Podcast Summary
Securing the populace in counterinsurgency warfare: Control over the battlefield is crucial in counterinsurgency, as it enables providing security and winning the hearts and minds of the local populace, which cannot be achieved through mere charitable acts.
Learning from this podcast episode between Jocko Willink and Daryl Cooper is the importance of securing the populace in counterinsurgency warfare. The decisive terrain in such wars is not an airfield, a mountaintop, or a beachhead, but the people, particularly their hearts and minds. However, providing security for the populace and winning their hearts and minds cannot be achieved through mere charitable acts like building schools or giving away food. Instead, control over the battlefield is necessary as the first step in counterinsurgency. This idea of not being able to implement counterinsurgency through mere "drive-by" efforts was emphasized by General Petraeus later. In Ramadi, where Jocko and his team were operating, they didn't have control yet, which made it challenging to provide security and win the hearts and minds of the local populace. The counterinsurgency manual, which Jocko read before anyone else, provided insights into this approach.
Questioning the status quo in complex situations: Effective leaders challenge assumptions, learn from history, and adapt strategies to overcome insurgencies by prioritizing population security.
Effective leadership in complex and challenging situations requires a willingness to question the status quo, even from a detached perspective. During a deployment to Iraq in 2006, a military leader was struck by the realization that they were losing the war based on data presented to him. This insight came after reading David Hackworth's book "About Face," which highlighted the same sentiment regarding the Vietnam War. With the American populace turning against the war and government officials expressing doubts about victory, the leader's natural rebellious streak led him to question the approach being taken. He recognized that insurgents understood the importance of time in their favor and that providing security for the population was crucial. By adopting a counterinsurgency strategy, the leader's unit began conducting overwatch operations to protect the populace and kill bad guys, ultimately shifting the tide in their favor. This experience underscores the importance of staying engaged, questioning assumptions, and understanding the unique challenges of an insurgency.
Counterinsurgency progress may not be immediately apparent: Accept initial increase in enemy activity and friendly casualties as potential signs of campaign impact, focus on long-term progress, and prioritize political effects in intergroup interactions.
When engaging in a counterinsurgency, it is normal for enemy activity and friendly casualties to initially increase rather than decrease. This can be a challenging concept to accept, especially when facing pressure from higher-ups to demonstrate effectiveness. However, it's essential to remember that a counterinsurgency campaign lasts on average for seven years, and progress may not be immediately apparent. The increase in enemy activity and casualties can be a sign that the counterinsurgency efforts are having an impact, as the enemy may respond with more attacks. Furthermore, in a counterinsurgency, everything done must be measured for both tactical and political effects. This is particularly important when entering a city with a history of sectarian tensions, as it requires convincing both sides to work together and build trust. The political aspect of intergroup interactions is crucial in this context, and understanding how to navigate these complex dynamics is key to successful counterinsurgency operations.
Recruitment drive for Iraqi police faces insurgent attacks: Despite efforts to recruit young Iraqis into police force, insurgents targeted recruitment drives, causing chaos and danger for both Iraqis and U.S. personnel.
The situation in Iraq during the time of the U.S. occupation was complex and chaotic, with various tribes and factions trying to assert control and resist insurgent groups like Al Qaeda. One attempt to unite and fight against Al Qaeda in 2005 resulted in the annihilation of many tribal leaders, causing younger, less experienced leaders to take charge or flee. The U.S. military, in an effort to help stabilize the area, organized a recruitment drive for young Iraqi men to join the police force. However, this recruitment drive was targeted by insurgents, resulting in the deaths and injuries of many recruits and U.S. personnel. This illustrates the dangerous and volatile nature of the environment, and the challenges faced by both the Iraqi people and the U.S. military in trying to bring stability and security to the region. The recruitment drive also highlights the profile of those joining the Iraqi army at the time, who were often from lower classes and lacked education, similar to those joining militias like the Mahdi Army.
Building trust with local forces during the Iraq War: During military conflicts, building trust with local forces, even if they have a controversial past, is crucial for mission success. Finding common ground and mitigating risks are essential for effective collaboration.
