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    #186 - Patrick Radden Keefe: The opioid crisis—origin, guilty parties, and the difficult path forward

    enDecember 06, 2021

    Podcast Summary

    • Unraveling the Opioid Crisis: A History of Purdue Pharma and Its RoleThe opioid crisis, resulting in half a million deaths in the past 25 years, involves complex interactions between pharmaceutical companies, regulators, politicians, and medical professionals. Understanding this history is crucial to finding a solution.

      The book "Empire of Pain" by Patrick Radden-Keefe sheds light on the history of Purdue Pharma and its management team, exposing the implicit and sometimes explicit corruption involved. The opioid epidemic has resulted in nearly half a million deaths in the past 25 years, making it the leading cause of accidental death in the US. This issue involves various actors, including pharmaceutical companies, intermediaries, physicians, regulators, politicians, and medical advocacy groups. While the solution to this crisis may not be easily attainable, it's crucial to understand the origins of the epidemic to address it effectively. Radden-Keefe's extensive research provides valuable insight into the opioid crisis and the players involved.

    • The Role of Purdue Pharma and the Sacklers in the Opioid CrisisThe opioid crisis has deep roots in the legal prescription drug industry, with Purdue Pharma and the Sackler family playing a significant role in its origins and evolution, contributing to the crisis through their actions and business practices.

      The opioid crisis is a complex public health issue with deep roots in both the legal and illicit drug industries. It began with the prescription of drugs like OxyContin, but evolved into a crisis driven largely by heroin and synthetic opioids like fentanyl. The crisis can be traced back to various actors in the drug supply chain, including pharmaceutical companies like Purdue Pharma and the Sackler family, distributors, regulators, prescribers, and ultimately, the patients. Understanding the role of Purdue Pharma and the Sacklers in the opioid crisis provides crucial context for the magnitude and complexity of this ongoing problem. While there are many aspects to the opioid crisis, this particular study offers valuable insights into the origins and evolution of this crisis. It's important to note that this is not the only perspective or the only book on the topic, but it sheds light on the intricate web of actors and events that contributed to the opioid crisis.

    • The Sackler family's journey from humble beginnings to the opioid crisisThe Sackler brothers' belief in education, meritocracy, and making money led them from pharmaceutical advertising to practicing psychiatry, then commerce, and ultimately to the opioid crisis with the introduction of OxyContin.

      The Sackler family, specifically the three brothers Arthur, Raymond, and Mortimer, played a significant role in the opioid crisis through their company Purdue Pharma and the introduction of OxyContin. They came from humble beginnings as immigrants in Brooklyn and were instilled with a strong belief in education, meritocracy, and the prestige of being a doctor. However, during the Great Depression, they also learned the importance of hustle and making money. This mindset led them to pharmaceutical advertising and marketing in high school, and eventually to practicing psychiatry and then commerce. The brothers were drawn to sedatives in their practice, and Arthur's pattern of taking the lead and bringing his brothers in began in high school. They ended up at Creedmore psychiatric hospital, where they were shocked by the conditions and saw an opportunity to improve patient care through medication. OxyContin, introduced in the late 1990s, was a game-changer in terms of prescription habits and ultimately contributed to the opioid crisis, despite its current classification as a heroin and fentanyl crisis. The Sacklers' story is one of ambition, hard work, and the unintended consequences of their actions.

    • From a small patent medicine company to a major pharmaceutical playerThe Sackler brothers transformed their small patent medicine company into a major pharmaceutical player through strategic advertising and later, research and development, eventually leading to the production of opioids and the opioid crisis.

      The Sackler brothers' company, Purdue Pharma, which would later become notorious for its role in the opioid crisis, started as a small patent medicine company in the 19th century. In the 1950s, Arthur Sackler, one of the brothers, made his fortune in pharmaceutical advertising and bought the company for his brothers to run. While they focused on licensing and selling over-the-counter products, Arthur's marketing genius made Librium and Valium, minor tranquilizers, the biggest selling drugs in history. The brothers grew wealthy, but it was in the late 70s and 80s that Purdue Pharma began investing in research and development, eventually moving into pain management and opioids. Despite their success, the company remained private, possibly to maintain control and avoid the scrutiny that comes with being a publicly traded corporation.

