesn't mean that every person wants to be told what to do, but rather that having someone to rely on and feel taken care of can be appealing. The idea of an "alpha male" or someone who is perceived as confident and decisive can be attractive to some, but it's important to remember that everyone has unique preferences and desires. Ultimately, communication, trust, and mutual respect are key components of a successful relationship.

    • Understanding and Authenticity in RelationshipsAuthenticity and openness are crucial in relationships, as some women prefer men who allow themselves to be cared for and trust that the man will reciprocate. Societal influences can impact perceptions of vulnerability, but true connection requires depth and understanding beyond external images.

      Communication and understanding are key in relationships. The discussion revolves around the idea that some women might prefer men who are willing to be vulnerable and allow themselves to be cared for, as long as they trust that the man will reciprocate. The concept of societal influences, such as the perception of softness in Korean pop stars, was also touched upon. Ultimately, the importance of authenticity and openness in relationships was emphasized. While first impressions can be attractive, it's essential to consider the depth and authenticity of a person's character beyond their external image. The conversation also touched on the idea that men can't always have a hard shell and that building a relationship requires vulnerability and trust. The topic of societal influences and the perception of softness in men was explored, with the consensus being that authenticity and understanding are crucial in relationships.

    • The Dangers of Over-Relying on TechnologyOver-reliance on technology can desensitize us to physical interaction, make us forget essential skills, and leave us vulnerable when technology fails. It's essential to strike a balance and not let technology replace real-life experiences entirely.

      The constant integration of technology into our lives, as depicted in the anime, has the potential to desensitize us to physical interaction and potentially lead to a loss of humanity. The ease of use and reliance on technology can make us forget essential skills and knowledge, leaving us vulnerable when technology fails. The show's message resonates with our current situation, where we're increasingly reliant on digital devices for communication and entertainment. While technology offers numerous benefits, it's crucial to strike a balance and not let it replace real-life experiences entirely. The potential consequences of over-reliance on technology could be losing touch with our humanity and our ability to function independently.

    • The impact of technology on relationships and human connectionTechnology can make life more convenient, but it's important to remember that genuine human connection requires time, effort, and authenticity. Constant pursuit of perfection online can lead to dissatisfaction and FOMO.

      The prevalence of social media and technology has significantly changed the way we form and maintain relationships. While it may seem more convenient to gather information about someone before meeting them or to have constant access to their activities, it can also lead to a lack of genuine human connection and an excessive focus on perfection. In the past, people only knew a smaller circle of individuals, making it easier to focus on potential partners and form deeper connections. However, with the abundance of choices available online, people are less likely to compromise and more likely to overlook potential matches or friends due to perceived imperfections. This constant pursuit of perfection can lead to dissatisfaction and a sense of FOMO (Fear Of Missing Out). Ultimately, while technology can make certain aspects of life more convenient, it's important to remember that genuine human connection requires time, effort, and authenticity.

    • Exploring Individual Preferences for UnwindingPeople have different ways of unwinding from the modern world's constant stimuli, with some enjoying technology and multitasking, while others prefer silence and solitude.

      The abundance of choices and technology can lead to an overwhelming experience, while some people find comfort in silence and routine. The interviewee, who identifies as an "iPad kid," enjoys the fast-paced technology and multitasking, while another person prefers silence and solitude after a long day of cycling. They both find different ways to unwind, with the former watching mukbangs and ASMR videos, and the latter listening to silence or white noise. The conversation also touches on the idea of everyone having their unique abilities or "6th senses," with some being able to see ghosts or have exceptional reflexes. Overall, the conversation highlights the diversity of individual preferences and coping mechanisms in dealing with the modern world's constant stimuli.

    • Misunderstandings in crowded environments can lead to dangerous situationsBe aware of surroundings and avoid escalating misunderstandings to prevent unnecessary conflict

      A small misunderstanding in a crowded environment can escalate into a potentially dangerous situation. The speaker, Ryan, was nearly involved in a physical altercation after being mistakenly targeted in a mosh pit during a concert. Despite the tension, the situation was eventually diffused when the antagonist was identified and the incident was forgotten by the crowd. However, the speaker was left feeling uneasy and reminded of the potential consequences of a misunderstanding. The incident serves as a reminder to be aware of one's surroundings and to avoid escalating situations that can lead to unnecessary conflict.

    • Gender differences in conflictsMen tend to physically fight, while women hold grudges and manipulate situations emotionally.

      While both genders engage in conflicts, the nature of these conflicts can differ. According to the discussion, physical fights seem to be more common among men, while women tend to hold grudges and engage in verbal fights or "talk shit behind closed doors." The speaker also expresses concern about the potential consequences of false accusations against men in the past. Ultimately, the perception of who is more dangerous or prone to negative behaviors is subjective and can depend on individual experiences. However, the speaker believes that women can be more dangerous mentally and emotionally due to their ability to manipulate situations and relationships. The discussion also touches on the topic of infidelity, with the speaker expressing the belief that men cheat more due to societal expectations and the ease with which men can pursue sexual encounters. Overall, the conversation highlights the complexities and nuances of interpersonal conflicts and the importance of understanding the unique challenges and experiences faced by each gender.