During the Iraq War, building trust and working with local forces, despite previous conflicts and differences, was a crucial aspect of the mission for American troops. This was evident in the presence of posters of controversial leaders like Muqtada al Sadr in Iraqi barracks, which presented challenges in establishing trust and cooperation. The complexities of working with various factions, including Sunni and Shia, as well as the presence of insurgent groups, added to the challenges. The need to mitigate risks and find common ground was essential for the success of the mission, even if it meant working with individuals who had previously been enemies. The importance of trust-building and collaboration with local forces is a valuable lesson for future military engagements.
Effective communication crucial for military success: Clear and prompt communication between military units and political leaders is essential for successful military operations and maintaining peace. Flexibility and the ability to adapt to changing circumstances are also crucial.
Effective communication and understanding between different military units and political leaders are crucial for successful military operations. In the discussed scenario, the SEAL team was prepared for a large-scale operation to retake a city, but the Iraqi prime minister requested a less kinetic approach to avoid escalating tensions. Despite initial planning and preparation for a battalion-sized operation, the team had to adjust their strategy, which required clear and prompt communication. This change ultimately led to a smaller-scale operation, but it was essential for maintaining peace and stability in the area. Additionally, the team's ability to adapt to the situation and work with Iraqi soldiers demonstrated the importance of building relationships and trust with local forces. Overall, this incident highlights the significance of effective communication and flexibility in military operations.
Challenges of distinguishing enemy from civilians in Iraq War: Using overwhelming force against Iraqi forces may have fueled insurgency, a nuanced approach with limited troops and air power could have been more effective but difficult to sell.
The enemy forces in the early days of the Iraq War were experienced and well-equipped, making it challenging for Coalition Forces to distinguish them from civilians. The absence of a clear enemy to engage in traditional combat led to the decision to use overwhelming force, which may have contributed to the insurgency that followed. A more nuanced approach, such as going in with limited ground troops and air power to draw out the enemy, might have been more effective in the long run, but it would have been difficult to sell to the American public at the time. The experience in Ramadi, where Coalition Forces did not go in with overwhelming force, suggests that a lighter approach could have been more effective in preventing the insurgency. However, selling this approach to the public would have been a challenge.
Predicting the duration of conflicts is challenging, and maintaining ally support is crucial.: The complexities of war cause numerous civilian deaths, often from local insurgents, emphasizing the need for all parties to acknowledge responsibility and learn from past mistakes.
The duration of conflicts, especially insurgencies, cannot be predicted as adversaries will continue their efforts regardless of any timeline. Additionally, the importance of maintaining the support of allies is crucial, as they need assurance that the fighting force will remain committed. The discussion also highlighted the complexities of war and its impact on civilians, emphasizing that a significant number of civilian deaths during conflicts are not caused by foreign forces but by local insurgents. It's essential to acknowledge the responsibility of all parties involved in the conflict and learn from past mistakes to minimize harm.
Understanding cultural differences for effective strategies: Adapting to local culture instead of imposing our own can lead to more productive strategies and better outcomes in cross-cultural interactions.
Imposing a naive view of how society works on cultures different from our own can lead to ineffective strategies and wasted resources. This was evident during the U.S. involvement in the Iraq War, particularly in Ramadi, where the U.S. tried to change the Iraqi army's patronage system and intelligence gathering methods. However, these practices were deeply ingrained in Iraqi culture, and attempting to change them caused resistance and inefficiency. Instead, it was more productive for the U.S. to adapt to the local culture and work with it. For instance, when the U.S. discovered that Iraqi army officers were skimming pay from enlisted men, they tried to intervene, but were met with resistance due to cultural norms. Similarly, when gathering intelligence, the U.S. saw better results when they let the Iraqis take the lead in their own way. Ultimately, it's essential to recognize and respect cultural differences to effectively work with and within different societies.