    • Family-owned structure influenced Purdue Pharma's handling of OxyContin crisisThe Sackler family's perception of Purdue Pharma as a small business led to less drastic responses to OxyContin's addictive properties and deaths compared to a public company

      The Sackler family's perception of Purdue Pharma as a small, family-owned business may have contributed to the company's handling of the OxyContin crisis differently than if it had been a public company. Prior to the 1990s, Purdue Pharma was a modest outfit, and the introduction of OxyContin transformed it into a multi-billion dollar enterprise. In the 1980s, there was a shift in the medical community to take pain more seriously and address it as a problem rather than a symptom. MS content, a morphine sulfate drug with time-released technology, was developed in this context and was a successful cancer pain treatment. Purdue Pharma saw themselves as pioneers in the pain treatment field and sponsored academic conferences to promote their cause. The development of OxyContin, a time-released version of hydrocodone, seemed like an obvious next step. However, the life cycle of a patent proved to be crucial for Purdue Pharma, as they heavily relied on the exclusivity it provided to maximize profits from OxyContin. Despite reports of the drug's addictive properties and deaths, the family-owned structure may have allowed for a less drastic response compared to what would have occurred in a public company.

    • Sackler family's marketing strategy for OxyContinThe Sackler family exploited perceived stigma and benign image of oxycodone to expand OxyContin market, manipulating doctors' perceptions through marketing tactics, leading to opioid crisis

      The Sackler family's Purdue Pharma intentionally capitalized on the perceived stigma surrounding morphine and the perceived benign nature of oxycodone to expand their market for OxyContin, a drug they knew was stronger than morphine. This strategy was reminiscent of Arthur Sackler's earlier success with minor tranquilizers like Valium, where they identified a larger market of people experiencing moderate pain and marketed a stronger drug as weaker. They manipulated doctors' perceptions of the drug through marketing tactics, and the result was a significant increase in OxyContin prescriptions and profits. The approval process for OxyContin was unusual as the company downplayed the drug's strength and potential for addiction, leading to widespread misuse and the opioid crisis.

    • Purdue Pharma's close relationship with FDA medical examinerDuring OxyContin approval, Purdue Pharma worked closely with FDA medical examiner Curtis Wright, raising questions about transparency and potential conflicts of interest in the approval process.

      During the approval process for OxyContin, Purdue Pharma worked closely with Curtis Wright, the medical examiner at the FDA, to secure both safety and efficacy approval and to establish marketing claims. This dual role of the FDA was crucial, as it not only ensured the drug was safe for public use but also determined what health conditions the medication could be marketed to alleviate. The relationship between Purdue and Wright was unusual, with the company sending him a webcam and even having a team help him write his reviews. The loss or destruction of Wright's emails raises questions about the transparency and integrity of the approval process during this time. This cozy relationship between industry and regulatory bodies highlights the importance of maintaining formalized procedures to prevent potential conflicts of interest and ensure the public's trust in the safety and efficacy of approved drugs.

    • The Complex Relationship between Pharmaceutical Companies and Regulatory AgenciesThe relationship between drug regulators and pharmaceutical companies can be compromised, raising concerns of quid pro quo arrangements. The approval process for OxyContin included a questionable claim about its abuse resistance, highlighting the need for transparency and preventing conflicts of interest.

      The relationship between pharmaceutical companies and regulatory agencies, such as the FDA, can be complex and potentially compromised. The case of Curtis Wright, a former FDA official who went to work for Purdue Pharma after approving OxyContin, raises concerns of a quid pro quo arrangement. However, it's not always clear where the lines are drawn between regulatory agencies and industry, and the potential for "soft corruption" can make it difficult to regulate. For instance, the approval process for OxyContin included a questionable claim about the drug's abuse resistance, which was never scientifically proven. This lack of transparency and potential for influence can lead to unintended consequences, such as overuse of the drug and harm to consumers. The challenge lies in finding a way to maintain talent and expertise within regulatory agencies while preventing conflicts of interest.

    • Purdue Pharma knew about OxyContin's addictive properties and abuse problem earlier than claimedDespite internal knowledge of OxyContin's addictive nature and abuse issues in the late 1990s, Purdue Pharma publicly denied any problem and continued to market the drug aggressively, contributing to the opioid epidemic.

      The officials at Purdue Pharma, the company that manufactures OxyContin, were aware of the drug's addictive properties and the resulting abuse problem much earlier than they publicly claimed. According to testimonies and emails from senior executives, there were no signs of a major problem until the early 2000s when the US attorney for Maine wrote a letter warning of the drug's danger and a crime problem associated with it. However, internal communications from the late 1990s reveal that they were well aware of the issue, with emails discussing abuse, pharmacy robberies, and the street value of the drug. Despite this, they continued to deny any knowledge of a problem and even lied under oath about it. The widespread marketing of OxyContin by hundreds of sales reps contributed to its widespread use and the resulting epidemic, but the company's denial and lack of transparency only made the situation worse.

    • The Complexity of the Opioid Crisis: Prescriptions, Sham Doctors, and Illicit AcquisitionThe opioid crisis involves various factors, including prescription addiction, sham doctors, and illicit acquisition. Understanding these paths is crucial for crafting targeted solutions.

