Logo
    Search

    How The Transition Away From LIBOR Is Actually Going

    enJune 04, 2020

    Podcast Summary

    • ARRC's mission: Replace LIBOR with SOFR as new benchmark rateThe ARRC, chaired by Tom Witt of Morgan Stanley, was formed in 2014 to find a replacement for LIBOR and selected SOFR as the preferred alternative due to its significant activity in the US Treasury repo market. The transition to SOFR as the new benchmark rate is ongoing.

      The Alternative Reference Rates Committee (ARRC), chaired by Tom Witt of Morgan Stanley, was established in 2014 to address the need for a durable alternative to the London Interbank Offered Rate (LIBOR) and develop a plan for transition. The ARRC selected the Secured Overnight Financing Rate (SOFR) as the preferred alternative due to its significant activity and transactions in the US Treasury repo market. The goal is to replace LIBOR, which faced issues due to the decline of the interbank market, with SOFR as the new benchmark rate. The transition process is ongoing, and the ARRC continues to work towards implementing this change.

    • Transitioning from LIBOR to SOFR: Addressing the Inverted Pyramid IssueSOFR, based on actual trades, is more transparent and reliable than LIBOR, which can be manipulated due to an 'inverted pyramid' issue. The primary challenge is ensuring a smooth transition for legacy contracts.

      The transition from LIBOR to SOFR involves addressing the issue of an "inverted pyramid" where too few transactions support too many financial contracts. This can lead to the need for expert judgment and potential manipulation. SOFR, on the other hand, is based on actual trades, making it more transparent and reliable. The primary challenge in this transition is ensuring a smooth process for legacy contracts that extend beyond the end of LIBOR in 2021. The ARC has been providing market participants with tools to facilitate this transition, including fallbacks and recommendations for pricing new contracts. SOFR is connected to the repo market through US Treasury-backed repo, which has always been a stable and risk-free market. During the financial crisis, issues arose in the repo market due to less liquid assets. The treasury repo market has been a reliable underpinning for decades. As a repo expert, Tom can explain the repo connection for SOFR in more detail and provide insights on the evolution of the repo market from before the financial crisis to the present.

    • Understanding Financial Markets through Repo MarketThe repo market, with its large daily trading volume, is an essential selection for grasping the intricacies of financial markets. Regulatory bodies like the ARC offer tools to help market participants navigate the transition away from LIBOR, such as fallback language for new issue floating rate notes.

      During the discussion, it was emphasized that the repo market, with its trillion-dollar daily traded activity, was the best selection for understanding the financial markets due to its large volume and historical significance. This choice was made in comparison to other potential options like the overnight bank funding rate or the Fed funds rate, which had significantly lower trading volumes. Additionally, the Alternative Reference Rates Committee (ARC) was highlighted for its role in providing tools to market participants to help address issues arising from the transition away from LIBOR. One specific example given was the use of fallback language for new issue floating rate notes, which has helped mitigate potential risks for investors when LIBOR ceases to exist. This language includes a series of waterfalls that replicate the difference between SOFR and LIBOR over a reasonable period of time, providing clearer outcomes for investors. Overall, the discussion underscored the importance of having a strong foundation for understanding financial markets and the role of regulatory bodies in providing solutions to market challenges.

    • Legacy financial securities without adequate fallbacks pose risksRegulators focus on embedding ARC fallback language in 'tough legacy' instruments, including floating rate notes, hybrids, and perpetuals, due to substantial exposure and risks for holders and issuers.

      While the adoption of fallback provisions for financial securities in the absence of LIBOR is widespread, particularly in the floating rate note market, there are still significant amounts of "tough legacy" securities and contracts that do not have adequate fallbacks or reference LIBOR, posing risks for both holders and issuers. These "tough legacy" instruments, which include floating rate notes issued without good fallbacks, certain hybrids, and perpetuals, among others, are a major focus for regulatory efforts to embed ARC fallback language through legislation. The size of this issue is substantial, and market participants should prioritize addressing these legacy exposures, regardless of the outcome of any legislative efforts.

    • Transitioning from LIBOR to SOFR: Addressing Concerns over VolatilityDespite concerns over SOFR's volatility, its creators emphasize its robustness and sufficient underlying volume. Market participants are expected to use SOFR on an average basis, reducing the impact of volatility spikes. Recent market events suggest SOFR may have acted as a flight to quality rate during stress periods.

