morethanamile

Mandy Anderson, co-founder of Lake Effect Kitchen in Grand Haven, Mich., talks about the ghost kitchen she and her partner started that was inspired by their children with autism and continues to provide learning and professional opportunities for differently abled individuals. 

 

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (00:00):

Welcome to More Than A Mile. Today, you're going to hear from Mandy Anderson, she co-founded Lake Effect Kitchen in Michigan. It's a catering company specifically designed to employ young adults with different abilities like her own son. Listen on to hear how it's going.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (00:17):

Welcome to More Than A Mile, a local food podcast from Market Wagon focused on connecting you to local food through farmer stories from across America. I'm Nick Carter, your host, a farmer and CEO and co-founder of Market Wagon. We are your online farmers market with a mission to enable food producers to thrive in their local and regional markets. Food is so much more than just nutrients and calories. It's actually the fabric that holds us together. And I look forward to crafting a generational quilt of farmer stories and experiences, the victories and challenges of individuals, families, and teams doing their part to help democratize food in America. Thanks for joining me for this episode of More Than A Mile, and thank you for buying local food. It's one critical step in making an investment in food for future generations.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (01:09):

Well, my guest today is Mandy Anderson from Lake Effect Kitchen. And I'm looking forward to hearing your story, Mandy.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (01:17):

Thanks for having me.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (01:17):

Thanks for joining me. So, Lake Effect Kitchen--you're from the beach side of Michigan. Grand Haven, is that correct?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (01:26):

Yep. Sunny Grand Haven.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (01:28):

Okay. Are you from there originally?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (01:30):

No, I'm originally from the Metro Detroit area. I moved over to Grand Haven in 2000. My spouse had gotten a job over here in this area and I had actually fallen in love with West Michigan when I was a college student at Hope College a few years prior to that. The beach is beautiful, people are friendly and welcoming, and it's just a nice kind of relaxing sort of vibe.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (01:54):

Do you think it's yeah, easier or better to start a small business in a smaller town? Or no?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (02:00):

I think there's challenges either way. A bigger city might have more customers for opportunity, but a smaller town--they reach out more, I think, and really try to support small businesses because we know more people, we're more connected since there's--since it's a small town kind of feel.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (02:19):

Easier to be connected in the community and have the community support you?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (02:23):

That's right.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (02:24):

Yeah. I'm a small town kid and now I live in a big city, so I'm always curious. So what sparked you and Aaron to start Lake Effect Kitchen?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (02:33):

So Aaron and I each have a child on the autism spectrum. We served for five or six years together on the Board of Autism Society of West Shore, which is now called Autism Support of West Shore, our local autism advocacy organization. So we worked together to provide support for parents living with--and people living with autism. We were working together on all kinds of like family activities, but also trying to focus on the transition age student. So your older teenage student exiting the school system or just exiting high school and needing some kind of next steps: job skills, training, paid employment. A lot of them aren't working when they're still in high school, which isn't ideal. We need to get them out into the workforce and give them those solid job opportunities. So we started looking around for what, how we could support them and what we could do personally to, you know, bring that to life. And we stumbled on a catering business for sale. We thought we'd take the plunge and just kind of go for it.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (03:43):

So Lake Effect Kitchen began with buying an existing catering business?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (03:49):

Yeah. We bought a facility that had been renovated into a kitchen and so it was in 2017 that we got started. And so the, the business that was here was doing meal prep and catering much like we're doing now. And we just sort of changed the focus a bit to be hiring and training people that have intellectual disabilities, including autism and other types of disabilities.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (04:16):

So that's a clear focus in a direction for your company is being able to teach job skills to people who are differently abled.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (04:24):

Yes. And employment equity too. We don't pay a sub-minimum wage, which is also called deviated wage. We pay a full wage to all of our employees, no matter what their disability or not disability. And we want to get them out into the community, doing our catering events, delivering food to schools or locations so that people can see that people with disabilities are able to work. They want to work. They make great employees.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (04:55):

They make great food.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (04:56):

They make great food. So, yeah, and that's a, you know, a great important point. This is the food is excellent and the people that we are employing are doing a great job learning as they go building those confidence skills and getting their first job. For most of them, this is their first job opportunity, their first job experience.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (05:19):

Some of them are working on getting their driver's licenses or moving out of their parents' home for the first time. And they might be in their mid-to-late twenties and there's, you know, but we're helping them work toward those goals as well. Work provides that--that dignity, that opportunity to earn and support yourself. And it's also a good social opportunity that we spend a lot of hours at work. And we make friends there and then that can turn into, you know, more social opportunities that they don't always find on their own, especially once they exit the school system. There isn't a lot of opportunity for that if they're not working.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (05:54):

Yeah. So you're a for-profit company, is that correct? For-profit business with a mission. That is a challenge. I know because Market Wagon is a for-profit business. We have a mission to enable food producers to thrive, and I know we constantly are coming up against situations where it might seem like it could make us more money to do something that's off mission. Do you ever come across scenarios like that where you have to make the decision to take mission over profit?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (06:26):

Definitely because some of our employees need more support and not just learning the job, but to maintain their level of job performance, just retraining and someone to come alongside them. There's a lot of situations where I could just have one non-disabled person doing the job, but I end up paying for two or three people to do that job so that we can create those opportunities for people with disabilities. So there is an additional cost involved in some of this, but I tell people--you know, I went to journalism school. My goal in life was not to be a caterer but--so, you know, the food isn't the reason for this. The mission of employment equity is the reason for that. So we try to focus on keeping our employees in their jobs and supporting that, even though it ends up more costly and hits the bottom line,