      The opioid crisis involving OxyContin is a complex issue with various factors contributing to its spread. The drug, intended for legitimate medical use, has been abused through multiple paths: legitimate prescriptions, sham doctors, and illicit acquisition. The issue of prescription addiction is significant, with patients becoming addicted even when following doctors' instructions. The drug's design, which could be crushed for a more potent effect, unintentionally facilitated abuse. The introduction of a reformulated version that couldn't be crushed in 2010 came at a crucial time when the original patents were about to expire. Despite the Sacklers' denial, acknowledging the extent of iatrogenic addiction is crucial for addressing the crisis effectively. The distribution of addiction paths and their relative significance over time is difficult to determine, but understanding the various ways OxyContin can be obtained is essential for crafting targeted solutions.

    • Purdue Pharma's Deceptive Marketing of OxyContinPurdue Pharma knowingly downplayed OxyContin's safety risks, extended its patent life, and hid data on abuse, leading to a public health crisis and ethical dilemmas

      Purdue Pharma, the manufacturer of OxyContin, knowingly downplayed the safety risks of their opioid drug while extending its patent life to prevent generic competition. This was revealed in emails and internal studies showing that up to 25% of sales were going to people abusing the pills, even as the company publicly claimed the drug was safe for non-cancer pain. When the reformulated version was released in 2010, sales of the old pills dropped significantly, but the exact number of people transitioning from legitimate use to abuse is unknown. The moral ambiguity around this issue is compounded by the fact that many people who later developed opioid use disorders were initially prescribed the drug by doctors. A study by UnitedHealth found that hundreds of thousands of people with their insurance who were prescribed OxyContin or another Purdue opioid and later diagnosed with an opioid use disorder. However, the percentage of those individuals who were initially given a prescription is not disclosed in the filing. The complexity of this issue, combined with the fact that so many lives have been affected by OxyContin, raises ethical and legal questions that are still being debated.

    • Personal Experience with Opioid AddictionOpioid addiction can occur even when prescribed for pain relief, emphasizing the importance of proper monitoring and intervention by medical professionals.

      Even when prescribed by a legitimate doctor, opioids like OxyContin can lead to addiction, as demonstrated by the speaker's personal experience. Despite the argument that it's unlikely for pain patients to become addicted when taking the drug as directed, the speaker's story illustrates how easy it is for the dosage to spiral out of control, leading to addiction. The speaker's personal history with addiction began when they were prescribed OxyContin for pain relief after a back injury. Initially, they were prescribed a relatively low dose, but it quickly escalated to a lethal amount within just a few months. This escalation occurred without any monitoring or intervention from medical professionals. The speaker's addiction was not just driven by the physical pain but also by the psychological pain and fear of not being able to recover fully. This story underscores the importance of proper monitoring and intervention when prescribing opioids for pain management to prevent addiction.

    • Personal story of addiction to prescription opioidsAddiction is influenced by biology and environment. Misconceptions about quitting 'cold turkey' can be dangerous. Neurotransmitters and genetics play a role. Problematic marketing and distribution of prescription opioids contribute to epidemic. Holistic approach needed for treatment.

      Addiction is a complex issue influenced by both biological and environmental factors. The speaker shares his personal experience of becoming addicted to Percocet and the misconception that he could quit "cold turkey." He acknowledges his biological luck in not becoming a lifelong addict but emphasizes the importance of understanding the role of neurotransmitters and genetics in addiction. The speaker also highlights the problematic marketing and distribution of prescription opioids, including OxyContin, and the influence of pharmaceutical companies and doctors in perpetuating the opioid epidemic. Ultimately, the speaker's story underscores the need for a holistic approach to addiction treatment that considers both biological and environmental factors and prioritizes education and prevention efforts.

    • The opioid crisis: A perfect storm of circumstancesLack of knowledge among doctors, cultural emphasis on quick treatments, and pharmaceutical industry promotion led to opioid overprescription, highlighting the importance of proper pain management and addiction specialists.

      The opioid crisis can be attributed to a perfect storm of circumstances, including a lack of knowledge among doctors on how to properly manage pain and wean patients off opioids, and a cultural emphasis on quick treatments and efficiency that may lead to the overprescription of these powerful drugs. Personal stories, like the one shared, highlight the importance of having access to proper pain management and addiction specialists, and the potential consequences when such resources are not available. Additionally, simple and effective pain management techniques, like using long-acting anesthetics before surgery, can help reduce the need for opioids. The history of the pharmaceutical industry's promotion of opioids as a panacea for pain further exacerbated the issue.

    • Cultural shift towards viewing pain as the fifth vital signThe introduction of long-acting opioids was driven by a cultural shift towards prioritizing pain management, underwritten by the pharmaceutical industry, leading to overprescription and the opioid epidemic.

