Podcast Summary
From Musician to Soldier: An Unconventional Journey: Despite facing challenges and setbacks, the interviewee learned to adapt and find new opportunities in life
The interviewee's life has been unconventional, to say the least. He went from being a musician in bands like Nirvana and Soundgarden to becoming a soldier. His journey into music was not a planned one, but rather something he fell into at a punk rock level where making a living was unlikely. He then joined Nirvana, but found himself creatively stifled and unhappy with the situation, leading him to leave. After attempting to fulfill a childhood dream of trekking in the Himalayas, he received a call from Soundgarden, asking him to audition for their bassist position. Despite being a fan of the band, he was eventually fired. Feeling lost and in need of a change, he moved to New York and started a new life. Through all these experiences, the interviewee learned to adapt and find new opportunities when faced with challenges.
Challenging experiences lead to personal growth: Trauma and adversity are essential for growth, leading to learning, adapting, and thriving
Personal growth often stems from challenging experiences. The speaker moved to New York City at a young age to escape a difficult childhood and find new opportunities. However, losing his job in a band he loved left him feeling devastated and uncertain. Despite these setbacks, he learned to adapt and grow, eventually finding success in New York by starting over and focusing on his passions. The speaker believes that trauma and adversity are necessary for growth, just as they are in the evolution of species. Through these experiences, we can learn, adapt, and ultimately thrive.
Rediscovering Passion through New Opportunities: Embracing new opportunities can lead to personal growth, unexpected enjoyment, and the rediscovery of passions.
Sometimes taking on new opportunities, even when they seem daunting or unfamiliar, can lead to personal growth and unexpected enjoyment. For Ben Shepherd, getting asked to join Skunk on their European tour after their bassist quit was a turning point. He had taken a break from music after leaving Soundgarden due to emotional burnout. However, the low-pressure situation with Skunk allowed him to rediscover his love for performing. The challenging bass parts pushed him to improve, and the experience of touring Europe was exciting and fun. This experience led him to explore new genres and collaborate with artists he admired, such as Old Lady Drivers and John Zorn. These opportunities expanded his musical horizons and brought him joy once again. Ultimately, stepping out of his comfort zone and embracing new challenges led Ben to rediscover his passion for music.
Unexpected opportunities can lead to personal growth and success: Seizing unexpected opportunities can lead to financial stability, creative freedom, and a sense of accomplishment. Strong teams and taking risks are essential for success.
Sometimes opportunities come unexpectedly, and seizing them can lead to significant personal growth and professional success. The speaker received an offer to join a band signed to a major record label, even though he hadn't heard their music and wasn't initially excited about it. However, he saw it as a potential last chance to pursue his music career, and with the help of a friend and a professional manager, the band went on to record a successful album. The experience not only provided financial stability but also creative freedom and a sense of accomplishment. Additionally, the speaker learned to appreciate the importance of a strong team and the power of taking risks.
Band faced unexpected setbacks and financial struggles: Despite hardships, band members remained resilient and continued to pursue music careers, eventually securing a new record deal and recording an album in a new studio.
Even in the face of unexpected setbacks and financial struggles, the band members remained resilient and continued to pursue their music careers. When their record label dropped them, they were left homeless and without income, but they managed to regroup and secure a new deal. The experience was challenging, with some members living in a quirky farmhouse and surviving on unhealthy food, but they eventually bounced back and recorded their album in a new studio. The ordeal also saw some band members experimenting with drugs, but ultimately deciding to abandon their use. Through it all, they persevered and continued to make music.
Experiences shaped by band, surgery, and military family background: The speaker's experiences in a band, undergoing surgery, and being inspired by his military family background contributed to his desire for adventure and intrigue, leading him to consider joining the military.
The speaker's experiences during his time in a band, undergoing surgery, and being inspired by his military family background, all contributed to his desire for adventure and intrigue. He describes the feeling of being in the band as having a post-orgasmic bliss, weightless and wonderful, but with long-term doubts about its sustainability. His grandfather's stories of military service, particularly his grandfather who was a tank commander in World War II, ignited the speaker's interest in the military. Growing up, he was influenced by adventurous cartoons like Johnny Quest and was encouraged to explore the outdoors. These experiences shaped his desire for high adventure and led him to consider joining the military.
Childhood experiences fueled a lifelong desire for adventure and growth: Early experiences shaped his character, leading him to pursue challenging opportunities and persist through adversity to achieve his goals.
The speaker's childhood experiences, particularly his solo white water rafting adventures, instilled a sense of adventure and the desire for growth in him. Later in life, in 1993, he sought out a dramatic event to propel him into the next phase of his life and considered joining the military as an option. He was drawn to special operations units, specifically the Navy SEALs, and went to great lengths to pursue this goal, even taking the Azfab IQ test multiple times to secure a spot. Despite the challenges of basic training and the unexpected turn to the Ranger Regiment, he saw it as a necessary step in his journey towards achieving his goal.