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (07:20):

The impact is the important part. And the food happens to be a means for you to be able to create that impact.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (07:26):

Correct. Yep.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (07:28):

Well, that's, that's wonderful. Thanks for sharing that. And so we've talked about the for-profit side of your business Lake Effect Kitchen, that you and Aaron created. Now, there's also a nonprofit arm, is that right? Eat Well, Do Good. And that's a nonprofit. Tell me about that.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (07:43):

Correct. We were hitting kind of some of those numbers that weren't looking as good as we'd hoped. So we tried to find how we could bring in more revenue to be able to continue to support these employees and, and bring more jobs. So we decided to start a nonprofit. We had been asked a number of times by a number of different people, why we weren't a nonprofit to begin with. And switching over was gonna be too cumbersome. So we just decided to open a new LLC. I had been using Eat Well, Do Good as sort of our hashtag tagline at Lake Effect Kitchen. So we decided to go with that for the name of the nonprofit. We got our IRS certification last summer. And so now we have the website and socials up and running. The idea behind that is to raise money, to support the mission, not just for Lake Effect Kitchen, but to hopefully be able to provide money for other small businesses in the area who might want to take a chance on hiring some of the young adults in the area with intellectual disabilities. And that way they don't have to put their own money in. We can maybe support them with three or six months worth of wages to give them a chance. And then if it's a good match and everything's working well, then they can take them onto their own payroll. And it'll be a good longer term relationship for the employer and the employee.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (09:09):

Very cool. So the two work together: Eat Well, Do Good and Lake Effect Kitchen, kind of compliment one another. And you're also then being able to help other businesses to carry on the same mission that Lake Effect Kitchen has.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (09:22):

Yes. That's the goal.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (09:24):

That's really neat. So, all right. Let's go back to the business side of things, because I love business. So ghost kitchens--would you consider yourself a ghost kitchen? Is that...?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (09:31):

Definitely. We're in a kind of a little funny corner of town. We're not in the downtown high traffic area or anything.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (09:38):

So nobody's coming to you.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (09:39):

So people do not come here. We used to have pickups for meals. When COVID hit we had to figure out what we were gonna do because we couldn't have, you know, 80 people coming in to pick up their meals every Tuesday. So we just decided to go to a fully only delivery model, which actually has worked out really well. I think people like the convenience of it. They don't have to remember that Tuesday's the day they gotta come and get their food. So there really is not much of an opportunity for people to come to the facility. We are an all production facility. We don't have like seating in front of the house type of anything. It's just, when you walk in, you are in the kitchen.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (10:19):

Now I think most people have come to know, especially in business, what a ghost kitchen is since COVID, it kind of popularized it, right? Because delivery became pretty key. And, but you started this, you, you were doing ghost kitchens before ghost kitchens were cool back in 2017. Di you call it that back then?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (10:37):

We didn't. I mean, we'd heard a few, a few people start to use that term. People have used the term commissary kitchen, incubator kitchen. There's some other terminology that people use. We weren't using it at first, but it really does do a good job describing, you know, that we are, the facility is kind of invisible. What really matters is the food is going out either to the catering events or wherever.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (11:01):

So it's all being consumed off from premise.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (11:02):

Right.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (11:03):

Okay. Well, one of the ways that it's going out is through Market Wagon, so let's talk about that real quickly. And about your menu. So if a shopper is on Market Wagon, they're gonna take some of your meals home with their local food delivery. What are they gonna find? What kind of stuff do you have out there?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (11:19):

Well, our menu changes each week. We do kind of a two month cycle. So we look at what's seasonal [for] ingredients. What kind of vegetables are available in the winter versus, you know, spring and summer? We have a couple of chefs that work on the menu together. So we'll have a couple of different soups. We'll have usually a vegetarian option or two--or a vegan option or two each week. You can order a' la carte or you can subscribe and just kind of get like a meal pack and it'll be a variety of whatever we happen to be making that week. So there's usually something for everybody. There's a whole muscle meat dish, like a, a Salisbury steak or a chicken breast meal or a pork chop kind of a meal, just a real meat and potatoes type of a thing. And then we also have handhelds--our sweet potato burrito is pretty popular.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (12:11):

Sweet potato burrito?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (12:12):

Yeah. And I'm not a vegetarian, but it is, it's an excellent meal. It's tasty. It's kind of got some new flavors that you might not get at when you think of a burrito, but yeah, the chefs are creative and they come up with some really good, some really good meal options. So there's eight to 10 things available each week. And we try to run the favorites, you know, bring the favorites around every so often. Chicken jalapeno soup is always a popular one.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (12:41):

Chicken jalapeno? What's your favorite?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (12:43):

I think chicken jalapeno is probably my favorite. It's a cream-based soup. And it's got, it's got a little bit of heat to it, but it's not too overpowering. So, you know, you don't have to go running for the pitcher of water.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (12:54):

Right. Jalapeno done right, it's got good flavor. It's not just about the heat, but--I like the flavor of jalapeno too. Yeah. People usually miss that. Okay. We talked to the beginning about your relationship in your community. Have you been able to build relationships on Market Wagon with customers that are shopping with you online too?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (13:12):