      The introduction of long-acting opioids like oxycontin in the late 1990s was driven by a complex interplay of factors, including a cultural shift towards viewing pain as the fifth vital sign, structural considerations in American medicine, and savvy marketing by pharmaceutical companies like Purdue. This cultural shift, which was spearheaded by various medical organizations and patient advocacy groups, was in part underwritten by the pharmaceutical industry. The idea of the fifth vital sign filled a need in the medical community, but it was also a brilliant marketing slogan that helped fuel the opioid epidemic. The medical community's earnest belief in the importance of pain management, combined with industry underwriting, created a perfect storm for the overprescription of opioids.

    • The revolving door between government and industryThe blurring of lines between public service and private gain leads to ethical dilemmas, with key players transitioning between government roles and industry, creating a culture where those supposed to uphold the law can be co-opted.

      Money and power can significantly influence individuals and institutions, leading to ethical dilemmas and the blurring of lines between public service and private gain. The opioid crisis serves as a prime example, with key players like Lyndon Barber at the DEA and Mary Jo White, former US Attorney, transitioning from government roles to working for companies at the heart of the controversy. The revolving door between government and industry creates a culture where those supposed to uphold the law can be co-opted, leading to a discouraging loss of moral clarity. The influence of money is further exemplified by the relatively small sums of money exchanged for political favors, leaving many questioning the integrity of those involved.

    • Manipulating the System: Purdue Pharma's Influence on HR 4709Powerful corporations can use influence and corruption to shape legislation, even in bipartisan settings, due to their significant financial resources.

      Those in power can manipulate the system through strategic use of influence and corruption. This was exemplified in the case of Purdue Pharma and their efforts to pass HR 4709, a bill that appeared to combat the opioid crisis but in reality opened the pipelines for opioid drugs. They accomplished this by targeting key figures and using their connections to neutralize opposition. This tactic was so effective due to the significant financial resources of the opioid painkiller industry, which spent far more on lobbying than the gun lobby. The case also demonstrated the bipartisan nature of corruption, as high-ranking officials in the Justice Department overruled lower-level prosecutors who wanted to bring felony charges against Purdue executives. The outcome was a slap on the wrist for the company, allowing them to continue generating billions in revenue and exerting influence over legislation.

    • Sackler family evades accountability in opioid crisisThe Sackler family, who profited from the opioid crisis, seek permanent immunity from lawsuits through a proposed settlement, potentially escaping accountability

      The Sackler family, who owned and ran Purdue Pharma, the company at the heart of the opioid crisis, have managed to avoid personal accountability for their role in the crisis through a series of strategic maneuvers. After pleading guilty to criminal charges in 2007 and paying a fine, they continued to extract billions of dollars from the company, leaving it bankrupt in 2019. While the company's lawsuits were suspended during bankruptcy proceedings, the Sacklers sought and were granted temporary immunity from lawsuits against them by the bankruptcy judge. Now, they are proposing a settlement that would permanently grant them this immunity, known as a non-consensual third-party release. Despite controversy and ongoing opposition from some states, it's expected that the ruling will hold up, allowing the Sacklers to escape accountability for their role in the opioid crisis.

    • Settlement with Sackler family over opioid crisisThe $4.5 billion settlement with the Sackler family may not fully address the opioid crisis or serve as a strong deterrent for future corporate misconduct.

      The $4.5 billion settlement between the Sackler family and various states over the opioid crisis may seem like a large sum, but it might not be commensurate with the damage caused. Some argue that it's a good deal for the Sacklers due to the long payment schedule and potential investment returns. However, no amount of money can bring back lives lost to addiction or overdoses. The settlement also raises questions about deterrence, as the legal system has shown a trend towards avoiding criminal charges and jail time for corporate executives, even in cases of alleged wrongdoing. Ultimately, the settlement may provide some financial relief and potentially serve as a cautionary tale, but it may not fully address the complex issues surrounding the opioid crisis or serve as a strong deterrent for future corporate misconduct.

    • The Sacklers and O.J. Simpson: Both Facing Social Repercussions for Their Roles in CrisesThe Sackler family, like O.J. Simpson, faces social and potential institutional repercussions for their roles in crises, but it's unclear if this will be a lasting stigma or if future generations will carry no shame for their actions.

      The Sackler family, similar to O.J. Simpson, is facing social and potential institutional repercussions for their role in the opioid crisis. Despite the significant number of lives lost due to OxyContin, the family shows little to no remorse and continues to maintain their innocence. The Sacklers, like O.J. Simpson, have been socially punished and their name is becoming increasingly toxic. However, it's unclear if this will be a lasting stigma or if future generations will carry no shame for their family's actions. The Sacklers' inner circle has consistently fed them a narrative of being misunderstood, and despite evidence to the contrary, they have refused to acknowledge the problem or take responsibility. Despite the availability of potential whistleblowers within the family, none have come forward. The parallels between the Sacklers and O.J. Simpson extend to the danger of delusion and disconnection from reality that comes with immense wealth and the influence of advisors and lawyers.