Understanding and adapting to local culture is crucial in military interventions: Instead of imposing Western structures, find common ground and build on existing cultural strengths to achieve goals in military interventions
When working with people from different cultures, especially in the context of military interventions or insurgencies, it's important to understand and adapt to the existing culture rather than trying to impose your own values or structures. Changing a culture takes generations and deep effort, and it's crucial to work with local leadership to find ways to achieve your goals within the cultural context. The speaker's experience in Iraq illustrates the challenges of implementing decentralized command or other Western military structures in a culture that has been accustomed to centralized authority. Instead, it's essential to find common ground and build on existing cultural strengths to reach the desired end state. As the speaker noted, even in the case of a long-term cultural shift like the one that occurred in Japan during and after World War II, there are still remnants of the old culture that persist. In the context of Iraq and similar situations, it's more effective to focus on understanding the local culture and finding ways to work within it rather than trying to impose external structures.
Cultural identity's impact on communities in conflict areas: Effective engagement in conflict zones requires understanding and respecting cultural identities to build trust and carry out missions.
Cultural identity plays a significant role in the dynamics of communities in conflict areas, particularly in regions with strong tribal identities. The speaker's experience in Somalia illustrates this concept, as Somalis have a deep-rooted sense of belonging to their tribes, which can be compared to the camaraderie within a SEAL team. This cultural identity has helped tribes endure through history, even as empires have come and gone. However, when outsiders attempt to engage with these communities, skepticism and resistance are common, especially in the context of recent violence and instability. The speaker shares his experience of trying to establish tribal engagement as a line of operation during the Iraq War, but found himself understaffed and unable to effectively carry out this mission due to resource constraints. The jihadists, on the other hand, have been successful in uniting larger groups of people under their ideology, making them a formidable force against tribes and other adversaries. Ultimately, understanding and respecting the cultural identities of communities in conflict zones is crucial for effective engagement and building trust.
Utilizing Unconventional Candidates in High-Pressure Situations: Incorporating diverse skills and backgrounds can lead to unexpected successes in high-pressure situations
In high-pressure situations, unconventional choices can lead to unexpected successes. During military operations, a SEAL commander found himself in need of someone to engage with local tribes. Instead of sacrificing firepower, he selected an unlikely candidate - a prior enlisted information operations officer with limited combat training and a Buddhist background. Despite his lack of experience and the dangerous environment, the officer, named JG, volunteered and began making connections with tribal leaders. The outcome was a positive one, demonstrating that diverse skills and backgrounds can contribute significantly to a team's success. This story highlights the importance of utilizing the unique strengths and expertise of each team member, even in the most challenging circumstances.
Forming alliances with locals during the Iraq War: Collaborating with locals and empowering them to take charge of their own security can be effective in conflict zones.
During the Iraq War, the Marine Corps discovered that instead of fighting against the locals, they could form alliances with them to combat the common enemy, Al-Qaeda. This led to the Desert Protector program, where the Marines provided arms and training to Sunni tribes to help them fight against the insurgents. However, when the Shia-led government took power, they banned the program, leading the Marines to rebrand it as the Iraqi police and continue their partnership. This innovative approach highlights the importance of collaboration and understanding the local dynamics in conflict zones. It also shows how effective it can be to empower local communities to take charge of their own security.
Shifting Perspective in the Iraq War: Understanding local social structures and dynamics is crucial for effective engagement and building relationships, even if local leaders have a criminal past.
During the Iraq War, a tribal leader named Sattar, who was once considered a target due to his involvement in gun smuggling, became a key figure in the Anbar Awakening. The military realized that in order to gain the trust and cooperation of local tribes, they needed to work with Sattar and other leaders, even if they had a criminal past. This shift in perspective allowed the military to form alliances and ultimately turn the tide of the war. The concept of working with local leaders, despite their past transgressions, is reminiscent of the role of organized crime groups in societies. While these groups may be seen as corrupt or criminal in more bureaucratized societies, they can serve as important social regulators in local communities. This lesson highlights the importance of understanding the unique social structures and dynamics of different cultures in order to effectively engage and build relationships.
Empowering local leaders through wasta: Effectively building relationships with local community leaders by providing them resources and authority resulted in their trust and influence, not creating puppet leaders but empowering legitimate figures.