We have, we have a few customers that email us regularly and just to give us encouragement--and one person even orders our meals regularly to give out to single moms that they happen to encounter and just support other people in their community, which is a great use of our meals. We encourage that for like meal trains. I'm thinking of--I'm involved in the foster care world and we try to provide meals for foster families to kind of ease some of that burden. So we love to see when people are using our service to provide meals, not just for their own family, but for other families who might need them or just need a break.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (13:51):

And are you able to get everybody to understand what's behind the food? Like what the mission is that you are carrying out with this menu that, that it's, it's delicious food. It's good food. They should buy because it's good. But are--do you feel like people that are eating your food also understand that they're a part of carrying out this greater good for differently abled individuals that you're employing?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (14:12):

I hope so. I mean, we try to highlight some of our employees on our social media and on the Market Wagon newsfeed. We try to talk about what we're doing with the nonprofit and with some of the new things that we have going on, including the food truck that I think we'll talk about pretty soon. And just let people know that this is--it goes beyond food, great food, we all need it. It's fun and tasty and all, but the real reason behind it is to keep people working and engaged in the community.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (14:41):

Yeah. Food with the purpose. So, okay. I was getting there, tell me about your food truck.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (14:46):

So yeah, so the city of Grand Haven bought a couple of new trollies for the trolley tours that go on around here in the summertime with the tourists and everyone. And so they put the two trolleys that were now out of service up for a bid. And so a bunch of us local businesses put in bids and we were chosen to acquire one of the trolleys. We got blue trolley number four, and we are working on fundraising right now to refurbish that into a food truck. So we're gonna strip out all the seats, put in a hood system, all that good cooking equipment and everything, and hopefully be ready to roll, once the summer season starts--and start serving some food and vending out in the community,

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (15:27):

Is it seasonal? I mean, do you have a lot, like a tourist season there on the...

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (15:33):

We do. We have a very big tourist season here in Grand Haven, and we have the Coast Guard Festival. We are Coast Guard City USA. So I believe we bring in about a million people for that 10 day festival every summer, and Grand Haven is not a big place, so a million people, it is jam packed, but we have a carnival and all kinds of fun things going on.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (15:55):

So it's not a food truck, it's a food trolley.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (15:58):

Right, right.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (16:02):

Michigan's first-ever food trolley.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (16:03):

Right. Right. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's really good looking. It's blue and the woodwork inside is, is really cool looking and everything. So I think it's yeah, it's gonna be a big attention grabber, which is helpful being a ghost kitchen. We don't get a lot of attention on our actual building, which is just a converted house. So it doesn't the looks of that doesn't stand out. So hopefully the trolley is gonna be kind of a showpiece and a fun, you know, historical marker for the city and also serving some tasty food to everyone down on the beachfront in the summer.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (16:37):

So I just have these pictures of like a San Francisco trolley. I mean, do you have a bell or do you have a whistle or anything? That'll make it really fun?

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (16:44):

There is a bell. There's a string and yeah, we took it--I actually took it with some of my kids and some of our employees on a little tour around town on Sunday, just because I needed practice driving it. It's kind of big . And so we were driving around and I was having my son ring the bell while I was driving through town.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (17:01):

Did you hit anything?

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (17:02):

I didn't, I didn't even hit any curbs, which is a kind of a running joke with my family because I drive a big vehicle anyway and I do hit a lot of curbs, but I didn't this time. So I did well.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (17:14):

My trick--I drive for farming, you know--it's truck and trailer a lot and you never wanna pull--you always wanna know how you're getting out of a street when you pull into a street, when you have to put it in reverse to get back out.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (17:27):

Yeah.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (17:28):

You turn cautiously.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (17:29):

I tried to not reverse at all. Cause there's no, there's no backup camera. Right? Like my vehicle has a backup, a camera. There's no camera on this thing. , it's just this great big trolley. And it's got like even the front, it's got a cow catcher on the front. So you know, that adds a little extra length that you gotta take into account when you're making those turns.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (17:47):

That's great. Will it require any additional training or care with the staff that you work with being in a different scenario? Out into the public and under a lot of pressure, like a quick serve kitchen, it's a different kind of pressure than a ghost kitchen, right? Fast service.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (18:04):

Oh definitely. I think that it's gonna be learning curve for all of us. I've never run a food truck before. I've worked in fine dining restaurants, but I've never worked in a quick-serve type of a restaurant. So yeah, we're planning hopefully a month of training and small soft opening kind of events to get everybody up to speed. We'd also like to include an extra position for kind of a greeter person, a host for the food truck, which will be a great position for someone like my son who has autism or someone else that might not really be able to run the cash register or something like that, but can welcome people to the food truck. Talk about you know, why we're doing what we're doing, hand out a little literature or something and just sort of explain, you know, what we're serving that day, what the process is and all of that.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (18:53):

That sounds like a great way to get your message and your mission out into the community even more, so congratulations on that next venture.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (18:58):

Thanks. Yeah, it's exciting.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (18:59):

I'll follow that with interest. Okay. Well aside from looking for the bells and whistles around Grand Haven, listening for the bells, how else can our listeners find you on social media? Where are you at?

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (19:13):

We're on social media. We're on Facebook and Instagram and then we also each have a website for Lake Effect Kitchen and for the nonprofit. So LakeEffectKitchen.com and EatWell-DoGood.org.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (19:30):

EatWell-DoGood.org and Lake Effect Kitchen on Facebook and Instagram.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (19:35):

Yes. And at LakeEffectKitchen.com. Yep.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (19:39):

Okay. Well Mandy, thanks so much for joining me today.

Mandy Anderson (Lake Effect Kitchen) (19:42):

Yeah. Thanks for having me. It was fun.