    • Sackler family's focus on their own plight, disconnected from opioid crisis impactThe Sacklers' emails reveal their concern for their own reputation, while ignoring the devastating impact of the opioid crisis on countless lives. Despite criticism, they lack introspection and awareness.

      That the Sackler family, despite facing criticism and the opioid crisis, shows a lack of introspection and awareness. They express a sense of persecution and grievance, even in private conversations. The family's focus is on their own plight, disconnected from the devastating impact of the opioid crisis on countless lives. The family's emails reveal their concerns about their own reputation and their children's future, while they receive emails from bereaved parents whose lives have been destroyed by opioid addiction. The author acknowledges the complexities of the issue, including the need for pain medication for those who legitimately require it, but emphasizes the importance of addressing the origins of the crisis and the unambiguous wrongs perpetrated by Purdue and the Sacklers. Although the Sacklers are no longer directly involved, the opioid crisis continues to metastasize and shows no signs of abating.

    • The Opioid Crisis: Prescription Drugs to Deadly OverdosesThe opioid crisis is a major national crisis causing accidental deaths, originating from prescription opioids, requiring more resources, destigmatization, and medically assisted treatment, and posing a fragile recovery concern.

      The opioid crisis in the United States is a major national crisis that has led to more accidental deaths than any other cause, including opioid overdoses from heroin and fentanyl. The origins of this crisis can be traced back to prescription opioids like OxyContin, which many people became addicted to before transitioning to more dangerous opioids. The path forward requires more resources, destigmatization of addiction, and the adoption of medically assisted treatment. The crisis is not going away and the fragility of recovery for individuals struggling with addiction is a concern for the future. It's important to recognize the gravity of the situation and prioritize a comprehensive and strategic approach to addressing this crisis.

    • Understanding Substance Abuse's ComplexitySubstance abuse is influenced by various factors, requires humility and empathy, and addressing it collectively is essential.

      Substance abuse is a complex issue that goes beyond the individual's control, and it's influenced by various social, situational, and atmospheric factors. These substances have immense power, making it difficult for individuals to recover even with supportive environments and resources. The speaker emphasizes the importance of being humble and mindful in the face of this problem's potency. Patrick's investigation into the opioid crisis has shed light on crucial aspects often overlooked, and his dedication to sharing the story is greatly appreciated. The membership program mentioned offers exclusive content and benefits for those interested in diving deeper into the topic. Ultimately, it's important to remember that substance abuse is a serious issue that requires understanding, empathy, and a collective effort to address.

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    • Alex Aravanis episode: liquid biopsies for cancer detection [1:01:30];
    • Colleen Cutcliffe episode: the importance of gut bacteria balance, and the potential therapeutic uses of probiotics, particularly Akkermansia [1:16:45];
    • Mark Rosekind: the significant issue of road fatalities and injuries, their causes, and practical safety measures to reduce risks [1:27:00]; and
    • More.

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    The Peter Attia Drive
    enJune 03, 2024

    #303 - A breakthrough in Alzheimer’s disease: the promising potential of klotho for brain health, cognitive decline, and as a therapeutic tool for Alzheimer's disease | Dena Dubal, M.D., Ph.D.

    #303 - A breakthrough in Alzheimer’s disease: the promising potential of klotho for brain health, cognitive decline, and as a therapeutic tool for Alzheimer's disease | Dena Dubal, M.D., Ph.D.

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    Dena Dubal is a physician-scientist and professor of neurology at UCSF whose work focuses on mechanisms of longevity and brain resilience. In this episode, Dena delves into the intricacies of the longevity factor klotho: its formation and distribution in the body, the factors such as stress and exercise that impact its levels, and its profound impact on cognitive function and overall brain health. Dena shares insights from exciting research in animal models showing the potential of klotho in treating neurodegenerative diseases as well as its broader implications for organ health and disease prevention. She concludes with an optimistic outlook for future research in humans and the potential of klotho for the prevention and treatment of Alzheimer’s disease.

    Disclosure: Peter is an investor in Jocasta Neuroscience, a company working to develop klotho as a therapy for people with Alzheimer’s disease.