      While SOFR has been identified as a potential replacement for LIBOR, concerns have been raised regarding its volatility, particularly in relation to the repo market. However, the creators of SOFR have considered these concerns and emphasized the importance of having sufficient underlying volume and robustness to ensure a successful transition. They also pointed out that most market participants are likely to use SOFR on an average basis, reducing the impact of small spikes in volatility. Recent market events have provided an opportunity to examine the performance of both SOFR and LIBOR during a stress period, and the data suggests that SOFR may have performed as expected, acting as a flight to quality rate. Overall, the transition from LIBOR to SOFR is a complex process, and it is important for market participants to carefully consider the implications of this change and the available data to make informed decisions.

    • Transitioning away from LIBOR: Key actions for market participantsMarket participants must implement ARC fallback language, prepare for SOFR discounting, avoid new LIBOR for loans/securitizations, and understand market dynamics for a smooth LIBOR transition by end 2021.

      The ongoing transition away from LIBOR is a complex process that requires careful attention to detail, particularly in the repo markets where quarter end and year end spikes are important factors. Despite the challenges presented by COVID-19, the deadline for the transition remains unchanged at the end of 2021. Moving forward, key actions for market participants include implementing ARC fallback language in floating rate notes, preparing for the switch of discounting on clear derivatives from Fed Funds to SOFR on October 16th, and avoiding new LIBOR for business loans and floating rate securitizations within six months of the transition deadline. The role of ISDA's protocol in dealing with legacy swaps is also crucial. Overall, the process of transitioning away from LIBOR necessitates a deep understanding of market dynamics and a proactive approach to implementation.

    • ARC addressing LIBOR transition challengesThe ARC is taking steps to help market participants transition from LIBOR to SOFR, including improving systems, providing guidance, and promoting acceptance of SOFR as a replacement.

      The Alternative Reference Rates Committee (ARC) is taking steps to address the upcoming transition away from LIBOR by improving legacy systems, slowing down new production, and providing guidance on the use of SOFR as a replacement. The ARC recognizes the challenges in making this transition but believes the market has the ability to correct the problem and put the financial system on a firmer footing. The use of SOFR, which is administered by the Federal Reserve and based on transactions, is becoming more accessible and widely accepted as a viable alternative to LIBOR. The ARC, which includes industry experts who have been involved in this work for years, is committed to guiding market participants through this transition and ensuring a smooth implementation of the new rate infrastructure. The responsibility to make this transition successfully lies with the industry, but the ARC is providing the necessary tools and resources to help make it happen.

    • Challenges in transitioning from LIBOR to alternative ratesMarket inertia and network effects surrounding LIBOR use, ISDA protocol to help with legacy contracts, operational challenges of implementing new protocols and fallbacks, upcoming central clearing house conversion to SOFR, and deadline pressure driving progress.

      Despite the availability and necessity of transitioning away from LIBOR to alternative rates like SOFR, the inertia and network effects surrounding the use of LIBOR in financial markets make it a challenging task. The ISDA protocol, which has been a significant source of comfort for market participants, is expected to help in dealing with legacy contracts. However, the operational challenges of implementing new protocols and fallbacks, especially when the deadline arrives, are seen as major incentives for market participants to start the transition process. The upcoming conversion of central clearing houses to SOFR discounting and the resulting hedging demand are also anticipated to push the industry towards the use of SOFR. Although the industry has been slow in making the transition, the deadline in place is expected to drive progress.

    • Transitioning from LIBOR to SOFRThe shift from LIBOR to SOFR involves agreement on the new standard and practical implementation with deadlines and language tools, but may face resistance from long-term market participants' attachment to familiar workflows and expertise.

      The transition from LIBOR to alternative benchmarks like SOFR is a massive undertaking that involves not only agreement on the new standard but also practical implementation with deadlines and language tools to ease the transition. The network effect of a large group of people changing behavior towards a new standard, even when it's a more logical choice, can still face resistance due to long-term market participants' attachment to familiar workflows and expertise. The LIBOR series on Odd Lots podcast will continue to cover the topic in depth with more episodes to come.

    • Matt Levine and Katie Greifeld launch new finance podcast 'Money Stuff'Friends Matt Levine and Katie Greifeld, known for their finance expertise, are starting a new weekly podcast 'Money Stuff' covering Wall Street finance and related topics on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and other platforms.

      Matt Levine and Katie Greifeld, friends of the Odd Lots podcast and well-known figures in the finance world, are launching a new podcast called Money Stuff. This podcast is an extension of Matt's popular finance newsletter, and it will be released every Friday. Listeners can tune in to Money Stuff on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or any other podcast platform. The podcast will cover Wall Street finance and other related topics, making it a must-listen for anyone interested in the financial world. Matt and Katie's expertise and engaging personalities are sure to make Money Stuff an exciting and informative addition to the podcast scene.