Nick Carter - Host (Market Wagon) (19:50):

Thanks for listening to this episode of More Than A Mile. Be sure to sign up for Market Wagon at MarketWagon.com or after downloading the Market Wagon app for iOS or Android. Follow us @MarketWagon on Instagram, Twitter, Pinterest, and Facebook for stories, recipes, special announcements, news, and just digital handshakes from our friendly farming community. If you enjoyed More Than A Mile, please rate the podcast and write a review on iTunes, CastBox, PodChaser or wherever you listen to your favorite podcast. Thank you for continuing to support local food.

Lori Taylor, founder of The Produce Moms, joins Nick to talk about the origin story of her company, the importance of ethically serving and advocating for their audience, and working to get produce on the plates of kids (and adults) everywhere. Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (00:00):
Welcome to More Than A Mile. Today I am joined by Lori Taylor. She's an Indianapolis native who turned her solo blogging gig into a nationwide platform that earned her a seat at the table with the U.S.D.A. to make sure school lunches are healthier. I hope you enjoy it.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (00:17):
Welcome to More Than A Mile, a local food podcast from Market Wagon, focused on connecting you to local food through farmer stories from across America. I'm Nick Carter, your host, a farmer and CEO and co-founder of Market Wagon. We are your online farmers market with a mission to enable food producers to thrive in their local and regional markets. Food is so much more than just nutrients and calories. It's actually the fabric that holds us together. And I look forward to crafting a generational quilt of farmer stories and experiences, the victories and challenges of individuals, families, and teams doing their part to help democratize food in America. Thanks for joining me for this episode of More Than A Mile, and thank you for buying local food. It's one critical step in making an investment in food for future generations.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (01:07):
Well, I'm excited to have my guest today, Lori Taylor. Lori is the host of another podcast, The Produce Moms, and a lot more behind that than just the podcast, but I was able to be a guest on Lori's podcast almost exactly a year ago today, I think. And here we are. I get to put Lori in the hot seat and ask her the questions about her story. Lori say hi.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (01:31):
Hello Nick. Thanks for having me. And for all of you that are with us today, here you go. You've got two people who love a microphone in one episode. So saddle up it's gonna be a great conversation.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (01:43):
Oh man, that's a great intro. We're gonna be talking over each other the whole time. Perfect. So how long have you hosted your podcast? You--this is what episode? This is less than 10 for us. So I I think you...

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (01:58):
Yeah. We started in 2018. And so we just, you know, in terms of milestone episodes, we are you know, we recently published episode 200 and you know, we're, we're staying committed to at least our, our primary show publishes every Wednesday. And what we have learned is you know, folks are kind of leaning on us for what we call miniseries. So for instance, you know, I'm not sure Nick, when this is gonna publish, but you know, we're in the month of March right now, and we are celebrating the International Women's Month. And right now we are doing a Friday series with Nature Right Farms to spotlight women in agriculture. So yeah, I love anytime you see a Produce Moms podcast pop up on a Monday or a Friday, that means we have a really cool, special edition. So but yeah, our primary show run publishes weekly every Wednesday.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (02:54):
Cool. So The Produce Moms--tell us, but let's start with the title. Tell us what The Produce Moms is all about, what's that mean?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (03:03):
Okay. Well, it means that if someone were just to ask me, like, why did you choose The Produce Moms? Okay. So I'll, I'll tell you the real, the real definition of my business. You know, that elevator pitch, after I tell you what's in my heart about my business. So for me, you know, I truly believe that if anyone can change the world, moms can change the world. And as it relates to the consumption behaviors for the healthiest food in the world, which is fresh produce--fresh fruits and vegetables, it is a struggle that unifies all, all moms, you know, like kids are just, it is extremely difficult to get our children excited about fruits and vegetables. And frankly, it's extremely difficult for us as moms with all of the pressure that's coming our way with running our household, working outside the home, being a good mom, it's extremely difficult to you know, be deliberate about what you're putting into your own body, you know?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (04:02):
And I think that the, the rise of social media has exasperated that like mom guilt, you know, you see all these you see all these like Instagram perfect mommies. And you're like, oh my God, I am, I, I am a loser. I am fat. And my house is a pit, you know? And so that is, and so I think that all of that combined, like when I think about what The Produce Moms is all about our business, our community is simply a place for you to come. All people, you don't have to be a mom. You know, I mean, there, if you want to eat more fruits and vegetables, you are definitely in the right place when you visit TheProduceMoms.com. But you know--all of that pressure that I feel as a mom has driven me to stay steadfast with my commitment to making my business a welcoming place where all feel like they can belong.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (05:01):
And so now that, you know, I guess kind of my motivation , you know, what is The Produce Moms? Well, we're a media platform or a lifestyle brand. But we're so much more than that, you know, and I hope that as we carry on in this conversation, folks can kind of see that come to life. But our mission is to get more fruits and vegetables on every table. And I founded this business in 2012 as an employee of Indianapolis Fruit Company. I pitched it as the marketing director and then in 2015 I had the opportunity to take it off on my own. And I took that entrepreneurial leap at that time because I knew we could great things with The Produce Moms. And that is, you know--and that is exactly what we've done. We've built the number one resource on the entire internet that's fully focused on fruits and vegetables. Yeah, thank you. It feels amazing, you know, when I think about it, but I also have a tremendous amount of responsibility now, too, you know?