    We discuss:

    • Dena’s fascination with aging and how she came to study klotho [3:30];
    • Biological properties of klotho: production, regulation, decline with age, and factors influencing its levels [11:45];
    • Potential benefits of klotho on brain health [22:00];
    • The relationship between soluble klotho protein, platelet factors, and cognitive enhancement [33:45];
    • The role of platelet factor 4 (PF4) and it’s interaction with GluN2B in mediating cognitive enhancement [46:45];
    • Benefits of klotho observed in a mouse model of Parkinson’s disease [55:45];
    • Benefits of klotho observed in a mouse model of Alzheimer’s disease [1:03:00];
    • Promising results of klotho in primate models, and the importance of finding an appropriate therapeutic dose before moving to human trials [1:08:00];
    • Speculating why a single klotho injection has such long-lasting effects [1:25:30];
    • Potential cognitive benefits of klotho in humans, the impact of the KL-VS genetic variant on klotho levels, and the need for human trials to confirm these effects [1:27:45];
    • The interaction between the KL-VS genetic variant and APOE4 and how it impacts risk of Alzheimer’s disease [1:34:45];
    • The significance of klotho levels: studies linking lower levels to increased mortality and the broader implications for organ health and disease prevention [1:47:15];
    • Measuring klotho levels and determining an individual’s KL-VS status [1:52:15];
    • The promising potential of klotho for Alzheimer’s disease treatment, and the importance of philanthropy for funding research [1:58:00]; and
    • More.

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    The Peter Attia Drive
    enMay 27, 2024

    #302 - Confronting a metabolic epidemic: understanding liver health and how to prevent, diagnose, and manage liver disease | Julia Wattacheril, M.D., M.P.H.

    #302 - Confronting a metabolic epidemic: understanding liver health and how to prevent, diagnose, and manage liver disease | Julia Wattacheril, M.D., M.P.H.

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    Julia Wattacheril is a physician scientist and director of the Metabolic Dysfunction Associated Steatotic Liver Disease (MASLD) program at Columbia University Irving Medical Center. In this episode, Julia delves deep into the complex world of liver health, beginning with a foundational overview of liver physiology. She provides an in-depth look at how alcohol impacts liver function, breaking down the metabolism of ethanol and its detrimental effects. Julia then shifts the focus to understanding liver function tests and optimal enzyme levels, providing a detailed explanation of AST and ALT and elucidating why fluctuations in these levels may or may not be concerning. She provides a primer on the four major stages of liver disease, discussing risk and emphasizing the importance of early diagnosis. Julia highlights the role of liver disease in increasing the risk of cancer and cardiovascular disease and covers in detail the various strategies for diagnosing, treating, and preventing the progression of liver disease.

    We discuss:

    • Julia’s training, the importance of liver health, and the challenges and innovations of hepatology [3:15];
    • The complex and crucial functionality of the liver, its four most essential functions, and more [8:45];
    • Liver injuries: historical and evolving understanding of causal factors, and the progression to liver diseases and cancer [13:15];
    • How the liver metabolizes nutrients and what happens in the presence of excess calories or alcohol [24:45];
    • Methods of diagnosing liver disease and how insights guide treatment and management strategies [33:30];
    • The poisonous nature of ethanol to the liver [40:30];
    • Varied responses to alcohol, damaging effects of alcohol beyond the liver, and the process of advising patients on their alcohol consumption [47:15];
    • Understanding liver enzymes AST and ALT—interpreting levels, lifestyle factors that affect them, and diagnostic approaches [58:30];
    • Interpreting liver function tests for fatty liver disease, and the challenges of diagnosing liver pathologies, particularly in children versus adults [1:13:15];
    • Comprehensive liver health assessments via imaging and various diagnostic tools to prevent overlooking potential liver pathologies [1:18:45];
    • Potential impact of recreational drugs, statins, and other medications on liver function test results [1:26:45];
    • Shifting nomenclature from NAFLD to MASLD to reflect accuracy in the underlying pathophysiology and understanding of liver diseases [1:30:30];
    • Pathophysiology of MASLD, the need for proactive screening, and the significance of liver fat percentage as an indicator of metabolic health [1:36:30];
    • The importance of screening for rare conditions alongside common metabolic diseases associated with fatty liver accumulation [1:42:45];
    • Practical strategies for managing MAFLD [1:45:30];
    • The impact of fructose consumption on liver health and the challenges of disentangling its effects from other factors like obesity and insulin resistance [1:52:45];
    • The potential of GLP-1 agonists for the treatment of MASLD [1:57:45];
    • How the four stages of liver disease have evolved [2:00:30];
    • Increased cancer and heart disease risk associated with early-stage MAFLD [2:05:15];
    • Emerging drugs and therapies for addressing fat accumulation and fibrosis related to MAFLD [2:12:15];
    • Peter’s major takeaways [2:18:45]; and
    • More.