Building relationships and providing support to local community leaders in Iraq was an effective way to gain their trust and influence. This approach, known as "wasta," involved giving them resources and authority to distribute benefits, making them more powerful and respected within their communities. This was not about creating puppet leaders or imposing American orders, but rather empowering local figures to rebuild their own countries. The example given was of a notorious gangster who became a key ally after being given civil affairs projects and funding. He was not a Manchurian candidate, but a legitimate tribal leader with deep roots in the community. This strategy was crucial in navigating the complex and informal local power structures, and it was a departure from the corporatized and bureaucratized ways of thinking common in America.
Demonstrating military success is key to winning local support: To effectively influence local populations in a conflict, military success against the enemy must first be demonstrated.
Winning the hearts and minds of local populations in a conflict requires demonstrating the ability to defeat the enemy first. This was exemplified in the Battle of Ramadi, where tribal leaders joined forces with the US military after seeing their success against insurgents. The speaker emphasized that civil affairs and hearts and minds operations can only be effective once the enemy realizes defeat is imminent. Using the metaphor of a sinking lifeboat, the speaker explained that people will naturally gravitate towards the stronger, more stable option. The Green Berets, known for their expertise in counterinsurgency, were eventually brought in to teach this concept to junior SEAL officers. Progress in the battle was not immediately apparent, but intelligence from local leaders indicated that the tide was turning, with good guys reportedly killing bad guys. This slow but steady progress was crucial in ultimately securing the city.
Instances of miscommunication led to reports of violence between tribes: A shift in loyalty and significant decrease in violence occurred when the military protected a holdout tribe from harm
During the Iraq War, there were instances of miscommunication between the military and local tribes, leading to reports of violence between tribes that were actually against insurgents. However, there was no significant reduction in overall violence during the speaker's time there. A turning point came when General McFarland chose to help a holdout tribe under attack by Al Qaeda, leading to a shift in loyalty and a significant decrease in violence. The security of the populace is a crucial tenet of counterinsurgency, as people will passive support the forces that protect them from harm. The courage of the Iraqis to rebuild their lives once they felt safe is a testament to how quickly things can change in a conflict situation.
The Complexity of War: Balancing Military Intervention and Civilian Protection: Witnessing the transformation of a war-torn city into a peaceful and prosperous one highlights the importance of military intervention, but understanding local context and potential long-term consequences is crucial.
War is a complex and brutal reality, requiring tough decisions and heavy consequences. During the Iraq War, U.S. forces faced insurgents while also trying to avoid harming civilians. The speaker shares a powerful experience of witnessing the transformation of Ramadi from a war-torn city to a peaceful and prosperous one, which made the sacrifices of American troops worthwhile. However, there is an ongoing debate about whether the U.S. presence in Iraq may have sown the seeds for future instability. Ultimately, the speaker emphasizes the importance of understanding the local context and the potential long-term impact of military intervention. As an Army first lieutenant in Rick's book put it, the Shiites could wait for the Americans to leave and then target Sunni leaders, potentially leading to renewed conflict. Despite these challenges, the speaker believes that the positive changes brought about by the U.S. presence in Ramadi, such as open markets, children playing in the streets, and girls attending school, are worth the sacrifices made by American troops.
Ramadi's turning point in Iraq War: The retaking of Ramadi from insurgents in 2006 was a critical turning point in the Iraq War, leading to the surge strategy and eventual progress towards peace and stability.
The successful retaking of Ramadi, Iraq from insurgents in 2006 was a critical turning point in the Iraq War. The local population's determination to stand up against the insurgents, coupled with the leadership of Sheikh Sitar Bazia and the effective implementation of a counterinsurgency strategy, convinced a critical mass of people in the American government that the situation could be turned around. The success in Ramadi paved the way for the surge strategy in 2007, which proved to be a good tipping point in the war. The tree of peace and stability was starting to grow, but it wasn't yet deeply rooted. The outcome of Ramadi was crucial, as losing it would have prevented the surge and any further progress in the war. The speakers, Jocko Willink and Daryl Carver, emphasized the importance of this victory and the role it played in the larger context of the Iraq War.