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (06:03):
Oh yeah. Everybody's looking to you.
Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (06:04):
Yeah. And I have to make sure that I stay true. I mentioned, you know, that I worked at Indianapolis Fruit Company. That's how I learned, you know, that's how I gained the knowledge to be a industry thought leader, to be a person who can share these facts with folks about fresh produce, the food supply chain, agriculture--it's because I worked in the supply chain myself for a whole decade. And for 10 years, I sold fruits and vegetables to grocery stores really throughout the central corridor of the United States. An 18 state region, over 300 groceries, all sizes formats. You know, I just learned so much when I was selling it and now, and one of the biggest things I learned Nick, was people don't understand fruits and vegetables, you know, I mean, even within the trade, as someone who was selling fruits and vegetables, I didn't know these brands that I was selling. I didn't have any...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (06:58):
As the seller they were just another line item on a wholesale price list for you?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (07:02):
It was just a name on a box you know. And when you consider the timeline for when I was at the sales desk, you know that 2005 to 2012, essentially--that was the, it was hit or miss with whether people even had a digital presence, you know? And they certainly..

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (07:25):
Web 1.0, right?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (07:27):
Pretty much. I mean, we were really revolutionary in 2012, launching a WordPress blog.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (07:33):
You know? So that is--but it is it's been a tremendous honor to usher in this kind of access to the, in consumer for all of the growers and supply chain stakeholders that we proudly represent. You know, it's, it's been a true honor to represent moms as we kind of push on the supply chain, like, 'Hey, get more transparent, tell us facts about farming, you know, help us answer these difficult questions.' Like we don't understand why you use pesticides and we want you to tell us why. And then, you know, I mean, those are all things that we've been able to be a real catalyst to increase education and understanding of fruits and vegetables.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (08:16):
That's really cool. I wanna talk more about that. I wanna talk about the mission that you have and how you're accomplishing it today. But first I want to go a little bit deeper into your origin story. I appreciate you sharing all of that, but so 2015, you've got a solid gig. You're head of marketing. You're at a decently large company. You've been successful and you've been there over a decade and then you leave and you go start, a what? Edutainment company, what does that look like? How does that risk, that jump out on your own, walk us through that mindset so many years ago.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (08:54):
So it's really one of my favorite stories to recount because I can't believe I had the guts to do it and I can't believe I had my family support, but 2012, I mentioned previously that's when the blog went live, you know, and we monetized it as a brand property of Indianapolis Fruit Company. We were able to get brand sponsorships, you know, ad incentives. There were a lot of different ways since we were directly tied to a procurement house, there were a lot of different ways that we were able to monetize this you know, B to C marketing that we had launched. So, you know, three years we built it together and Indy Fruit, my former employer, they supported me at the highest level. I mean, non-family member at a family-owned business. Like they empowered me to bring my idea to life. And then they supported the growth of it and we grew it to where it was self-sustaining, but it certainly wasn't like this big cash cow for the company.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (09:48):
And when you consider the supply chain of fresh food the wholesale distribution stage of the supply chain, you're talking about the middleman. Okay. I mean, like really does marketing even make sense, you know, . And so it really, it wasn't part of their core value or mission to have this whole brand that was dedicated to nothing more than marketing at the time. In 2015, when they said, 'Hey, Lori, bring your laptop and meet us at lunch. at downtown Indianapolis offsite,' I mean, I knew something was up when that happened. I was like, okay, I'm getting fired. And my husband assured me, he's like, no way you have way too many solid relationships with their vendors for where they're gonna fire you. I was like, yeah, well, something's up? And he, we agreed when I went off to work that day, something was up.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (10:39):
Side note, and for listeners, if your boss asks you to start your Monday morning at an offsite meeting

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (10:45):
Yeah, well, it was a Friday at that, so it was a Friday Nick. So even more like, oh, eyes wide, open something's coming. And...

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (10:54):
Oh geez. And so I go to this I go to Mesh On Mass in downtown Indianapolis and have this meeting with the, you know, executive vice president and the CFO of the company and myself and my laptop. And they tell me, after an awkward, you know, small talk of how are your kids let's order some salads, yada, yada then they say Indianapolis Fruit Company is done with The Produce Mom. And at the time it was singular, The Produce Mom. And I, it was just, I couldn't help it. The tears just came down. Like, I didn't know what to think about that because it was at this point, three years into this--2015, it was my only job at the company. And so my first response was, well, where does that leave me? Because that is my only job responsibility. And they said, well, we're not looking to get rid of you, but we're not going to carry forward with The Produce Mom.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (11:52):
And I was very confused. Well, they slid a legal document across the table for me to read. And it had very clearly mapped out two pathways. Pathway A was we sunset The Produce Mom, you know, the blog and the digital platform. And I basically go back to my job as a sales representative. Then option B was I could buy it, you know, and take it and do whatever I want with it. I could buy back my idea and all of my work for hire--all of the IP that we had built. And, you know, so it's 2022--you know what I chose .