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    The Peter Attia Drive
    enMay 20, 2024

    #301 - AMA #59: Inflammation: its impact on aging and disease risk, and how to identify, prevent, and reduce it

    #301 - AMA #59: Inflammation: its impact on aging and disease risk, and how to identify, prevent, and reduce it

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    In this “Ask Me Anything” (AMA) episode, Peter delves into the often misunderstood concept of inflammation. He first defines inflammation and differentiates between acute inflammation and chronic inflammation, the latter of which is linked to aging and a plethora of age-related diseases. Peter breaks down the intricate relationship between chronic inflammation, obesity, and metabolic health, and highlights the signs that might suggest someone may be suffering from chronic inflammation. From there, the conversation centers on actionable advice and practical steps one can take to manage and minimize chronic inflammation. He explores how diet plays a crucial role, including the potential benefits of elimination diets, and he examines the impact of lifestyle factors such as exercise, sleep, and stress management. Additionally, he discusses the relevance of food inflammatory tests and concludes by examining the potential benefits and drawbacks of drugs and supplements in managing inflammation.

    If you’re not a subscriber and are listening on a podcast player, you’ll only be able to hear a preview of the AMA. If you’re a subscriber, you can now listen to this full episode on your private RSS feed or our website at the AMA #59 show notes page. If you are not a subscriber, you can learn more about the subscriber benefits here.

    We discuss:

    • Defining inflammation (and the cultural impact of Napoleon Dynamite) [1:45];
    • Acute vs chronic inflammation [8:00];
    • The connection between chronic inflammation, aging, and age-related diseases [11:00];
    • The impact of inflammation on metabolic health [18:30];
    • Understanding and diagnosing chronic inflammation: blood tests and other approaches, and challenges with measurement [20:00];
    • Factors that contribute to low-level chronic inflammation [28:00];
    • Minimizing inflammation through diet [29:45];
    • The important role of fiber for gut health and inflammation [33:45];
    • A closer look at the impact of trans fats and saturated fats on overall health [34:45];
    • Why Peter prefers dietary fiber from food sources over supplements [38:30];
    • Debunking “superfoods”: emphasizing proven methods over marketing claims for reducing inflammation [39:00];
    • Is there any value in over-the-counter food inflammatory tests? [42:30];
    • Food elimination diets: how they work, symptoms and markers to watch, challenges and limitations [45:15];
    • Identifying dietary triggers for gut-related symptoms through low-FODMAP diets like the “carnivore diet” [51:15];
    • Dairy: the complex role of dairy on inflammation and individual responses [55:00];
    • Wheat: the complexities and conflicting evidence around wheat's inflammatory effects [57:45];
    • How exercise influences inflammation [1:02:00];
    • How sleep quality and duration impacts inflammation [1:07:00];
    • The potential impact of chronic psychological stressors on inflammation [1:13:00];
    • The impact of oral health on inflammation and overall well-being [1:15:00];
    • The role of medications in managing chronic inflammation [1:18:15];
    • Supplements: evaluating the efficacy of various anti-inflammatory supplements [1:22:15];
    • Parting thoughts and takeaways [1:27:00]; and
    • More.

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    The Peter Attia Drive
    enMay 13, 2024

    #300 - Special episode: Peter on exercise, fasting, nutrition, stem cells, geroprotective drugs, and more — promising interventions or just noise?

    #300 - Special episode: Peter on exercise, fasting, nutrition, stem cells, geroprotective drugs, and more — promising interventions or just noise?

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    In this special edition celebrating 300 episodes of The Drive, Peter discusses a variety of popular topics and health interventions and classifies them based on their level of evidence and relevance using the following categories: proven, promising, fuzzy, noise, and nonsense. Peter first delves into the topic of geroprotective molecules, covering rapamycin, metformin, NAD and its precursors, and resveratrol. Next, he explores the significance of metrics like VO2 max and muscle mass, as well as emerging concepts like blood flow restriction and stem cells. The conversation extends to nutrition, addressing questions surrounding long-term fasting, sugar consumption, sugar substitutes, and the contentious role of red meat in cancer. Peter not only provides his current stance on each topic—most of which have been covered in great detail in the previous 300 episodes—but also reflects on how his opinion may have evolved over the years.

    We discuss:

    • Defining the categories of “proven, promising, fuzzy, noise, and nonsense” [3:15];
    • Rapamycin [9:30];
    • Metformin [17:00];
    • NAD and its precursors [24:30];
    • Resveratrol [32:45];
    • The importance of VO2 max, muscle mass, and muscular strength for lifespan [38:15];
    • Blood flow restriction (BFR) training [44:00];
    • Using stem cells to treat osteoarthritis or injury [51:30];
    • Fasting as a tool for longevity (and why Peter stopped his fasting protocol) [55:45];
    • The energy balance theory [1:06:30];
    • The idea that sugar is poison [1:12:00];
    • The idea that sugar substitutes are dangerous [1:22:15];
    • The debate on red meat and cancer [1:28:45]; and
    • More.