    • Perspectives on handling infidelityPeople have varying views on infidelity, from cutting off the cheater to testing love, with some prioritizing sex and emotional connection.

      People have different perspectives on how to handle infidelity in relationships. Some believe that if someone cheats, they should be cut off completely, while others believe that it's a way to test the compatibility and love in a relationship. The conversation also touched on how modern relationships have evolved, with some people prioritizing sex and physical intimacy before emotional connection. The discussion also highlighted the importance of self-respect and confidence in making relationship decisions. However, the group acknowledged the complexity of understanding the long-term implications of infidelity and the lack of clarity for those involved. Ultimately, the group agreed that financial responsibility and a clear understanding of personal goals are crucial for managing sudden wealth, such as winning the lottery.

    • Mindset and preparation matter in managing moneyWinning large sums doesn't guarantee financial success without the right mindset and preparation. Being disciplined and prepared is crucial in various aspects of life.

      Having a disciplined approach to managing money is crucial for avoiding financial missteps, even when dealing with large sums. The speaker emphasizes that winning a large amount of money doesn't guarantee financial success if one doesn't have the right mindset. He believes that people often lose money due to their mindset and lack of preparation. The discussion also touches on the idea that sometimes not getting what we want right away might be a blessing in disguise, as we might not be ready for the blessings. The conversation then shifts to a superstition about beating oneself before important events, with the speaker sharing his personal experience. Despite the topic changes, the underlying theme remains the importance of being prepared and disciplined in various aspects of life.

    • Predicting People's Favorite Things Based on Observable TraitsPeople's preferences can be inferred from their behaviors and characteristics, even if they don't express them explicitly.

      People's preferences and likes can be detected through their behaviors and characteristics, even if they don't explicitly admit it. This was discussed during a conversation where the group tried to guess each other's favorite things based on observable traits. For instance, one person was thought to be a "hockey boy" due to his demeanor, while another was identified as a "pickle girl" based on her frequent mention of pickles. The group also acknowledged that this theory could be seen as stereotyping, but they believed that there was some truth to it. Overall, the conversation highlighted the idea that people give off certain vibes or signals based on their interests, and these signals can be picked up by others.

    • Looking Beyond Initial ImpressionsPeople's personalities can be misjudged based on first impressions. Seek out specific behaviors and actions to truly understand someone's character, and avoid making assumptions based on superficial factors.

      First impressions can be misleading, and people may give off different energies or vibes depending on the situation. For instance, someone might come across as nice based on their appearance, but their behavior in certain situations could reveal a different side of their personality. Similarly, someone might seem mean based on their tone of voice, but they could be hiding a kind and compassionate nature. It's essential to look beyond initial impressions and seek out specific behaviors and actions to truly understand someone's character. Additionally, people have unique food preferences, and these preferences can provide insight into their personalities. For example, someone who enjoys mashed potatoes might be more laid-back and comforting, while someone who prefers a fully loaded baked potato might be more extravagant and ambitious. Ultimately, it's important to approach people with an open mind and avoid making assumptions based on superficial factors.

    • Food Authenticity and Personal ExperiencesSpeakers discussed the importance of authenticity and freshness in food, sharing concerns about health risks and deceptive advertising. Hot dogs, Pogo sticks, Korean corn dogs, and pizza were among the foods discussed.

      The discussion revolves around food experiences and the perceived authenticity of certain dishes. The speakers share their opinions on various foods, including hot dogs, Pogo sticks, Korean corn dogs, and even pizza. They express concerns about the freshness and potential health risks of certain foods that may have been sitting for extended periods. The conversation also touches on the topic of food advertising and the use of deceptive practices to make dishes appear more appealing. Overall, the speakers share their personal experiences and preferences, highlighting the importance of authenticity and freshness in food.

    • Embracing new experiences and being open-mindedDespite unexpected outcomes, it's important to stay positive and encourage each other to try new things. Technology can help bridge language barriers and nostalgia can bring us closer together.

      Even in unexpected situations, it's important to embrace new experiences and be open-minded. In the discussion, a man shared a story about trying an unusual dish made with microwaved meat sauce on fries, which turned out to be the nastiest thing he had ever eaten. Despite this, the community remained supportive and encouraged each other to try new things. Another topic that came up was the use of technology and language barriers, as one person shared how they were able to communicate with someone in Tamil using messaging apps. The conversation also touched on nostalgic memories of high school and the importance of having a strong community. Overall, the discussion highlighted the importance of trying new things, being adaptable, and cherishing the connections we make with others.

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