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (12:33):
Wow. Red pill, blue pill, right?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (12:34):
Yeah, pretty much. And when I looked at that and I, I was like shocked, obviously...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (12:42):
Did you decide that right there over salads or did you take those two documents home and tell your husband what was up?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (12:49):
Okay. So a little bit of both. I shoved the paper because at this point I'm mad and I'm crying, you know, and I'm like, oh my God, don't let these men see you cry. You're stronger than this. Well, at this point I took the paper and I literally just shoved it back across the table. I said, 'Well, I'm buying it.' And my exact words were, I would be a caged animal going back to the sales desk and sitting in a cubicle. And they just looked at me and they were like, okay. And then they had another document that had the price and I could not believe the price. I mean, we're talking six figures. More than the home that my family and I lived in. And so at that point, I said, well, I'm gonna need to talk to Chip, who is my husband . And so I gathered my things and I left. I was like, I don't want the salad, you know...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (13:42):
I was getting ready to ask, how was the salad?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (13:44):
You know, I need to go back and give Mesh On Mass another another shot, because I have not been back to that restaurant since this day in 2015. But yeah, I gathered my things. I was pretty upset as you can imagine. And really just felt like I was at this crossroads that my family could not--like, we, I felt like we really didn't have an option, you know, like I knew where my heart was at, but we were a young family. We had two children under the age of like four years old. I was making $43,000 a year at my marketing job. Like I certainly didn't have money for a six figure acquisition. And and I did not know how we were gonna do it, but I, I knew that that's what I wanted to do.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (14:32):
And I also knew from the documentation that I had to let them know--it was April and I had to let them know by the end of May if I was planning to buy. And so I went home and we just kinda tried to figure out how can we do this? I mean, we knew considering that we were, you know, we had recently bought a home that was, you know, kind of a stretch for us. And this price point was more than our home, you know, and we had a mortgage on that home. I was like, I don't, no one's gonna loan us money. You know, we knew that. And so I cashed out my 401k and then I borrowed money from my family. And that's how we were, that was how we were able to do it. And then I will tell a quick story too, about how we negotiated the price.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (15:21):
And when I realized my husband and I are a true united front I had to go to all these, you know, smoke and mirrors meetings, where they were justifying the six figure price and going through all the documentation, trying to help me understand what it means to buy an IP portfolio, because you've got to think in 2015, we did not even have a national audience. The unique monthly, or the unique annual visitors to our website were less--like we get that number now about every 14 days on The Produce Moms. Like, you know, it is it, I wasn't buying the super robust digital, anything, you know, we had a regional audience. Less than a hundred thousand annual visitors to our website. Yeah. I did have one brand partner who told me that they gave me a verbal commit that they would stick with me, but I went to these meetings and I was--I got to the point where I was very intimidated because it was like me sitting across the table from people who were my coworkers for a decade, you know?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (16:24):
And I was like, I can't do this. I need another warm body next to me. And so I asked my husband can you come with me to this next meeting? It's really horrible. Like I had already cleared out my cubicle because they said it was for office morale. Like it didn't really make sense for me to be in the office. Like just, you know, so I'd come into the workplace just for acquisition meetings. And my husband was in the very first one that he came to me with for like maybe five minutes and he took the binder and he like slammed it, shut, shoved it across the table. And he says, what if we pay you cash in 90 days? What's the price then? And I'm sitting here thinking, 'Oh my God, we have no cash.' Like what are you talking about?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (17:03):
And so , but it did get them to slash the price in half. I mean, it was still a six figure acquisition. It was still more expensive than our home, but it wasn't as much of a risk, you know? And so that was when we cashed out my 401k, we borrowed the cash from family. And off we went, but it was, I mean, my God, I opened our business checking account with a $4,999 check from USA Pears. It was a 12 month scope of work. I mean, five grand does not pay the bills for 12 months.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (17:38):
You brought the advertisers, the brands with you, and stood this up on your own. Well, congratulations, Lori, because you are the only person I know who has ever paid your employer severance.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (17:52):
I know. And I'm looking for...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (17:53):
Person I've ever known to pay someone...

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (17:54):
I'm looking for the other

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (17:56):
...to fire you.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (17:56):
I know I'm looking for the other entrepreneur out there who also, you know, had to buy back their idea , you know, to start their business. It's not like we, you know, this is like to start my ownership journey. I had to buy my idea.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (18:12):
To buy back your own idea. Well, it's always easy to be the Monday morning quarterback, but it seems like you're glad that you did so today....