    Recent Episodes from Odd Lots

    Why Tom Lee Thinks We Could See S&P 15,000 by 2030

    Why Tom Lee Thinks We Could See S&P 15,000 by 2030

    The stock market has had a torrid run in 2024 despite the fact that interest rate cuts haven't materialized in the way people had expected at the start of the year. In fact, outside of a few blips here and there (like spring 2020), US stocks have been phenomenal performers for years. Tom Lee, the founder of Fundstrat and FS Insight has been bullish for a long time, having caught the correct side of this lengthy trend. On this episode, we speak to the former JPMorgan strategist about how he thinks about the market, what he sees happening right now in macro and demographic trends, and why he thinks it’s plausible that the market could roughly triple in the next six years.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 24, 2024

    CoreWeave's CSO on the Business of Building AI Datacenters

    CoreWeave's CSO on the Business of Building AI Datacenters

    Everyone knows that the AI boom is built upon the voracious consumption of chips (largely sold by Nvidia) and electricity. And while the legacy cloud operators, like Amazon or Microsoft, are in this space, the nature of the computing shift is opening up new space for new players in the market. One of the hottest companies is CoreWeave, a company backed in part by Nvidia, which has grown its datacenter business massively. So how does their business actually work? How do they get energy? Where do they locate operations? How are they financed? What's the difference between a cloud AI and a legacy cloud? On this episode, we speak with CoreWeave's Chief Strategy Officer Brian Venturo about what it takes to build out operations at this scale.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 21, 2024

    John Arnold on Why It's So Hard To Build Things in America

    John Arnold on Why It's So Hard To Build Things in America

    Virtually everyone, across the ideological spectrum, has the view right now that it's too hard to build things (or get things done generally) in America. New infrastructure is thwarted by red tape and permitting. New housing is thwarted by YIMBYism. Even something that doesn't require much new construction -- like NYC's attempt to impose congestion pricing -- is difficult to get done after years and years of wrangling. What is the core problem? And what can be done to address it? On this episode, we speak with John Arnold, who started his career as an energy trader at Enron, before going on to found a highly successful energy hedge fund. Now in his role as the co-founder of Arnold Ventures, he works on policy solutions to address these key bottlenecks. We discuss how he goes about philanthropy to affect policy change, the problems he's identified, and what solutions could be put in place to improve domestic development.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 20, 2024

    Evolving Money: Money Without Borders (Sponsored Content)

    Evolving Money: Money Without Borders (Sponsored Content)

    Throughout history, financial markets have struggled with the issue of borders. Borders create friction, add cost and cause headaches for anyone who wants to spend money across them. On top of that, various national currencies can be wildly unstable.

    Could a borderless, global currency ease friction and enhance financial inclusion and stability around the world? Cryptocurrencies offer an intriguing possible solution to money’s border problem. And a particular kind of cryptocurrency, called stablecoins, could become a powerful medium of exchange for international payments - and offer people around the world increased economic freedom.

    This episode is sponsored by Coinbase.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 18, 2024

    The Big Trade Underneath the Strangely Calm Surface of the S&P 500

    The Big Trade Underneath the Strangely Calm Surface of the S&P 500

    For much of this year, the S&P 500 has marched steadily higher while measures of stock market volatility, like the VIX, have stayed pretty low. But looking at the headline index only tells you part of the story. Beneath the surface of the S&P 500, individual stocks have been moving up and down a lot. And of course, traders have figured out a way to make money on the difference between the quiet overall index and all that volatility happening in individual stocks. This is the dispersion trade that's gotten quite a bit of attention in recent months. But figuring out exactly who's doing it and how pervasive it is isn't that easy. In this episode, we speak with Michael Purves, CEO and founder of Tallbacken Capital Advisors, and Josh Silva, managing partner and CIO at Passaic Partners, about this new volatility trade and what it means for the overall stock market.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 17, 2024

    What a 'Degen' Crypto Trader Really Does All Day

    What a 'Degen' Crypto Trader Really Does All Day

    A few lucky people have made generational wealth trading the ups and downs of the crypto market. And some finance professionals have shifted gears to focus primarily on the space. But what is it like to actually trade these coins day-to-day? How do people pick which ones to buy? How do they analyze the coins themselves? How do they get reliable information? And what is it like, emotionally, to trade such an infamously volatile asset? On this episode of the Odd Lots podcast, we speak with Julian Malinak. In his day job, Julian works in healthcare tech. But the rest of the time, he's looking on message boards for the next 100-bagger. At one point he had made enough to retire on. And then it all went poof. But he keeps grinding and trying to improve his craft. Julian — who we found on the Odd Lots Discord server — explains what he does all day, and how the market really works from a trading perspective. 