Physical preparation played a crucial role in the speaker's military success: The speaker's determination and physical fitness helped him overcome past experiences and succeed in military training, despite rebellious tendencies
Physical preparation played a crucial role in the speaker's success during his military training. Despite his past experiences with partying and using heroin, he recognized the importance of being in good shape for the rigorous Ranger Indoctrination Program (RIP). He had a background in physical activities, having played soccer and worked on a fishing boat. The speaker's determination to keep up with the pack during RIP paid off, as he was eventually selected and went on to complete Ranger School. His enlistment ended, and he took a break from military service before eventually returning to college. An interesting twist in the story is that the speaker took his SATs on acid during high school, but a decade later, he found himself in the same room at Olympic College taking a class. This anecdote highlights the speaker's rebellious nature and his eventual change in attitude towards education. Overall, the importance of being physically prepared and determined to push through challenges was a significant factor in the speaker's success during his military career.
From astronomy class to Special Forces, unexpected experiences: Personal growth and exploration can lead to unexpected opportunities and experiences. The military provided profound experiences and a deep sense of accomplishment and gratitude.
Personal growth and exploration can lead to unexpected opportunities and experiences. The speaker shares his journey from taking an astronomy class in college, to joining the Army, and ultimately serving as a Special Forces weapon sergeant during the Iraq invasion. Along the way, he discovered a love for learning and a sense of purpose that led him to enlist. When 9-11 happened, he was in language school in the Army, and the attack served as a wake-up call that he was exactly where he was meant to be. His experiences in the military, including combat in Iraq and Afghanistan, were the most profound of his life, and he came away with a deep sense of accomplishment and gratitude for the opportunities he had been given.
Combat and warfare tap into our primal instincts: Combat fulfills our need to survive and replicate, aligns with our ability to connect intimately, and provides a sense of purpose and unity
Combat and warfare tap into our primal, instinctual nature as human beings. According to the discussion, this is due to our evolution as an adversarial species, with our brains still functioning as if we are on the Savannah. The feeling of winning a fight or completing a mission is deeply rooted in our DNA, as it fulfills our need to survive and replicate our genes. The number of people we can intimately connect with, known as Dunbar's number, aligns with the size of an infantry company, further emphasizing this connection. This pseudo kinship in combat situations is not a conscious decision, but rather a hardwired response. The discussion also touches on the idea that combat is a way for us to find purpose and unity, as we are equipped to deal with around 100 to 120 individuals. Overall, the discussion suggests that combat and warfare are deeply ingrained in our biological makeup, serving a crucial role in our survival and replication.
The paradox of war: acts of selfless love and brutality coexist: Combatants experience a sense of purpose and connection amidst unexpected brutality, acknowledging the economic significance of opium production in conflict zones, despite disconnection from mainstream media and access to information.
War and combat present an intriguing paradox, where acts of selfless love and brutality coexist. This was evident in personal experiences shared by individuals who have been in combat, as they described a sense of purpose and connection that outweighed the unexpected brutality. The speaker shared an instance from the war in Afghanistan, where he was aware of the oddity of running towards gunfire but recognized it as his training and purpose. The protection of poppy fields, which contributed to the production of heroin, added another layer of complexity to this paradox. Despite the inconsistency with the anti-drug narrative in the US, the speaker acknowledged the economic significance of opium production in the region and the potential involvement of various entities in profiting from it. The disconnection from mainstream media and access to information further complicated the situation.
Military operations in Afghanistan and opium cultivation: During military missions in Afghanistan, the speaker observed the extensive cultivation of opium poppies, reflecting on cultural differences and the complexities of the region, while staying focused on completing their mission and staying alive.
During military operations in Afghanistan, the speaker encountered the extensive cultivation of opium poppies, which was a significant source of the world's heroin at the time. Despite the corruption and rampant opium production, the speaker focused on completing their mission and staying alive, reflecting on the cultural differences and complexities of the region. The speaker also shared stories of the stark contrasts between the Western and Afghan ways of life, including the importance of family and security in Afghan culture. The historical significance of Central Asia, with its rich history dating back to ancient civilizations, added to the fascination of the experience.
Ancient Greek Presence in Central Asia and Asia Minor: The ancient Greeks, led by Seleucus Nicator, established cities and education systems in Central Asia and Asia Minor, which flourished with Greek architecture and art, but eventually fell apart due to invasions and conflicts, leaving behind a complex and intriguing history.