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (18:20):
Super glad I did. Yeah.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (18:21):
You were, today The Produce Moms is plural. So that it ties into your mission, right? This is not just about you as the mom, but about the moms that you serve. And, do I have this right? You were one of the first 10 in Indiana to become a B corporation.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (18:40):
Yeah. B Corp certified. We just...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (18:42):
B Corp Certified. What's a B Corp? Tell our listeners just a little bit about what that means.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (18:44):
It's a global certification. It's rooted in the United Nations Sustainable Development Goals, and it's a rigorous third party certification that essentially validates this business as a force for good, you know, they, they have, they have processes in place that are rooted in empowering their workforce, empowering their community, protecting the environment and frankly, Nick, the values of B Corp were taught to me by the industry of agriculture. You know, every farmer that we're blessed to work with and for every supply chain stakeholder that we support at The Produce Moms, these are values that they brought to life and taught to me. And the more that I learned and as I studied other brands that I really admired--brands like Patagonia or Tillamook, or even in outside of agriculture you know, brands like Eileen Fisher has a great story about how she has changed the fashion industry to being more sustainable.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (19:50):
Those are all brands that I was like, that really moved my soul. And then I realized, wow, they all have B Corp certification. What does that even mean? And then I started look into it and I was like, wow, this is exactly what I'm looking for. Because far too often, people misunderstand The Produce Moms as like, oh, this is a blog. This is an influencer. And really we do a lot more than that. And so this certification was an opportunity for me to formalize everything that we do, identify our stakeholders, validate our claims. You know what I mean? It's like super easy for me as the founder of this company to be like, oh, we're so mission driven. And you know, we're doing great things for the world. Well, when you have one of the most rigorous third party certifications come in and actually validate it then it's, it's no longer just your passion that is saying that, you know, it is actually validated and I'm not only proud to be one of the first businesses in our home state to have this, but we actually, of all the folks, all of the businesses that are B Corp certified, we have the highest impact model score.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (20:57):
So we rank high in B Corp overall, and most definitely in the state of Indiana. We're the, we're the number one in impact. So, yeah.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (21:07):
Congratulations. That's really exciting.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (21:09):
Yeah. Thank you. It's you know, March is National B Corp Month. So we look forward to having some more robust announcements about that, but there are some amazing brands that are part of this movement, you know, there's for anyone who's outdoorsy. I know I already mentioned Patagonia, but Burton, the snowboard company is. Profession Folks. You've got like Toms and Bombas and Eileen Fisher, like I said. In the ag industry, there's quite a bit in dairy that are part of this. Danone, which is a huge company of, of food brands. All of their brands at Danone are B Corp certified. So for a while, Earthbound Farm, prior to Danone selling Earthbound Farm, Earthbound Farm was B Corp certified, but their new owners did not carry forward with that certification. So it's hard. I mean, you gotta maintain it. You know, and it took us, it's a ton of work. I mean, I did the application process and the certification process in January of 2021. And we certified in March of 2022.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (22:15):
Wow. Yeah. That's a long process.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (22:18):
It's a long process.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (22:20):
Wow. So you're making an impact. You're not not just a blog, not just an influencer, but you're using your blog and your podcast and your influence to make an impact in the world, getting fresh fruits and vegetables into the hands of children. Right? Moms can impact people. Now from our perspective, you know, I talk to farmers all the time and we're talking with smaller farmers who are selling on Market Wagon. You were talking, it sounds like with produce suppliers who are at a much larger scale than a lot of the ones that I have the opportunity to deal with. And I talk a lot about relationship, relationship, relationship. They have to have a relationship with their customers. But I'm--it sounds like, you know, the values that you talk about from food producers that you work with, relationships are still key, even in your business as well, right?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (23:15):
Oh, 100%. Yeah. We, I mean, we have we have to be very particular about who we work with and the brands that we're gonna support, you know, they have to align with our values and you are right. I mean, we definitely work with the brands that you're gonna find at mass grocery retail. Yeah. And, you know, Nick, you have exposed how difficult it is for brands to get on shelf at grocery retail. So out of all the farms that we represent and support at The Produce Moms, I think the smallest one is 10,000 acres. So we're talking definitely big scale, you know.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (23:50):
But you mentioned at the beginning of our conversation, you were talking about transparency. People want to know about how they're raising even on 10,000 acres or on a hundred thousand acres, right. The customer at the grocery store wants to understand how the food was raised. How do you help food producers do that at that scale?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (24:06): Yeah. Well, thanks for the question. It is, this is one of my greatest passions. You know, people have to know, I also have a burning curiosity to know more. And as my audience at The Produce Moms grows, I have a responsibility to make sure that I always, you know, have clarity on how things are grown and the types of--from how they're treating the human capital to the environment and everything, you know, the outputs, all of that. It's all very important. It's all part of it. So we, there's a lot of ways that we demonstrate that to folks. So I've probably personally been to over 200 farm visits in the last, you know, four years throughout north, central, and south America. So obviously there's...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (24:54):
That sounds like fun.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (24:55):
Yeah. Like boots on the ground documentation. For sure. My most amazing experience was in Costa Rica with Del Monte. I went out there to support them with their 2019 sustainability initiative where they were actually formalizing their sustainability report and presenting it to the end-consumer for the first time ever. Prior to 2019, their sustainability report was something that was, you know, available as a PDF download for their shareholders. And it was never really promoted to the general population and their end-consumer. So that was probably the most tremendous experience I ever had. It also really opened my eyes up about the importance of better pricing models in the United States. You know, I mean, I, when I sat at the sales desk at, I can't tell you how many times we would sell bananas at 29 cents a pound on promo. And then I get out there to Costa Rica.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (25:49):
I'm like, oh my God, there is no reason anyone should ever be selling a banana in the United States for 29 cents a pound, you know? And so I started to see that trip changed my, that widened my lens even more where I started to see agriculture as as the industry that can have--we can break the cycles. If we do it right. I mean, so much of our food is grown, whether you're talking about rural America or, you know, the equator, you know, these tropical regions like Costa Rica. So much of our food is grown in very poor areas and it is, it is an opportunity for us, you know, I've learned through different industry involvements, whether it's the trip to Costa Rica, or I sit on the board representing the United States for Global Women Fresh, which is a, non-for-profit about female empowerment in ag. And I'm also on the board for the Equitable Food Initiative, which is about farm worker empowerment throughout the entire ag ecosystem. So these experiences combined helped me realize some critical facts. You know, if we wanna talk about something as important as, you know, female independence and, financial literacy throughout the world. Well, in most places in the world--where females are oppressed, the only job that they can actually get to earn that financial independence is within the agriculture industry.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (27:20):
And when I learned and things like that, you know, I I'm like we have to tell this to people. People have to understand the purpose of ag at a local, national, and even a global scale because we are, you know, and another thing that I'm really passionate about is, you know, like in the in the name of transparency I just found out frankly, through my B Corp journey meeting some other B Corp founders, I found out my eyes were opened wide about the chocolate industry. I did not know that the chocolate that I was buying in my home for years, people have been pushing on these big companies and it's every single one of them--every single company that's on, you know, for the most part, there's a few outliers that, you know, have tried to combat this, but they cannot guarantee that their supply chains are free of child slave labor.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (28:16):
And if you start Googling that and doing your own research, you will find the facts, but they've also, you know, these industries have done a pretty good job of, of concealing that, so I find the producers that are trying to make change yeah. In these, you know, I mean, that's a massive industry, massive global industry. And when you look at what's happening in Western Africa with boys, the same age as my children and the way that chocolate is available at scale, it's changed my point of view. And I'm like, okay, now at the, I know this, I have a responsibility with my platform to share it. And that's exactly what we did. I brought the founder of the company that taught me that I brought it on the show and we talked about it on the podcast. So I think that, I think that 95% of what we do in agriculture is best in class, but I'm never going to be someone who turns my head at the 5% where, you know, we gotta improve.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (29:10):
With your, with your platform, with the audience that you have, you have a great responsibility. And it sounds like you're taking that very seriously. Thank you. Thanks for helping to expose that kind of stuff.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (29:20):
Yeah. Thank you, Nick. Yeah. Thanks. It's an honor, you know.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (29:25):
So shift gears back to our home state, spring's coming up. So what as, as weather starts to warm up, what are you looking forward to the most of local seasonal, can only get it off of the soil here in Indiana, or the Midwest. What are you looking forward to the most of our local seasonal produce?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (29:44):
Oh, my, that is a tough question. Okay. So I love and I know that it won't necessarily be a springtime crop, but out of all of the, all of the time I spent at the sales desk, I got the most excited about two items in particular: Indiana tomatoes and Indiana cantaloupes. Like I know we're talking more. Oh yeah. I'm convinced. I have told everyone we work with, and this really, this really upsets the people in California when I'm like, the Wabash River Valley has the best tasting cantaloupes in the world. So those are my two: like Indiana field grown tomatoes, because I think even like, as we see the, the surge of indoor vertical farming and greenhouse growing, especially for vine vegetables and, and leafy greens you know, tomatoes are one of those items where a really good field grown tomato is becoming a rare find at grocery retail and...