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 14, 2024

    How Indonesia and China Cornered the Nickel Market

    How Indonesia and China Cornered the Nickel Market

    There's been a huge change in the market for nickel, which goes into everything from electric vehicles to steel. Indonesia has grown to absolutely dominate production and now provides more than 55% of the world's supply. A lot of that is going to China, which has partnered with Indonesia to help grow its nickel industry at a phenomenal rate. Now, there are accusations that low-grade and low-priced Indonesian nickel is flooding the global market, to the detriment of other producers. Western miners like BHP and Anglo American have been shuttering their own nickel operations, and have written them down by billions of dollars in recent years. On this episode, we speak with Michael Widmer, head of metals research at Bank of America, about the sea change that's taken place in the world's nickel market and what it says about the green energy transition, as well as the scramble for other strategically important metals. We also talk about all those bullish calls on copper, and general volatility in the metals space.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 13, 2024

    Elon Musk Dominates Outer Space Like Nobody Has Before

    Elon Musk Dominates Outer Space Like Nobody Has Before

    The company that Elon Musk is most known for, obviously, is Tesla. It's been extraordinarily successful and made him one of the richest people in the world. But his true love may be SpaceX, the rocket company whose technology may one day be used in getting humans to Mars. But even if interplanetary trips are a long way off, there's no historical precedent for the sheer scale of the outer space dominance that Elon Musk has built out. Between his rockets and his satellite-based internet company Starlink, no one individual has ever completely dominated outer space this way. So where are these businesses going and how do they fit into the Elon empire? On this episode, we speak to three of our Bloomberg colleagues who have covered Musk and his businesses. First, we talk about the history and science of rockets with Bloomberg News reporter Ashlee Vance, the author of the book, When the Heavens Went on Sale: The Misfits and Geniuses Racing to Put Space Within Reach. Then we speak with Dana Hull and Max Chafkin, two of the hosts of Bloomberg's Elon Inc. podcast, about Musk's broader constellation of companies and how they all fit together.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 12, 2024

    This Is How the Food Industry Is Preparing For a Post-Ozempic World

    This Is How the Food Industry Is Preparing For a Post-Ozempic World

    The rise of GLP-1 drugs, like Ozempic, is a potentially existential threat to the makers of salty, sugary, high-calorie snack foods. But it's obvious that the gigantic food industry will search out ways to adapt. So what types of new products will they sell? How will they be flavored? How will they be packaged and marketed? On this episode of the podcast, we speak with Barb Stuckey. She is the chief innovation and marketing officer at Mattson, a San Francisco Bay Area company that helps food producers find the next big flavor. Her team recently undertook a big study of Ozempic users to get a better understanding of how it changed their diets. She speaks to us about what they learned, what new types of products are in development, and how food manufacturers find the next big thing.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 10, 2024

    Lots More with Kyla Scanlon on the Economic Vibes

    Lots More with Kyla Scanlon on the Economic Vibes

    Kyla Scanlon has a great way of identifying the economic vibes, building up a massive TikTok following with videos about the Federal Reserve, inflation, markets, and more. She also coined the viral term 'vibecession' to describe the mood of many Americans who haven't been feeling the economic growth shown in official figures. In this episode of Lots More, we catch up with the Bloomberg Opinion contributor on what the vibes are right now, what resonates on social media when it comes to economic coverage, and her new book, In This Economy? How Money and Markets Really Work.

    See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

    Odd Lots
    enJune 07, 2024

    Related Episodes

    Navigating the Beginning of the End for Libor

    Navigating the Beginning of the End for Libor

    5… 4… 3… 2… 1… The banking industry is in the final New Year’s Eve countdown to the cessation of two U.S. dollar Libor tenors, with the remainder set to cease in 2023. On the latest episode of the ABA Banking Journal Podcast — sponsored by ServiceLink — ABA’s Hu Benton provides a status update on the Libor transition and what bankers need to know. Among other topics, he discusses:

    • Where banks are in their rate transition processes
    • The latest statements and expectations from regulators
    • Libor alternatives banks are using or exploring, including SOFR, BSBY and Ameribor
    • Policy remedies for so-called “tough legacy” contracts — Libor-referencing contracts that mature after cessation but that cannot be modified to include fallback language