The ancient Greeks, specifically Seleucus Nicator, established Greek cities and education systems in Central Asia and Asia Minor, aiming for a long-term presence. These cities, such as Alexandria on the Oxus, flourished with Greek architecture and art, including Greco-Buddhist statues. However, they eventually fell apart, and some of these ancient sites, like the Buddha statues, were destroyed by later invasions and conflicts. The history of these regions is marked by the rise and fall of various empires and civilizations, showcasing the complexity and bizarreness of human civilization. Despite efforts to conquer and control these places, they continue to maintain their unique cultural identities.
The complexity of governing Afghanistan: Despite the US's best efforts, Afghanistan's unique terrain, people, and religion made it impossible to govern effectively, leading to a seemingly endless conflict. US intervention was futile due to the region's history of foreign interference and rampant corruption.
The war in Afghanistan, which lasted for two decades, was unexpected and seemingly endless. The speaker expresses a sense of relief at the eventual withdrawal, but acknowledges the futility of attempting to change the region's political and cultural dynamics. The history of foreign intervention in Afghanistan, including that of the Russians, Greeks, and the British, suggests that the area's unique terrain, people, and religion make it difficult to govern in a Western style. The speaker's libertarian perspective holds that if a country doesn't threaten US interests, then the US should not interfere. The war became an industry for some, perpetuating the conflict despite its inevitable end. The speaker recognizes the futility of the mission towards democracy and stability, and the rampant corruption that exists within the power structures. Transitioning back to civilian life after serving in such a conflict was a matter of compartmentalizing experiences for the speaker.
From military to civilian life: Adaptability and resilience: Applying military mindset of flexibility and quick thinking to civilian life led to personal growth and success. Proactivity and taking on challenges can lead to new opportunities and adventures.
Adaptability and resilience played a significant role in the speaker's successful transition from military life to civilian life. The speaker believes that the flexibility and quick thinking required in special operations helped him cope better than others who were constantly waiting for potential attacks. He applied this mindset when deciding to attend Columbia University instead of a more comfortable option, and later pursued yacht delivery work, which required similar adaptability. The speaker's experience also highlights the importance of proactivity and taking challenges head-on in personal growth. After finishing his undergraduate degree, he went through a personal crisis and traveled to Argentina for introspection. During this time, he read a book about a man who circumnavigated the world alone in a sailboat, which inspired him to take on new adventures and challenges.
From research to personal adventure: Sailing: Researching someone's background can spark new interests and lead to personal adventures, forming meaningful connections.
Personal experiences and connections can lead to new interests and adventures. The speaker's research on Robin Graham's sailing background led him to become interested in sailing himself, and eventually led to him purchasing a sailboat. This discovery also allowed him to connect with Graham and form a friendship. The speaker's background in a nautical family and living in a nautical culture further fueled his interest in sailing. Buying the sailboat was the beginning of his personal sailing adventures, with the intent of possibly circumnavigating the world. The appeal of sailing is the connection between the sailor, the boat, and the sea, requiring problem-solving and a primal connection to nature.
Emphasizing the importance of fundamentals: Focusing on fundamentals builds a strong foundation and enhances resilience, leading to personal growth and fulfillment.
Mastering the fundamentals is crucial for success in any endeavor, as it builds a strong foundation and enhances resilience. The speaker's experience in the military, specifically as a Ranger private, emphasized the importance of focusing on fundamentals and striving for excellence, even in the face of challenges. This mindset can be applied to various aspects of life, including sailing, which the speaker intends to explore further through the Race to Alaska, a wind or human-powered boat race from Washington to Alaska. By focusing on the fundamentals, individuals can overcome obstacles and grow, ultimately leading to personal development and fulfillment.
Sailing, Music, and Social Impact Project: The speaker is dedicated to combining his passions for sailing, music, and social impact through the Super Nautiloid project, which involves refitting a boat, raising funds, and collaborating with musicians.
The speaker, an adventurous and creative individual, is currently working on a sailing project called Super Nautiloid, which involves refitting a boat, raising funds, and collaborating with an eclectic group of musicians, including Grammy award-winning producer Barrett Martin. He's also producing a record featuring Icaros (songs) from the Shippibo tribe in Peru. The project combines the speaker's passions for music, sailing, and social impact. He's spent a significant amount of time and resources on this endeavor, which is a testament to his dedication and commitment. Additionally, the speaker shares his thoughts on parenthood, expressing how it can fundamentally change a person and expand their capacity for love. Despite not having children himself, he acknowledges the transformative potential of raising a family.
Understanding the Impact of Experiences on People: Recognize the complexities of human lives and value connections and experiences over material success.
Our experiences and upbringing significantly shape who we become as individuals. The speaker reflects on how understanding this perspective has made him more empathetic and charitable towards others. He sees people as having gone through various journeys to reach their current state, and recognizes the impact of both positive and negative experiences. He encourages valuing human connections and experiences over material success, as the latter does not guarantee happiness or fulfillment. The speaker's personal experience of raising children and observing their development further reinforces this belief. Overall, the discussion emphasizes the importance of recognizing the complexities and interconnectedness of human lives.