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (30:43):
Distinctly different flavor than indoor grown or, or truck ripened. Yeah.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (30:47):
Totally. Totally. So those are my two absolute favorite things. Now, when we talk about specifically the springtime items, you know, things that I love to get in my Market Wagon delivery, frankly include like, you know, the really unique, like I love, I love all the radishes. I love like the patty pan squashes. I love the, you know, the, the fancy kales, like I, those are, I love those things. And I'm a huge believer and anyone who's had, you know, who's been able to come over and enjoy a meal with me at my home kitchen. I am--my approach to food is very simple. Find the best, most beautiful and most delicious ingredients possible and keep it simple, you know, let those ingredients shine. And so when I have the opportunity to buy something like, you know, a romanesco versus white cauliflower, I'm all in, like, I will pay the extra dollar or whatever to do that. And that is how, you know, and I can't tell you how many people have complimented, you know, meals that I've served here in my home kitchen by saying, that's the best meal I've ever had. And I'm like, and you would be amazed at how simple it is too. Like you just have to seek out fresh quality ingredients and let them shine because they will.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (32:03):
Great. Well, if people wanna learn more about that, and we've talked over and over and over again about your blog, your podcast on your website and the education that you do and the cause that you do, how can people find The Produce Moms led by Lori Taylor? How can people find you online?

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (32:18):
Well, if we aren't easy to find, then I'm not doing my job. So , you should be, we are on every social media platform. And that is why I have gray hair, because you can never keep up with that. But I--so any social platform that you are on, we are there. Our social media handle is The Produce Moms. You know, of course come to our home base. That is TheProduceMoms.com. We do have, you know, you're, you're connecting with us today through podcast. I mean, your favorite podcast platform, we're there as well. Our show is The Produce Moms Podcast. And then, you know, we have, we have email newsletters. If you're local to central Indiana and maybe soon other markets I'm on the morning show, it's called Lifestyle Live. So you can catch me on air and, you know, we'd, we'd love to connect with you in any way. And if you would like to reach out to me directly, TheProduceMoms.com, we have a contact form on our website and that contact form comes directly to my inbox. So don't be shy about reaching out if there's anything that I can do for you or anything, any request that you might have as it relates to what The Produce Moms can do for you.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (33:28):
That's great. My guest today has been Lori Taylor of The Produce Moms and check her out online, follow her podcast. And thanks so much for joining me today, Lori.

Lori Taylor (The Produce Moms) (33:38):
Nick, thank you. Keep up the great work. I'm a huge fan and there's nothing like my Tuesday delivery from Market Wagon. So thanks for all that you do. And thanks for starting this show to spotlight all the amazing growers and artisans that are part of the Market Wagon movement.

Nick Carter (Host - Market Wagon) (33:56):
Thanks, Lori. Thanks for listening to this episode of More Than A Mile. Be sure to sign up for Market Wagon at MarketWagon.com or after downloading the Market Wagon app for iOS or Android. Follow us @MarketWagon on Instagram, Twitter, Pinterest, and Facebook for stories, recipes, special announcements, news, and just digital handshakes from our friendly farming community. If you enjoyed More Than A Mile, please rate the podcast and write a review on iTunes, CastBox, PodChaser or wherever you listen to your favorite podcast. Thank you for continuing to support local food