    EP40☆【美國CPI高於市場預期,(附連結)九日YT頻道上線啦!】(1)對於CPI怎麼解讀、(2)實質性衝擊才是分析重點

    EP40☆【美國CPI高於市場預期,(附連結)九日YT頻道上線啦!】(1)對於CPI怎麼解讀、(2)實質性衝擊才是分析重點
    https://youtu.be/WUegFvQdmvI 【可在Youtube直接搜尋『九日說白話』,就能看到影片囉】 ----- 美國公告1月份CPI達到7.5%高於市場預估的7.3%,造成最近兩天市場動盪,同時也造成在3月份Fed升息2碼的機率,市場預期達到90%以上,基本上已經是板上釘釘。 ----- 市場都在分析升息過去對股市會有什麼影響,以及市場反應完畢了嗎? 九日認為,解讀升息到底對市場會產生什麼『實質性衝擊』才是研究跟分析的重點 ----- 下週二還有生產者物價指數PPI、以及零售銷售數據公告,將會再度影響市場情緒

    EP114【外資不到兩個月賣超2700億,接下來呢】(1)中國意外降息且房產問題惡化,客觀分析實質影響是什麼?;(2)美債殖利率突破前高,外資本周又大砍700億,錢很緊?

    EP114【外資不到兩個月賣超2700億,接下來呢】(1)中國意外降息且房產問題惡化,客觀分析實質影響是什麼?;(2)美債殖利率突破前高,外資本周又大砍700億,錢很緊?
    https://youtu.be/tiRUFuvfOL8 ----- ★加入會員頻道的連結:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGUKKt5-e6VHiSwBo1ue88Q/join ----- 【會員版:我認為外資已預見暴力發債+QT的衝擊】 ★中國意外降息且房地產問題惡化,客觀分析實質的影響是什麼? ★美債殖利率突破前高,有人說長期將保持在5%,今來深度分析 ★日圓又回到先前日央干預的價格附近,接下來日央如何動作? ★外資本周又砍700億,我認為外資已預見暴力發債+QT的衝擊 ★企業破產持續成長&私人信貸&槓桿貸款&擔保貸款憑證CLO ----- 【Youtube 第七十五集】 【可在Youtube直接搜尋『九日說白話』,就能看到影片囉】

    EP110【台積電說法真的是一變再變】(1)台積電3Q營收再下修,全年預估變成-10%(法說解讀);(2)美貸款申請人遭拒的比例躍升至21.8%,信用卡利率升至22%;(3) 美股的瘋狂-用『AI消息&傳~XX發展AI』就能井噴千億美金

    EP110【台積電說法真的是一變再變】(1)台積電3Q營收再下修,全年預估變成-10%(法說解讀);(2)美貸款申請人遭拒的比例躍升至21.8%,信用卡利率升至22%;(3) 美股的瘋狂-用『AI消息&傳~XX發展AI』就能井噴千億美金
    https://youtu.be/BRpVtu1EJlY ----- ★加入會員頻道的連結:https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGUKKt5-e6VHiSwBo1ue88Q/join ----- 【會員版:台積電細節資料提供,以及看法分析,片尾有語重心長】 ★如預告:台積電3Q營收再下修,全年預估變成-10%(法說解讀) ★美貸款申請人遭拒的比例躍升至21.8%,信用卡利率升至22% ★抵押貸款利率居高不下,美國房地產市場為何未受重創? ★美股的瘋狂-用『AI消息&傳~XX發展AI』就能井噴千億美金 ★銀行業財報掃描、日債匯股解讀、準備金、台美股匯債看法 ----- 【Youtube 第七十一集】 【可在Youtube直接搜尋『九日說白話』,就能看到影片囉】

    EP65☆【股市不理但先行的債市反映】(1)裴洛西旋風式訪台,短期長期經濟面層面探討;(2)美國Fed官員放鷹股市都不想鳥,但債券市場透露出端倪;(3)台股財報掃描、美元金流掃描、債券流動性掃描

    EP65☆【股市不理但先行的債市反映】(1)裴洛西旋風式訪台,短期長期經濟面層面探討;(2)美國Fed官員放鷹股市都不想鳥,但債券市場透露出端倪;(3)台股財報掃描、美元金流掃描、債券流動性掃描
    https://youtu.be/j12rGaVRRf0 ----- 【Youtube 第二十六集】 【可在Youtube直接搜尋『九日說白話』,就能看到影片囉】 ----- 裴洛西訪台後的後續效應,經濟面半導體角度的分析 台股法說幾乎都提到去化庫存問題,義隆電、聯詠、新唐 Fed官員接連放鷹,市場無所畏懼,但匯市、債市已經開始反映 美國消費者借貸單月增加超過400億美元,創歷史第二高,代表什麼 歐債問題、美債流動性問題依然尚未退燒 Libor 升至 2008 年以來最高(最新數據2.86%)