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    Special episode with Dax Shepard: F1 and the 30th anniversary of Ayrton Senna’s death

    Special episode with Dax Shepard: F1 and the 30th anniversary of Ayrton Senna’s death

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    This is a special episode of The Drive with Peter’s friend and fellow car enthusiast Dax Shepard. In this podcast, which commemorates the 30th anniversary of the death of Brazilian Formula One legend Ayrton Senna, Dax sits down with Peter to better understand what made Senna so special and why Peter remains an enormous fan. This conversation focuses on Senna’s life, the circumstances of his death, and his lasting impact and legacy on the sport of F1.

    We discuss:

    • Peter’s interest in motorsports began as a child [2:30];
    • The drama and dangers of F1 [6:00];
    • What made Senna special [13:00];
    • What Senna meant to Brazilians [24:00];
    • The cause of the fatal crash [28:15];
    • Why Peter is obsessed with Senna [40:30];
    • Being the best versus having the best record [43:30];
    • Senna’s unique driving style and incredible intuition about automotive engineering [46:30];
    • Back to the day of the dreadful race [53:00];
    • What Peter believes caused the crash [1:02:45];
    • Views on dying young, in the prime of life [1:13:00];
    • Senna lives on in his foundation and in safety changes adopted by F1 [1:21:00];
    • Statistics aren’t enough for fandom, and why people like who they do [1:24:15];
    • The biggest difference between F1 today and F1 in the 80s [1:28:30];
    • Senna’s driving superpower [1:30:30];
    • The fastest drivers currently in F1 [1:38:30];
    • Current F1 obsessions [1:45:00];
    • How hard it is to do what the top F1 drivers do [1:50:15];
    • Dax’s love of motorcycles and his AMG E63 station wagon [1:52:15];
    • Awesome Senna mementos from Etsy [2:01:15];
    • What makes specialists interesting, and Max’s devotion to F1 [2:10:15];
    • What Senna might have done if he had not died that day [2:14:00];
    • Michael Schumacher and Max Verstappen are also top F1 drivers [2:17:30];
    • Interlagos in Sao Paulo Brazil is always an incredible experience [2:18:45]; and
    • More.

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    #299 ‒ Optimizing muscle protein synthesis: the crucial impact of protein quality and quantity, and the key role of resistance training | Luc van Loon, Ph.D.

    #299 ‒ Optimizing muscle protein synthesis: the crucial impact of protein quality and quantity, and the key role of resistance training | Luc van Loon, Ph.D.

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    Luc van Loon is an internationally renowned expert in skeletal muscle metabolism. In this episode, Luc starts with an exploration of the roles of insulin and triglycerides in endurance exercise, highlighting their impact on skeletal muscle metabolism, and he offers profound insights into the significance of protein in this context. He elucidates how different protein types and forms influence muscle protein synthesis rates, exploring the nuances of protein absorption, digestibility, amino acid quality, and their implications for performance and recovery. Delving deeper, he differentiates between animal and plant protein sources, unraveling the distinctive properties of various protein types, from the differences between whey and casein to the emerging trends in collagen protein supplementation. Moreover, Luc dissects the intricate connections among physical activity, lean muscle mass, muscle protein synthesis induced by resistance training, and dietary protein.

    We discuss:

    • Luc’s background and insights about fuel selection during exercise [3:30];
    • Fuel utilization during endurance exercise [9:30];
    • Fat metabolism, intramuscular lipids, and the nutritional dynamics of endurance sports [17:15];
    • The optimal window for replenishing intramuscular fat stores and glycogen post-exercise [25:15];
    • Luc’s interest in protein metabolism and exploration of amino acids' dual role as building blocks and signaling molecules in driving muscle protein synthesis [32:15];
    • How protein metabolism differs between sedentary individuals and those engaged in predominantly strength training or endurance training [38:45];
    • The basics of how proteins are digested and absorbed, and how muscle protein synthesis is measured [50:30];
    • How factors like food texture, cooking methods, and protein composition impact muscle protein synthesis, and the importance of protein distribution throughout the day [59:45];
    • Differences in whey and casein proteins, and the ability of ingested protein to stimulate muscle protein synthesis [1:03:30];
    • Dietary protein distribution and quantity for the maximization of muscle protein synthesis [1:09:00];
    • Muscle loss with age and inactivity and the importance of resistance exercise to maintain type II muscle fibers [1:17:15];
    • Differences between whey and casein proteins, and the importance of both quantity and quality of protein sources [1:28:30];
    • Optimizing muscle protein synthesis: exercise, timing of protein intake, protein quality, and more [1:37:00];
    • How to preserve muscle while trying to lose weight [1:46:00];
    • Anabolic resistance and overcoming it with physical activity [1:55:45];
    • Importance of protein intake and physical activity in hospitalized patients [2:06:30];
    • Reviewing the efficacy of collagen supplements [2:13:30];
    • Plant-based diets: how to ensure a balance of amino acids, and other considerations [2:20:30];
    • Future research: understanding protein metabolism in the brain [2:23:45]; and
    • More.

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