Find internal validation and empathize with others: Focus on personal relationships for joy and fulfillment, curate your tribe, and show compassion to yourself and others for a meaningful life
Focusing too much on external validation from others can lead to a hollow and unsatisfying life. It's important to find internal validation and empathize with others as we all face our own battles. As we grow older, our personal relationships grow in significance and become the source of the most joy and fulfillment in our lives. It's crucial to curate our tribe carefully and learn from our mistakes, as everyone is on a journey to be a better version of themselves. The quote "Be kind, for everyone is fighting their own battle" encapsulates this idea, reminding us to show compassion to ourselves and others. Internal validation and strong relationships are the keys to living a meaningful and rewarding life.
Learning from challenges and others: Surround yourself with like-minded individuals, have deep conversations, face challenges for self-discovery, trust in the process, and strive for personal growth and joy.
Personal growth and finding happiness in life often come from facing challenges and learning from others. Surrounding oneself with like-minded individuals and having deep, meaningful conversations can broaden our understanding and provide valuable insights. Struggle and hardship can lead to self-discovery and a more fulfilled life, even if it's not always easy or pleasant. It's important to trust in the process and have guidelines for personal growth, such as ethics, morals, and compassion for others. Ultimately, human flourishing is about striving to be the best version of oneself, and it's not just about external achievements, but also about personal growth and joy.
The Pursuit of External Validation Can Lead to a Meaningless Life: Focus on experiences and relationships for true fulfillment, not just material possessions or societal validation.
Many people get trapped in a cycle of chasing material possessions and societal validation, leading to a life of quiet desperation. They may lack the tools and experiences to seek out fulfilling journeys and instead focus on paying off debts and keeping up with the Joneses. This constant pursuit of external validation can lead to a series of false summits, with no end in sight. Ultimately, it's important to find meaning and satisfaction in experiences and relationships, rather than relying on material possessions for happiness. The Russian oligarch example illustrates the potential disaster of living a life focused solely on accumulating wealth and status, without considering the impact on others or the limited time we have on this earth.
Focus on living a good life, not just accumulating wealth: Obsessing over money can lead to an unfulfilling life. Emphasize education for personal growth and living virtuously.
Money should not be the sole focus in life. The speaker shares his experiences and observations that people who are overly fixated on accumulating wealth often lead unfulfilling lives. He emphasizes that education should be geared towards living a good and virtuous life, rather than just getting a job. The speaker also shares his personal experiences of being approached for financial obligations related to old recordings and how letting go of such matters brought him more happiness than any potential monetary gain. He concludes by expressing his gratitude for his life's journey and the lessons he has learned, despite not being a wealthy rock star. Instead, he values the experiences and personal growth that came from his music career.
Embrace challenges, focus on being true to yourself, and follow your passions: Through challenging experiences, focusing on being true to yourself, and following your passions, you can find deeper happiness and fulfillment in life.
Going through challenging experiences, even if they knock us for a loop initially, can ultimately lead to personal growth and happiness. Jason's experience as the bass player for Soundgarden brought him cool experiences and social validation, but when it was taken away, he learned to focus on being himself rather than his musical identity. This realization led him to a deeper sense of happiness and fulfillment than he had ever experienced before. Another key takeaway is the importance of following one's passions and interests, even if they seem unrelated at first. For Jason, discovering the Race to Alaska podcast through Jim Brewer's connection to Metallica led him to a new hobby and community. This experience, in turn, led him to connect with you and share his story. So, embrace challenges, focus on being true to yourself, and follow your passions – these are the keys to a fulfilling life. Jason's website is supernautiloid.com, and there's a link to the GoFundMe for the Super Nautiloid Race to Alaska 2023 on the site. If enough people contribute, a professional documentary filmmaker, Tad, will create a documentary about the race. Additionally, Jason mentioned that he had once considered writing a book and even had an agent, but ultimately decided against it. However, he still thinks writing a book might be a worthwhile pursuit, but that's a story for another time.
Maintaining the Integrity of Your Vision: Write your book first before trying to sell it, and keep the dream alive even when faced with distractions or setbacks.
The literary world, like the music industry, can have grand promises and radical suggestions when it comes to creative projects. While it's important to be open to feedback, it's crucial to maintain the integrity of your vision. The speaker learned this lesson the hard way when he tried to sell his book to an agent who wanted to make drastic changes, including suggesting a co-writer or ghostwriter. Instead, the speaker advises writing the book first and then trying to sell it. He also shared his experience of having been accepted to grad school and receiving a scholarship, which led him to put the book on the back burner but keep the dream alive. The conversation ended with the speaker expressing appreciation for the discussion and sharing his new website and logo, inspired by Black Sabbath.
